K
Faith
- Thread starter PatrickRock
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K
KnowMe
Guest
The one God exists from and to everlasting as three Divine Persons (as I'm certain you already know). This is what the Scriptures tell us (we, for instance, baptize in the (singular) "name" of God, and that Name is, "the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit").
We also worship God as God, and/or as one or more of the individual Members/Persons of the Godhead.
The church's doctrine of the Trinity was created to circumscribe and safeguard the truth concerning this aspect of the Divine nature of the one God. It's not meant to explain it, because that is beyond any of us.
That said, the fact that the Trinity is a "mystery" (IOW, something that cannot be explained to finite creatures like us in terms that we can understand/fully wrap our minds around) does not mean that it's not true. Perhaps we will all come to understand it someday, but not in this lifetime
~Deut
G
GtrPkr
Guest
Ephesians 2:8..... Don't forget that true faith is a gift of God in and of itself! You could claim to have faith in a can of pork-n-beans but it won't save you....
K
KnowMe
Guest
The one God exists from and to everlasting as three Divine Persons (as I'm certain you already know). This is what the Scriptures tell us (we, for instance, baptize in the (singular) "name" of God, and that Name is, "the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit").
We also worship God as God, and/or as one or more of the individual Members/Persons of the Godhead.
The church's doctrine of the Trinity was created to circumscribe and safeguard the truth concerning this aspect of the Divine nature of the one God. It's not meant to explain it, because that is beyond any of us.
That said, the fact that the Trinity is a "mystery" (IOW, something that cannot be explained to finite creatures like us in terms that we can understand/fully wrap our minds around) does not mean that it's not true. Perhaps we will all come to understand it someday, but not in this lifetime
~Deut
it is of deep understanding, from scripture examples in action seems to be within the pages in my opinion. some I’ve looked at are.
1
Luke 8
45“Who touched Me?” Jesus asked.
2
John 5
7“Sir,” the invalid replied, “I have no one to help me into the pool when the water is stirred. While I am on my way, someone else goes in before me.”
3
8Then Jesus told him, “Get up, pick up your mat, and walk.”
...I will say that it is entirely possible to separate the trinity, through error that is. By doing so, it may be possible (thus the purpose of the post) to come to a greater understanding of the lost and how to be a more effectual witness...
There are some who believe in Jehovah but have not come to the knowledge (and saving faith forthwith) of Yeshua. "Balaams", First born children, second born children, etc, etc.
There are some who believe in Yeshua and have accepted most aspects of "God the father & God the son" and yet do not believe in the spirit and the modern workings thereof.
There are some who believe only in the spirit and have not come to the knowledge of the father or the son but follow the code written on their hearts and are governed in some fashion. Continually tossed about by the "spiritual" but having no foundation or "rock" to build upon. Others that follow after "other" spirits, and yet are still drawn by the Spirit of the Lord.
I could go into some serious depth about that, what I have "gleaned" from people...but firstly, what were you trying to illustrate?
Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith and so our faith begins with a connection to Jesus as our Lord and Savior. Then the Spirit makes the scriptures come alive to us as we gather round hearing Jesus' words. The Spirit also fulfills the promise of the new covenant, transforming us into the image of Christ by writing the Lord's laws and commandments upon our hearts and minds. Exceedingly great and precious promises obtained through faith lead us into drawing near to the Lord as we are made partakers of his divine nature. When we do draw near, the Lord shares his heart with us and we're thereby able to love those whom the Lord loves. Our faith begins focused upon Jesus and can grow strong as we learn to trust in the Lord's word and exercise our faith to believe not only in Jesus but to also believe for every prayer request made according to the Lord's word will availeth much. Especially in those whose hearts condemn them not and who therefore have confidence before the Lord and receive what they ask because they keep his commandments and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
Hope in Hebrews 11 means joyful expectation in the Greek! I like that a lot.Hi Patrick, the Bible seems to say as muchFor instance,
Hebrews 111 Faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.Romans 420 With respect to the promise of God, he [Abraham] did not waver in unbelief but grew strong in faith, giving glory to God,21 and being fully assured that what God had promised, He was able also to perform.~Deut
But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ (the word) down from above: ) Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ (the word) again from the dead.) But what saith it? The word (Christ) is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; For Christ (Faith, the word in our heart and mouth) is the end of the law (written on parchment and Tables of stone) for righteousness to every one that believeth.
(Rom 10:6-8, 4)
O
obedienttogod
Guest
I like the example we have with Moses, personally.
Here is Moses, a learned man, skilled in war, strategy, languages, speaking from being raised like an Egyptian to become Pharaoh one day.
Then we see this skilled man called Moses one day walking, and he notices a bush on fire but not actually burning. He kind of ignores it until a voice is spoken from it. But all through out this conversation between Moses and I AM, we see Moses not acting like the skilled man he was taught to be. He is timid, acts like he is unsure, claims he cannot speak properly nor lead a group of people like he had been raised and taught to do. In everything I AM commands Moses during this conversation, Moses is backwards and the very opposite of who he actually is. And then something ODD happens.
I AM commands to lead his people = Moses replies he is not qualified
I AM commands to go to Pharaoh = Moses acts like he is school girl scared
I AM commands = Moses has every excuse that he should not be the one doing it
And then BAM!!
I AM tells Moses to toss his staff onto the ground = becomes a DEADLY KILLER SNAKE
I AM commands Moses to pick up the DEADLY KILLER SNAKE by the tail = WITHOUT HESITATION, like in everything else I AM commanded Moses to do, Moses (does not say a word, does not run, does not question) JUST BENDS DOWN ASAP and picks the DEADLY KILLER SNAKE without making any excuse or being hesitant.
That literally cracks me up!! Moses can see a bush on fire but not burning + hears an audible voice claiming to be God named I AM and suddenly has hesitation that this God is NOT able to use Moses without any harm coming to him.
But you put a KILLER DEADLY SNAKE on the ground that could easily have killed Moses...and he just bends over and grabs the tail without any hesitation when told to.
The reasoning here by Moses is priceless. He has NO FAITH in a God who can be in a bush on fire without consuming the bush, or the fact that from within the fire is an audible voice claiming to be the God of his fathers called I AM. Moses has no faith in a God capable of doing what he is witnessing this God doing and translating that into being able to protect him from the Pharoah. But see a DEADLY KILLER SNAKE on the ground that could kill Moses in a split second...and what does Moses do...he suddenly has faith to pick it up by the tail, when this God he doubts that can protect him from Pharaoh, immediately orders him to pick up the DEADLY KILLER SNAKE.
That is what you call, Priceless!!
There are some that won't believe unless they see but blessed are those who believe without seeing.
John 20:26-29
King James Version
26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: [then] came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace [be] unto you.
27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust [it] into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.
28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed [are] they that have not seen, and [yet] have believed.
An interesting thing about faith is that there are two different kinds of faith. 1. - The natural man's faith, which is having faith in the things of the world.(1 Cor 2:14). 2. - The spiritual man's faith, which is a fruit of the Spirit (Gal 5) which is given by God in regeneration (Eph 2) that enables him to discern spiritual things.