Some truth about speaking in tongues, the Holy Ghost, spiritual gifts and 1 Corinthians 14

[7seasrekeyed]

If that is true we would not have threads on tongues vs threads on the Gospel in a ratio of 10:1. I would call that obsession with tongues.

have you see the other threads? are there any that actually have redeeming value in the sense people now have a better understanding? IMO, not so much

actually, I have said a few times now it might be a good idea to nix the tongues threads...at least for awhile

it's not like any cessationists here offer anything but their own opinion

the Holy Spirit is given for power to spread the gospel and tongues are a big part of it

I guess you can call whatever you want but at least you have not presented the rabid opposition and youtube videos as proof of anything

the Holy Spirit is ignored to the detriment of many and excluded to the self righteousness of many and this last sentence is not meant as a personal slam to you

I'm serious when I say the subject should be given a rest for awhile or at least handled differently

 

[Wansvic]

Paul spoke in 1. Cor. 14,13-14 from those, who received the Gift of speaking in tongues.
Nowhere he taught that speaking in tongues is the Proof that somebody is baptised in the Holy Spirit.
In opposit. Paul Made in 1. Cor 13,30 clear that not all believers get the Gift of speaking in tongues.

As I have commented to you previously, there is tongues as evidence of the infilling of the Holy Ghost in Acts 2, 10, 19. And a separate spiritual gift of tongues as explained by Paul in Corinthians.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

to add to what I said, Jesus said to the disciples ' you will receive power after the Holy Spirit has come upon you

people are confusing that with salvation. it is not salvation

just as water baptism is a separate event after conversion, so is baptism in the Holy Spirit

that is the order in scripture and still the order today as has been plainly outlined and posted in this thread

object to that and you are objecting to the historical record in scripture

 

[notuptome]

As I have commented to you previously, there is tongues as evidence of the infilling of the Holy Ghost in Acts 2, 10, 19. And a separate spiritual gift of tongues as explained by Paul in Corinthians.

You have not provided biblical support for your comments. Just because you say it does not make it accurate.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Wansvic]

You have not provided biblical support for your comments. Just because you say it does not make it accurate.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

My post references the bible. Nothing can be better than that.

God's will is that each person plants and/or waters seeds found in His Word into the lives of others. Sadly people miss the fact that it is done out of sincere brotherly love. The ultimate goal is that God will give the increase/revelation/understanding (1 Cor 3:6-7)

 

[wolfwint]

As I have commented to you previously, there is tongues as evidence of the infilling of the Holy Ghost in Acts 2, 10, 19. And a separate spiritual gift of tongues as explained by Paul in Corinthians.

Nowhere it is taught to other believers in the whole NT that speaking in tongues is a proof to be baptised with the Holy Spirit.
And Paul taught in 1. Cor 12.30 that NOT all believers get the gift of speaking in tongues.
It seems to me that you just ignore what dont fit in your view.

 

[KelbyofGod]

Kelby, how you explain then that before 1901 this Holy Spirit was not available for around 1800 years? Except in many sects and cults?

Basically because it takes people who are willing to cast of the shackles of mainstream religion in order to receive it. You yourself admit that it has been present during those years....just NOT supported by the mainstream religious sects. God's people have always been outliers.

The fact that it occurs in MANY sects and "cults" (as well as MANY churches, groups and countries around the world today) simply supports the statement that "the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Acts 2:39

 

[KelbyofGod]

BTW, It was available the whole time but, just as in Jesus' day, those that see, receive and act on the truth in Jesus will face being ostracized and outcast by those in religious power.

Act_24:5 For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes:

Act_28:22 But we desire to hear of thee what thou thinkest: for as concerning this sect, we know that every where it is spoken against.

And also included in the bible accounts is the fact that people get REALLY ANGRY when someone uses the observably evident Holy Ghost as the distinguisher between those that are God's and those that still need to get in line with what God wants for them.

Acts 5:32-33 KJV
And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him. [33] When they heard that, they were cut to the heart, and took counsel to slay them.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

 

[Wansvic]

Nowhere it is taught to other believers in the whole NT that speaking in tongues is a proof to be baptised with the Holy Spirit.
And Paul taught in 1. Cor 12.30 that NOT all believers get the gift of speaking in tongues.
It seems to me that you just ignore what dont fit in your view.

The bible states that one can know when something is true when a concept occurs and is recorded 2-3 times. (Matt 18:16) The baptism of the Holy Ghost with the evidence of tongues is recorded at least 3 times. (Acts 2:1-4, 10:44-48, 19:1-6)

The Apostle Peter specifically details what occurred when he was sent to tell Cornelius and others how to be saved:

Acts 10:45-47
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

Peter's statement is clear. The apostles knew when someone received the Holy Ghost because they spoke in tongues just as they had on the Day of Pentecost. This establishes that tongues is clear evidence of the infilling.

Peter relayed the experience to the Jewish leadership. Notice Peter states that Cornelius was told to send for Peter who would tell him how to be saved:

Acts 11:13-17
Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;
Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.
And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

 

[notuptome]

My post references the bible. Nothing can be better than that.

God's will is that each person plants and/or waters seeds found in His Word into the lives of others. Sadly people miss the fact that it is done out of sincere brotherly love. The ultimate goal is that God will give the increase/revelation/understanding (1 Cor 3:6-7)

You did not make any application to the verses you cited. Sadly much of the Pentecostal teaching on tongues requires only vague and obtuse references to verses that really in context and upon close examination do not convey the message attributed to them.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[wolfwint]

The bible states that one can know when something is true when a concept occurs and is recorded 2-3 times. (Matt 18:16) The baptism of the Holy Ghost with the evidence of tongues is recorded at least 3 times. (Acts 2:1-4, 10:44-48, 19:1-6)

The Apostle Peter specifically details what occurred when he was sent to tell Cornelius and others how to be saved:

Acts 10:45-47
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

Peter's statement is clear. The apostles knew when someone received the Holy Ghost because they spoke in tongues just as they had on the Day of Pentecost. This establishes that tongues is clear evidence of the infilling.

Peter relayed the experience to the Jewish leadership. Notice Peter states that Cornelius was told to send for Peter who would tell him how to be saved:

Acts 11:13-17
Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;
Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.
And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

I know what is written in acts 2,10 and 19. According to the context onetime events with a special purpose.
But still this was not taught to other believers in any scripture.
Since 1901 this becomes the most important doctrine among christians.
With many sideeffects which looks like similar since in heathen religions.
No teaching about in the letters to the believers and no teaching about this in the churchhistory.
Why God should hide this truth during the whole churchhistory till 1901?

 

[oyster67]

I hope no one answers this nonsense

wolfwint knows very well that no one is saying that at all

time to ignore this dude.

The person WW was speaking to responded 'yes' to this in post 545.

 

[Renaylen]

Hello everyone! What about these verses in 1st Corinthians 13:8-10

8.Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.

9.For we know in part and we prophesy in part.

10.But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

The person WW was speaking to responded 'yes' to this in post 545.

sorry but I'm not sure what you are saying here?

 

[Renaylen]

Well, Satan being an angle can make himself seem good when really he is deceiving. I feel as though tounges were used in that time for great purpose as to preach to thousands. Yet, Jesus well knew that the gift of tongues would cease relatively soon after the formation of the Christian congregation. Shortly before he died, Jesus mentioned a timeless sign, or mark, that would identify his true followers. “By this all will know that you are my disciples,” he said, “if you have love among yourselves.” (Jhon 13:15) In fact, in the same verse where God’s Word foretold that the miraculous gifts would eventually cease, it says: “Love never fails.” 1st Corinthians 13:8

 

[Waggles]

Except in many sects and cults?

Which sects and cults? History please.

 

[Waggles]

Nowhere he taught that speaking in tongues is the Proof that somebody is baptised in the Holy Spirit.

Incorrect opinion and unbelief ...
But Jesus did teach that speaking in a new tongue would be the sign of true discipleship via the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

 

[soberxp]

For those who know what speaking in tongues is, I'd first like to say what speaking in tongues is for.

Speaking in tongues is for prayer. 1 Corinthians 14:2 "He that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God..."

It is how our spirit (not our mind) prays.. 14:14 "For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth..."

1 Corinthians 14:2 "He that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God..."
What you think in your head, also is an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men,but unto God.

 

[Waggles]

Nowhere it is taught to other believers in the whole NT that speaking in tongues is a proof to be baptised with the Holy Spirit.
And Paul taught in 1. Cor 12.30 that NOT all believers get the gift of speaking in tongues.
It seems to me that you just ignore what dont fit in your view.

Now that really is the kettle calling the pot black!
Brother take the stone of hypocrisy out of your heart before you accuse others of your own sin.

Jesus taught that speaking in tongues would be a SIGN (evidence indicating) the true full gospel of repentance followed by
water baptism and baptism of the Holy Spirit : believers shall speak in new tongues.
Paul is writing about one of three voice GIFTS that should be operated in the Spirit-filled church.
Diversity of tongues is a gift dispersed in the church to be used at a church meeting then followed by interpretation.

 

[Wansvic]

Well, Satan being an angle can make himself seem good when really he is deceiving. I feel as though tounges were used in that time for great purpose as to preach to thousands. Yet, Jesus well knew that the gift of tongues would cease relatively soon after the formation of the Christian congregation. Shortly before he died, Jesus mentioned a timeless sign, or mark, that would identify his true followers. “By this all will know that you are my disciples,” he said, “if you have love among yourselves.” (Jhon 13:15) In fact, in the same verse where God’s Word foretold that the miraculous gifts would eventually cease, it says: “Love never fails.” 1st Corinthians 13:8

The bible is the ultimate source for information and understanding. Jesus did not say the gift of tongues would cease; quite the opposite:
Mark 16:17
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

As for 1 Cor 13:8, Paul is explaining that the spiritual gifts will end when Jesus returns because they will no longer be necessary; however, love will never fail.