Faith/Works...How much faith? How much works?

[FollowHisSteps]

gb9 is confused over nothing.

I have given you the Biblical definition of sin many times, you reject it. that is a you problem. I have not changed not one thing about the proper definition of sin, because it is NOT mine , it does NOT belong to me, I have no authority to change or manipulate it. you apparently think you do. could not be more wrong in thinking this.

as to your first post, the lie I refer to is your church's silly creed that basically states that one does not receive salvation till they are 100% sanctified ( walking just as he walked, without ever stumbling ).

total lie. one is saved when one truly believes. sanctification is a totally separate issue.

to conflate the two is a heinous mis-use of Scripture.

You miss-understand the holiness movement.
The movement is our direction is towards holiness walking in faith. It is faith that saves us,
and our goal is walking like Christ. The tension is always sanctification is an on going work
that changes us, as God continues His work in our hearts.

How far we get or our need is between us and the Lord. For me the point is the direction
of travel and not how far we are down the road. God in His divine will can complete the
work if our hearts are open and we are following. But if we lose faith and harden our hearts
then the work can never be completed.

Salvation is through this faith in Gods ability to change us and our need to obey.
So your statement about the lie is not true for me, as I have continually stated over the
months I have been here, but of course fairly representing whay I hold to is not your best
attribute. God bless you

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Report me for what? Calling you a Judaizer? One who mixes Law and Grace?
Yep. Because you are.

God has always been a moral God who follows love and righteousness.
A judaizer is specific to those who desire people to follow the whole jewish law, cermonies etc as
a jew would. The most one could fairly say is moralizer, holding to fundamental moral laws of
God.

But the desire to reject all who hold love above anything else, and explore the depths of grace
and the cross seems far from your sharing or intent. Apart from inventing hypocrisy accusations
without foundation, can you share something upbuilding and encouraging for your brothers and sisters
in Christ?

I praise God each day, He leads me to still waters, He bathes me in His love and righteousness, He cleanses
and heals my soul through His blood and body shed upon the Cross, and I find healing and forgiveness under
the shadow of His wings. Thank you Jesus that you word is Eternal and knows no end, and you turn the words
of sinners into healing balms of encouragement and grace, Amen.

 

[Macabeus]

The intercession is for our earthly walk. For strength, for chastisement when needed, or mercy in regard to that chastisement in accordance to God's will, for healing of the body, etc. When we sin in the flesh, and we are accused by the Devil before the throne, the intercession of Jesus reminds Satan that he no longer has a hold on us. Our sins are completely paid for.

I am holy, righteous, sinless, and perfect through imputation. My New Nature.

Old Nature = sinful and cannot stop sinning.

New Nature (Christ's) = His very nature in us. The one that does not, nor can sin. The one we now are judged righteous by.

This is Sunday school knowledge. Did you not go?

Book, chapter, and verse for the parts in red, please.

 

[Macabeus]

Report me for what? Calling you a Judaizer? One who mixes Law and Grace?

Yep. Because you are.

Reported again

Where did I teach Torah keeping, false accuser?

Your crew is a bunch of false accusers. DC accuses Argueless of saying something he didn't say. GB9 accuses me of being a legalist, you accuse me of being a Judaizer, Undergrace accuses me of saying we retain our own salvation.

I have been told by numerous people that that is what you guys always do.

All false.

 

[gb9]

You miss-understand the holiness movement.
The movement is our direction is towards holiness walking in faith. It is faith that saves us,
and our goal is walking like Christ. The tension is always sanctification is an on going work
that changes us, as God continues His work in our hearts.

How far we get or our need is between us and the Lord. For me the point is the direction
of travel and not how far we are down the road. God in His divine will can complete the
work if our hearts are open and we are following. But if we lose faith and harden our hearts
then the work can never be completed.

Salvation is through this faith in Gods ability to change us and our need to obey.
So your statement about the lie is not true for me, as I have continually stated over the
months I have been here, but of course fairly representing whay I hold to is not your best
attribute. God bless you

I do not really disagree with this, but you still talked around salvation by faith in Christ only.

does one get saved the moment they truly believe, and then what you posted happens over time, obedience is supposed to be getting better as time goes by.
yes or no??

 

[Macabeus]

Reported again

Where did I teach Torah keeping, false accuser?

Your crew is a bunch of false accusers. DC accuses Argueless of saying something he didn't say. GB9 accuses me of being a legalist, you accuse me of being a Judaizer, Undergrace accuses me of saying we retain our own salvation.

I have been told by numerous people that that is what you guys always do.

All false.

I retract the portion in red, particularly the part about GB9 and Undergrace, and apologize for including them in this denouncement. At least with these two, our conflicts appear to have been based on misunderstandings.

My apologies, GB9 and Undergrace

 

[Macabeus]

Reported again

Where did I teach Torah keeping, false accuser?

Your crew is a bunch of false accusers. DC accuses Argueless of saying something he didn't say. GB9 accuses me of being a legalist, you accuse me of being a Judaizer, Undergrace accuses me of saying we retain our own salvation.

I have been told by numerous people that that is what you guys always do.

All false.

Edit

I retract the portion in red, particularly the part about GB9 and Undergrace, and apologize for including them in this denouncement. At least with these two, the conflicts between they and I appear to have been based on misunderstanding each other.

My apologies, GB9 and Undergrace

 

[Oncefallen]

Post 558 clearly shows that Argueless did not say what DC said he did. And Argueless got banned.

If you are in some way implying that you know why another user to get banned you are inherently wrong. Unless I told you (and I didn't), you have no idea why another user was banned.

 

[Guojing]

This debate is so interesting. All of us are willfully sinning without even realizing it. According to the Law,

What is not of faith is of sin Romans 14:23
If you know what is good and you don't do it, that is sin James 4:17

Any husband here loves his wife as Christ love the church?
Any wife loves her husband until she reverence him? Ephesians 5:33

That is sin, and we commit sin every day in so many ways. We tend to think in terms of big sins and little sins, but according to James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

So if you want to be strict about it, everyone of us are a slave to sin under the Law, if you define sin as a verb.

Fortunately however, Paul taught us that it is sin as a noun that we have died to, and we are no longer under Law.

 

[Macabeus]

If you are in some way implying that you know why another user to get banned you are inherently wrong. Unless I told you (and I didn't), you have no idea why another user was banned.

You're right. I don't know why Argueless got banned. I apologize

OK, but the fact remains that Argueless did not accuse DC of lying to the Holy Spirit. The evidence I presented is irrefutable.

and there is a lot of lying and false accusations around here, I have been called a legalist, a judaizer, a hypocrite, etc. I thought personal attacks were against the rules.

Dcontroversal just called me blind about an hour ago because I said (in agreement with the Bible) that Christians are not slaves to sin.

 

[gb9]

You're right. I don't know why Argueless got banned. I apologize

OK, but the fact remains that Argueless did not accuse DC of lying to the Holy Spirit. The evidence I presented is irrefutable.

and there is a lot of lying and false accusations around here, I have been called a legalist, a judaizer, a hypocrite, etc. I thought personal attacks were against the rules.

Dcontroversal just called me blind about an hour ago because I said (in agreement with the Bible) that Christians are not slaves to sin.

look, you and I are not friends, let's be straight here, as a guy who has been here for 8+ year, I advise you to let this go.

if you want put dcon and budman on ignore, and I feel they will let you be.

 

[Macabeus]

look, you and I are not friends, let's be straight here, but if you, as a guy who has been here for 8+ year, I advise you to let this go.

if you want put dcon and budman on ignore, and I feel they will let you be.

I doubt it. I wasnt talking to Budman and he accosted me, trying to say I am a slave to sin and all that.

And I am not here to make friends of judgemental people like you who call me a legalist because I believe that ANY believer can bear fruit.

...and says that I put a time limit on it when I didn't.

 

[Macabeus]

look, you and I are not friends, let's be straight here, as a guy who has been here for 8+ year, I advise you to let this go.

if you want put dcon and budman on ignore, and I feel they will let you be.

...and I was having a perfectly nice, civil conversation with Undergrace, who I found out is quite charming, and DC butted in and called me blind for saying a person does not follow the Spirit and follow the flesh at the same time, that we must daily make a choice which one we follow/walk after.

SO what makes you think they will leave me alone.

I left, and Budman started slandering while I was gone.

So I'm sorry, I don't think you are correct in what you are saying.

 

[gb9]

I doubt it. I wasnt talking to Budman and he accosted me, trying to say I am a slave to sin and all that.

And I am not here to make friends of judgemental people like you who call me a legalist because of my position on SANCTIFICATION.

i'm not here to make friends either, I could care less of what others think of me, I am here to seek and learn truth, and, as best I can, refute and maybe even help those who have errant theology ( though most do not budge, no matter how many times they are proven wrong, see folllwingpeterjensteps for a prime example).


that being said, I think you and I could have productive convo, but you have to not lose it and start ranting when others disagree or mis-understanding you. put them on ignore, and interact to those who you can civil convo with, with dcon and bud, this is not possible, you are too ticked off at them.

 

[Macabeus]

i'm not here to make friends either, I could care less of what others think of me, I am here to seek and learn truth, and, as best I can, refute and maybe even help those who have errant theology ( though most do not budge, no matter how many times they are proven wrong, see folllwingpeterjensteps for a prime example).


that being said, I think you and I could have productive convo, but you have to not lose it and start ranting when others disagree or mis-understanding you. put them on ignore, and interact to those who you can civil convo with, with dcon and bud, this is not possible, you are too ticked off at them.

I wasnt talking to Budman and he accosted me, trying to say I am a slave to sin and all that.

and I was having a perfectly nice, civil conversation with Undergrace, , and DC butted in and called me blind for saying a person does not follow the Spirit and follow the flesh at the same time, that we must daily make a choice which one we follow/walk after.

SO what makes you think they will leave me alone.

I left, and Budman started slandering while I was gone.

They are slanderers who only poison the well. That is what they do.

 

[gb9]

I wasnt talking to Budman and he accosted me, trying to say I am a slave to sin and all that.

and I was having a perfectly nice, civil conversation with Undergrace, , and DC butted in and called me blind for saying a person does not follow the Spirit and follow the flesh at the same time, that we must daily make a choice which one we follow/walk after.

SO what makes you think they will leave me alone.

I left, and Budman started slandering while I was gone.

They are slanderers who only poison the well. That is what they do.

I just read the thing about blind . dcon did NOT say your name.

 

[Macabeus]

I just read the thing about blind . dcon did NOT say your name.

He was replying to Undergrace, who was replying to me.

Undergrace gave a perfectly legitimate answer to my post, and I gave a perfectly legitimate answer to her post, and then DC comes in and says in reply to the former "that's right, but hey, blind is blind"

 

[gb9]

He was replying to Undergrace, who was replying to me.

Undergrace gave a perfectly legitimate answer to my post, and I gave a perfectly legitimate answer to her post, and then DC comes in and says in reply to the former "that's right, but hey, blind is blind"

you do not know that was directed at you. it is my understanding that he has you on ignore.

 

[Macabeus]

you do not know that was directed at you. it is my understanding that he has you on ignore.

He replied to me several times in the last couple of days.

But maybe he was not replying to me, I'll admit that. But he has addressed me when I wasn't talking to him, and sided with Bud on Bud's unprovoked attacks on me.

I was ignoring Bud and he started his "well poisoning".

 

[Macabeus]

He replied to me several times in the last couple of days.

But maybe he was not replying to me, I'll admit that. But he has addressed me when I wasn't talking to him, and sided with Bud on Bud's unprovoked attacks on me.

I was ignoring Bud and he started his "well poisoning".

But anyways, I will try your advice again. There are some nice people here to talk to.

...and I'm sorry about our war of words in the past, and for bringing it up a few minutes ago. My apologies