O
obedienttogod
Guest
I only mentioned Joshua to mention Jericho and the 300.
But yes, you are correct!!
Blaspheme of the Holy Spirit
- Thread starter RickyZ
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I only mentioned Joshua to mention Jericho and the 300.
But yes, you are correct!!
O
obedienttogod
Guest
I never read for a believer to run from the enemy. Yeshua stressed the importance of FAITH. In fact, every OBSTACLE-FRONT-FORM OF ENEMY whether attacking Yeshua, humanity, the Disciples, etc...Yeshua basically ran as fast as He could TOWARDS THE ENEMY and faced them head on. It's when we read He perceived they wanted to KILL HIM we see Him leave. And that is ONLY BECAUSE it was not yet TIME for him to die!!
Whatever God you believe in that instructs you to RUN, IS NOT A GOD I want any part of!!
O
obedienttogod
Guest
First off, we can read in the Book of Revelation John writing things like the Mark of the Beast and that great fire and destruction will take place in some instances before we get to Armageddon. BUT, we know FOR A FACT, that had John been alive today, he would have been able to be more specific like RFID Chips which have the exact capabilities we understand the MARK allows. We have missiles and bombs that create the GREAT FIRE and DESTRUCTION.
This can also be said of what happened in the Upper Room at the Day of Pentecost.
Those witnessing thought they were possessed, drunk, crazy out of their minds.
SOUNDS VERY MUCH LIKE A PENTECOSTAL WORSHIP SERVICE, and how you sad and dead in worship and spirit see us!!
Like i mentioned in another post on this thread, earlier:
Book Smart without Common Sense produces Morons!!
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
Wow
So a pentecostle worship service has a bunch of people speaking the language of other people to draw people around, then the pastor gives the gospel. So thousands can get saved?
Yeah, did not think so.
Church is a place to get fed. And to equip the people to go out into the world and make disciples of all nation.
Not what most churches do today. And yes, I am including many denominations not just one
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
Hmm
Were we nt told to walk away and brush off the dust off our feet>
yeah I thought so.
If your life is in danger, I doubt God wants you to be there if you can escape. And if you are in a place where heavy demonic influence is present, again, I am sure God does not want you to hang around lest ye be tempted.
O
obedienttogod
Guest
Believers are fed by the HEARING of the WORD and their spirit is fed by WORSHIPPING in the presence of the Holy Spirit. When you have both, you NEVER GO HUNGRY!!
O
obedienttogod
Guest
Wow, you are another pathetic poster TWISTING SCRIPTURE.
We shake the Dust Off when we present the Gospel and are rejected by it, not over a confrontation between good vs evil!!
No wonder I smell weakness off of you, YOU HAVE NO VICTORY in anything but your own idealisms!!
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
Believers are fed by hearing the word. And by fellowshipping with their fellow believers, breaking bread (eating) together, and praying together, And they do it often (acts 2: 42)
All this is done with the HS.
To bad you do not understand the power of these things.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
Lol
Whatever dude
My victory is in christ, Not in signs and wonders, As jesus said, a wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign.
Not everything we see is always real and genuine in anything we look at. Not everything we see is always fake and demonic. But if you take a person who has never spoken in Tongues, or been in such an electrifying atmosphere, were you are like an actual livewire in the presence of the Holy Spirit. That person will look at this scenario and find it difficult to understand and perceive. That is just common sense.
It's like taking a person who has experienced such and put them into a Baptist Sunday morning service. Suicide seems like a better idea and option than sitting 10 more minutes in a literal DEAD ATMOSPHERE!!
It's why the Pentecostals are JEALOUS OF THE BAPTISTS, METHODISTS, PRESBYTERIANS, and all other DENOMINATIONS...Scriptures are VERY CLEAR...the DEAD in CHRIST shall rise first and those which ARE ALIVE will be caught up to meet them.
Pentecostals are then JEALOUS, because the other DENOMINATIONS, are going to meet God first
Baptist churches aren't so bad... just got to find the right fit like any other kind of church. I grew up for the most part in the Baptist churches. I learned many hymns in those type churches. Hymns may be considered old school but they have such depth of meaning and beauty to the lyrics. So, I am a big fan of hymns but also I like some of the new Christian songs.
When I was a teenager I had been going to a church that may be considered Pentecostal. Sometimes people would speak in tongues on the stage but the service itself did not seem to me to be disorderly. I went to a youth group there where the leader mentioned tongues being your prayer language. I remember one of the pastors there, I think the music pastor encouraged me once to keep up with writing my poems.
The only other experience I have had with what might be considered Pentecostal is I used to go to a prayer meeting a number of years, where many there spoke in tongues during prayer time. It did not seem disorderly either. I often would enjoy singing with them and chatting too. The only thing was, at times I would feel lonely or isolated there. I am thinking maybe some of it may have been due to how I can get distracted easily and I was not always following conversations very well.
O
obedienttogod
Guest
Ummm, worshipping will allow the holy Spirit to edify those around you. There are many benefits we get from the Holy Spirit. Ever heard the Old Timers use a phrase "Prayer Warriors?" People who understand how to Pray in the Spirit, and as a result, the manifestations of God are allowed to work. These people spoke in Tongues.
And I like how you use the example of BREAKING BREAD since it actually ever happens any more.
The TRUE DEFINITION of Breaking Bread is not the gathering of people, it's me taking a loaf of bread and breaking a piece off and passing it to the next person who does the same thing. It's the handling of the Bread, everyone's hand touches the Bread.
We don't do this any more.
And if we did, here is what we would sadly hear:
1. Did you wash your hands?
2. Germs lead to death, and you never know what is being passed when everyone touches something we aim to eat.
3. Before we even get to numbers 1 & 2, we have to sit only by someone we associate with.
I could list many more but why, when I know, that NO ONE is actually Breaking bread properly like Yeshua and the Disciples did!!
O
obedienttogod
Guest
And when did I say I sought after signs?
Just because I pray in the Spirit and worship in the Spirit does not mean a thing about seeking a sign.
In fact, the only sign I want to ever see, is what will appear to be Lightning streaking from the East to the West, when Yeshua returns!!
O
obedienttogod
Guest
And since it seems you struggle with interpreting scripture, the SIGN I mentioned can be found in Matthew 24 (other references found in Mark, Luke, and the Book of Acts). Where Yeshua begins with, "AFTER the Great Tribulation (7 year - the one yet to come), the sun will turn into darkness and the moon into blood, the suffering will be so great that God will shorten the days for the ELECT'S SAKE (means no pre-trib/mid-trib, we will be going through the entire ordeal), and soon after like Lightning streaking from East to West Yeshua will return (the SECOND COMING) and Yeshua will send His Angels to gather the ELECT!!
So technically, there are SIGNS ^ that Yeshua INSTRUCTED us to pay attention for.
But since you don't look for those specific signs or any sign at all, I'm sure someone with a CLUE will help you out when that time eventually comes
O
obedienttogod
Guest
Speaking of Old Song Hymnals, Do you remember the song that goes, "I see a Crimson Stream of Blood, and it flows from Calvary?"
G.T. Haywood wrote that song. G.T. Haywood was a Pentecostal Pioneer at the turn of the Century. My Grandfather was not only ordained by G.T. Haywood, but became one of the founding members of the "Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ."
Here is a video of G.T Haywood and if you freeze it at the 1:14 mark, G.T is the man appearing closest to you and the small Jewish man furthest left is my Grandfather:
If I did it correctly, the video will begin at the 1:14 mark when you push play and have the picture I am speaking about.
O
obedienttogod
Guest
My wife was the daughter of a Baptist Pastor when I was first married. She was like many here, who thought Pentecostals were not following the direction of God, and her Dad also taught that the Gift of Tongues had ceased. I sincerely tried and gave it my very best by attending at their church and being a good member and example for the family's sake. But it was horrible. I have NEVER been so miserable knowing there was so much freedom in God that the Baptist wasn't going to allow. And with God, there are no restrictions when the Holy Spirit wants to move. And sadly, these Baptist would literally thwart the movement of God
Finally after service eating lunch one Sunday, I told my Father n Law you suck as preacher and Bible Teacher and God is going to hold you accountable for trying to control what HE wants to do. Then i told my wife who obviously was with us, you can threaten me all you want about attending your church. But I would rather be divorced than to spend another minute in such a DEAD ATMOSPHERE where there is no freedom to praise and worship God. I got up and left and NEVER went back.
My family comes from a long line of Pastors, Evangelists, Bible Teachers and I just went back home to church.
Of course, I did not divorce my wife, and we still lived together but just went to separate churches. She must have been really laying it on her Dad to get me back to their church or to do something. We were in Revival on a Friday evening when my wife, her Dad and Mother walked in and sat down closer to the front. It was ironic, because I was just getting the musicians ready for the worship songs they had prepared. It was typical at the beginning, many were singing while some was praying and others were in worship. The Evangelist we had for the revival asked, if they could play a song he really felt would lead into people getting more focused upon God. Oh, and did it ever.
Long story short, my father n Law today is a Pentecostal Minister, who not only speaks in Tongues, but obviously no longer preaches that Gift has ceased. And I should have him join this site, because it's quite amazing what actually happened. When you ask why he made the change, he generally only says it in a few words. And those words go a little something like this, "I no longer have the pressures of that certain Denomination, and I never knew what God was actually capable of doing, until I stopped trying to control Him."
K
KnowMe
Guest
This thread is laughable and i sincerely pity those that put themselves on God's level calling other people blasphemous not realizing that they themselves are in grave danger of the same sin.
In the scriptures, we see people mock the Apostles and the gifts yet the Apostles patiently guided and explained to them and some were saved (IMO):
Acts 2:
12Astounded and perplexed, they asked one another, “What does this mean?”
13But others mocked them and said, “They are drunk on new wine!”
14Then Peter stood up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and addressed the crowd: “Men of Judea and all who dwell in Jerusalem, let this be known to you, and listen carefully to my words. 15These men are not drunk as you suppose. It is only the third hour of the day! 16No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:
17‘In the last days, God says,
I will pour out My Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18Even on My menservants and maidservants
I will pour out My Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
19I will show wonders in the heavens above
and signs on the earth below,
blood and fire and billows of smoke.
20The sun will be turned to darkness,
and the moon to blood,
before the coming of the great and glorious Day of the Lord.
21And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’b
22Men of Israel, listen to this message: Jesus of Nazareth was a man certified by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs, which God did among you through Him, as you yourselves know. 23He was delivered up by God’s set plan and foreknowledge, and you, by the hands of the lawless, put Him to death by nailing Him to the cross. 24But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches.
25David says about Him:
‘I saw the Lord always before me;
because He is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
26Therefore my heart is glad
and my tongue rejoices;
my body also will dwell in hope,
......
36Therefore let all Israel know with certainty that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ!”
37When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?”
38Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39This promise belongs to you and to your children and to all who are far off, to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.”
40With many other words he testified, and he urged them, “Be saved from this corrupt generation.” 41Those who embraced his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to the believers that day.
So Peter stands and says, "repent and be baptized, each one of you" knowing very well that some there had already blasphemed the Holy spirit?!!
In the scriptures, we see people mock the Apostles and the gifts yet the Apostles patiently guided and explained to them and some were saved (IMO):
Acts 2:
12Astounded and perplexed, they asked one another, “What does this mean?”
13But others mocked them and said, “They are drunk on new wine!”
14Then Peter stood up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and addressed the crowd: “Men of Judea and all who dwell in Jerusalem, let this be known to you, and listen carefully to my words. 15These men are not drunk as you suppose. It is only the third hour of the day! 16No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:
17‘In the last days, God says,
I will pour out My Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18Even on My menservants and maidservants
I will pour out My Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
19I will show wonders in the heavens above
and signs on the earth below,
blood and fire and billows of smoke.
20The sun will be turned to darkness,
and the moon to blood,
before the coming of the great and glorious Day of the Lord.
21And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’b
22Men of Israel, listen to this message: Jesus of Nazareth was a man certified by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs, which God did among you through Him, as you yourselves know. 23He was delivered up by God’s set plan and foreknowledge, and you, by the hands of the lawless, put Him to death by nailing Him to the cross. 24But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches.
25David says about Him:
‘I saw the Lord always before me;
because He is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
26Therefore my heart is glad
and my tongue rejoices;
my body also will dwell in hope,
......
36Therefore let all Israel know with certainty that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ!”
37When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?”
38Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39This promise belongs to you and to your children and to all who are far off, to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.”
40With many other words he testified, and he urged them, “Be saved from this corrupt generation.” 41Those who embraced his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to the believers that day.
So Peter stands and says, "repent and be baptized, each one of you" knowing very well that some there had already blasphemed the Holy spirit?!!
Acts 17:
30Although God overlooked the ignorance of earlier times, He now commands all men everywhere to repent. 31For He has set a day when He will judge the world with justice by the Man He has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising Him from the dead.”
32When they heard about the resurrection of the dead, some began to mock him, but others said, “We want to hear you again on this topic.” 33At that, Paul left the Areopagus. 34But some people joined him and believed, including Dionysius the Areopagite, a woman named Damaris, and others who were with them.
In both cases, every man is included in the command to repent and be saved, even the mockers of the gifts.
The Apostles did not consider themselves God to call out people as blasphemous because they knew well. They did not consider themselves on the same footing with the Holy spirit because the gifts they owned were actually gifts and a gift is something you take full responsibility of as the person who possesses it. When people mocked, it is the apostles that were mocked and they knew it because it was made clear to them that they would suffer.
The problem comes when men in the 21st century, place themselves in the same footing as God, that when people tell them they are wrong, they claim "if you have mocked me, you have mocked God". They are claiming to be God but they are not even aware of what they do.
As a cautious person, you will not come to me speaking un-intelligible words, claiming that it is God speaking and expect me to be in agreement with you.
30Although God overlooked the ignorance of earlier times, He now commands all men everywhere to repent. 31For He has set a day when He will judge the world with justice by the Man He has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising Him from the dead.”
32When they heard about the resurrection of the dead, some began to mock him, but others said, “We want to hear you again on this topic.” 33At that, Paul left the Areopagus. 34But some people joined him and believed, including Dionysius the Areopagite, a woman named Damaris, and others who were with them.
In both cases, every man is included in the command to repent and be saved, even the mockers of the gifts.
The Apostles did not consider themselves God to call out people as blasphemous because they knew well. They did not consider themselves on the same footing with the Holy spirit because the gifts they owned were actually gifts and a gift is something you take full responsibility of as the person who possesses it. When people mocked, it is the apostles that were mocked and they knew it because it was made clear to them that they would suffer.
The problem comes when men in the 21st century, place themselves in the same footing as God, that when people tell them they are wrong, they claim "if you have mocked me, you have mocked God". They are claiming to be God but they are not even aware of what they do.
As a cautious person, you will not come to me speaking un-intelligible words, claiming that it is God speaking and expect me to be in agreement with you.
Again, serious implications come out when one believes that the gifts of the Holy spirit meant that God indwells the person.
Nope. They were God given, temporary abilities toward achieving a certain goal and that goal was to establish the church.
One is given the ability to heal and another one the ability to teach. Meaning that, there was not a point that the person with the ability to heal, will loose it and gain another ability. If you got one, you would excel in it because it was temporary. But apostalship was great because they could excel in all the gifts.
More like Nahum's donkey; it was temporarily enabled by God to speak. Anyone would have mocked that donkey's ability it wouldn't said that they are mocking God. IMO, what that donkey had was a spiritual gift that achieved its goal at that moment.
God only started dwelling in human hearts during the church era not during church establishment. And for that reason, Paul would say things like:
1 Cor 13:8Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears.
Heb 10:25not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.
......
36You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised. 37For, “In just a little while, he who is coming will come and will not delay.”
Claiming that God dwells in you and you are still not complete/perfect, is a contradiction.
Nope. They were God given, temporary abilities toward achieving a certain goal and that goal was to establish the church.
One is given the ability to heal and another one the ability to teach. Meaning that, there was not a point that the person with the ability to heal, will loose it and gain another ability. If you got one, you would excel in it because it was temporary. But apostalship was great because they could excel in all the gifts.
More like Nahum's donkey; it was temporarily enabled by God to speak. Anyone would have mocked that donkey's ability it wouldn't said that they are mocking God. IMO, what that donkey had was a spiritual gift that achieved its goal at that moment.
God only started dwelling in human hearts during the church era not during church establishment. And for that reason, Paul would say things like:
1 Cor 13:8Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears.
Heb 10:25not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.
......
36You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised. 37For, “In just a little while, he who is coming will come and will not delay.”
Claiming that God dwells in you and you are still not complete/perfect, is a contradiction.