What happens to or where is lake of fire?

[Hungry]

So all this time I pictured this lake of fire somewhere on the earth in the future. Then death and hell and all who oppose God are tossed in at the closing of revelations 20. Then the first verse of 21 states he sees a new heaven and new earth because the old one passed away. So does that mean the lake of fire with all of the inhabitants are also gone?

 

[Melach]

the lake of fire is mentioned in revelation 21:

revelation 21:8 ""But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.""

i come to you with a humble opinion: i do not know but i thought i would mention what i did, hope that helps.
i will keep reading this topic maybe some of the brethren can shine light on the question that you seek friend.

 

[SIMON55]

So all this time I pictured this lake of fire somewhere on the earth in the future. Then death and hell and all who oppose God are tossed in at the closing of revelations 20. Then the first verse of 21 states he sees a new heaven and new earth because the old one passed away. So does that mean the lake of fire with all of the inhabitants are also gone?

Rev. 14:11...And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever.....

How do you factor this in also?
I think a lot of people wrongly interpret this as time when I discern it as distance.
..........But if the first heavens and earth pass away as scripture indicates then I would think they are blotted out completely as if they never existed.....and the LOF with it!
I see our Father as a God of unlimited love and mercy and I can not accept that he causes anyone to suffer eternally.
The eternal suffering is the permanent seperation into non existence completely IMHO.....
😀.....
I think the key to discerning it is in the former things permanently being done away with completely.

 

[KnowMe]

on a metaphoric level.

 

[Journeyman]

So all this time I pictured this lake of fire somewhere on the earth in the future. Then death and hell and all who oppose God are tossed in at the closing of revelations 20. Then the first verse of 21 states he sees a new heaven and new earth because the old one passed away. So does that mean the lake of fire with all of the inhabitants are also gone?

Compare Rev.19:20 with 2Thes.2:8.

 

[dcontroversal]

So all this time I pictured this lake of fire somewhere on the earth in the future. Then death and hell and all who oppose God are tossed in at the closing of revelations 20. Then the first verse of 21 states he sees a new heaven and new earth because the old one passed away. So does that mean the lake of fire with all of the inhabitants are also gone?

Before the throne of God anf the smoke of their torment ascends forever....so....it cannot disappear.......Personally I believe there is a point missed concerning God/Jesus.....

Jesus is the physical ICON of the invisible God.......I put forth the following thought.....

a. God creates a new Heaven and a new Earth (Heaven being where the celestial bodies revolve) as God's heaven would have no need to be revamped...

b. Jesus as the Physical Icon (IMAGE) of the invisible God the FATHER dwells on the New Earth in the city of God as IMMANUEL.

C. The invisible Heavenly FATHER dwells in THE THIRD HEAVEN where he currently dwells and the LAKE OF FIRE remains right where it is ......BEFORE HIS THRONE.....

Just something to ponder.....and just a POSSIBILITY.......

 

[LW97]

Gehenna is NOT the lake of fire!

 

[dcontroversal]

Rev. 14:11...And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever.....

How do you factor this in also?
I think a lot of people wrongly interpret this as time when I discern it as distance.
..........But if the first heavens and earth pass away as scripture indicates then I would think they are blotted out completely as if they never existed.....and the LOF with it!
I see our Father as a God of unlimited love and mercy and I can not accept that he causes anyone to suffer eternally.
The eternal suffering is the permanent seperation into non existence completely IMHO.....
😀.....
I think the key to discerning it is in the former things permanently being done away with completely.

For ever and ever does not indicate done away with completely.......as a matter of fact the double emphasis POINTS to an eternal existence..........do a study from the GREEK.....it indicates an ongoing event without end

 

[Ahwatukee]

So all this time I pictured this lake of fire somewhere on the earth in the future. Then death and hell and all who oppose God are tossed in at the closing of revelations 20. Then the first verse of 21 states he sees a new heaven and new earth because the old one passed away. So does that mean the lake of fire with all of the inhabitants are also gone?

Greetings Hungry!

It is Sheol/Hades, which is the realm of departed spirits of the unrighteous dead which is under the earth. Regarding this, consider the following scriptures as defining Sheol/Hades location:

"And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted up to heaven? No, you will be brought down to Hades!" - Luke 10:15

"But no one in heaven or on earth or under the earth was able to open the scroll or look inside it." - Revelation 5:3

"And I heard every creature in heaven, and on earth, and under the earth, and in the sea, and all that is in them, saying" - Rev.5:13

"Therefore God exalted Him to the highest place and gave Him the name above all names, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. - Philippians 2:9-11

Therefore, Sheol/Hades is down under the earth, which in comparison, is a temporary place of punishment until the great white throne judgment.

However, the location of Gehenna, i.e. the lake of fire, is never revealed. But as you correctly pointed out, it cannot be located on this earth, because after the millennial period and the great white throne judgment, this present earth will pass away and will be replaced by a new heaven and new earth.

Another moniker for the lake of fire is "outer darkness" therefore, its location would have to be a place without sun, moon or stars or any light at all. It could also be possible that the lake of fire will burn black, i.e. not light producing, so that those in punishment would be separated from any light, but only experience the torment of flame and separation from God and His glorious light.

The truth is that, the location of the lake of fire is never revealed. What we do know is that, it was created for Satan and his angels, as well as for all those who follow after him by willfully living according to the sinful nature.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Gehenna is NOT the lake of fire!

Yes, Jesus used Gehenna figuratively to describe the lake of fire.

HELPS Word-studies
1067 géenna (a transliteration of the Hebrew term, Gêhinnōm, "the valley of Hinnom") – Gehenna, i.e. hell (also referred to as the "lake of fire" in Revelation).

Gehenna ("hell"), the place of post-resurrection torment (judgment), refers strictly to the everlasting abode of the unredeemed where they experience divine judgment in their individual resurrection-bodies. Each of the unredeemed receives one at the Great White Throne Judgment (Rev 20:11-15), i.e. a body that "matches" their capacity for torment relating to their (unique) judgment.

 

[Magenta]

For ever and ever does not indicate done away with completely.......as a matter of fact the double emphasis POINTS to an eternal existence..........do a study from the GREEK.....it indicates an ongoing event without end

Is Sodom still burning?

The "eternal fire" of hell is one hot topic! It has been misunderstood by the majority of people for many centuries. Here are examples and scripture to show its true meaning.

"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:" (Matt 25:41)​

It is not the fire itself but its effects that are everlasting as in Jude 7:

"Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire."(Jude 7)​

Note that "everlasting fire" (Matt 25:41) and "eternal fire" (Jude 7) are from the same original words. Of course, Sodom and Gomorrah are not still burning yet they "are set forth for an example" of the results of a sinful course.

"And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;" (2Pet 2:6)​

The wicked will be burned up not burning forever in an eternal fire.

"And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts." (Mal 4:3)​

"But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away." (Psa 37:20)​

The punishment is everlasting destruction:

"Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power" (2 Thess 1:9)​

It is the destruction, not the process that is forever. The Bible's use of terms like eternal and everlasting can be understood better by some examples.


Further examples of forever to show its meaning

"And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free: Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever." (Exo 21:5-6)​

In this case, the slave is opting to stay with his master and serve him for as long as he lives and it is termed forever.

"But Hannah went not up; for she said unto her husband, I will not go up until the child be weaned, and then I will bring him, that he may appear before the LORD, and there abide for ever." (1 Sam 1:22)​

Of course, Samuel only abided there for a limited period of time.

"I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God." (Jon 2:6)​

In Jonah's case forever was only a few days although it may have seemed like an eternity.


By one count, "forever" is used 56 times in the Bible to describe things that have ended.
//www.jesus-resurrection.info/eternal-fire.html

 

[dcontroversal]

Is Sodom still burning?

The "eternal fire" of hell is one hot topic! It has been misunderstood by the majority of people for many centuries. Here are examples and scripture to show its true meaning.

"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:" (Matt 25:41)​

It is not the fire itself but its effects that are everlasting as in Jude 7:

"Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire."(Jude 7)​

Note that "everlasting fire" (Matt 25:41) and "eternal fire" (Jude 7) are from the same original words. Of course, Sodom and Gomorrah are not still burning yet they "are set forth for an example" of the results of a sinful course.

"And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;" (2Pet 2:6)​

The wicked will be burned up not burning forever in an eternal fire.

"And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts." (Mal 4:3)​

"But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away." (Psa 37:20)​

The punishment is everlasting destruction:

"Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power" (2 Thess 1:9)​

It is the destruction, not the process that is forever. The Bible's use of terms like eternal and everlasting can be understood better by some examples.


Further examples of forever to show its meaning

"And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free: Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever." (Exo 21:5-6)​

In this case, the slave is opting to stay with his master and serve him for as long as he lives and it is termed forever.

"But Hannah went not up; for she said unto her husband, I will not go up until the child be weaned, and then I will bring him, that he may appear before the LORD, and there abide for ever." (1 Sam 1:22)​

Of course, Samuel only abided there for a limited period of time.

"I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God." (Jon 2:6)​

In Jonah's case forever was only a few days although it may have seemed like an eternity.


By one count, "forever" is used 56 times in the Bible to describe things that have ended.
//www.jesus-resurrection.info/eternal-fire.html

We have had this dance before and the verbiage is clear.....and for sure we will not change each others mind on this one.....

The lake of fire is forever and all.who end up there will burn for eternity

 

[SIMON55]

For ever and ever does not indicate done away with completely.......as a matter of fact the double emphasis POINTS to an eternal existence..........do a study from the GREEK.....it indicates an ongoing event without end

So what is the technical for the indication for ascendeth ?
To me it indicates movement of travel or motion with direction.....also smoke is a finality of something consumed by fire.... requiring a gas or oxygen for the physics to occur.....I understand that may not be a requirement that restricts God or that even the verse might be symbolic symbolism.
And as you suggest I should have already invested more time in it possibly but my primary focus has been trying to escape the LOF by studying what improves myself and live according to instruction.
I just don't see the point in God retaining a presence of the LOF.....after judgment is passed.....unless after judgment we are still able to somehow....lose the free gift and fall from the favor of grace and everlasting eternal life.....which some believe isn't possible I think.....?
I don't consider my study of scripture to be a completed work or effort wherein I have gained a finished comprehension especially on a lot the more complicated questions....
My esword program has all my cross reference tools with my strongs and multiple scripture versions and bolinger and encyclopedias in it......and I had an issue last fall with my laptop that I haven't corrected yet so it is hindering me from being lead to a lot recently as has worked well for me in the past.....I need to resolve it so I can com....more literately on subjects....Im better at being lead when clicking than flipping pages and a lighted display to read from is easier optically....its tedious to do things frome a phone dobbing the qwerty with a pointer and stuff....not having all search tools and copy paste ability....just got this first not as stupid phone a yr ago.....and dont operate it like someone with tech understanding. I don't even know how to use it for a wifi connection.......lol
😀

 

[dcontroversal]

So what is the technical for the indication for ascendeth ?
To me it indicates movement of travel or motion with direction.....also smoke is a finality of something consumed by fire.... requiring a gas or oxygen for the physics to occur.....I understand that may not be a requirement that restricts God or that even the verse might be symbolic symbolism.
And as you suggest I should have already invested more time in it possibly but my primary focus has been trying to escape the LOF by studying what improves myself and live according to instruction.
I just don't see the point in God retaining a presence of the LOF.....after judgment is passed.....unless after judgment we are still able to somehow....lose the free gift and fall from the favor of grace and everlasting eternal life.....which some believe isn't possible I think.....?
I don't consider my study of scripture to be a completed work or effort wherein I have gained a finished comprehension especially on a lot the more complicated questions....
My esword program has all my cross reference tools with my strongs and multiple scripture versions and bolinger and encyclopedias in it......and I had an issue last fall with my laptop that I haven't corrected yet so it is hindering me from being lead to a lot recently as has worked well for me in the past.....I need to resolve it so I can com....more literately on subjects....Im better at being lead when clicking than flipping pages and a lighted display to read from is easier optically....its tedious to do things frome a phone dobbing the qwerty with a pointer and stuff....not having all search tools and copy paste ability....just got this first not as stupid phone a yr ago.....and dont operate it like someone with tech understanding. I don't even know how to use it for a wifi connection.......lol
😀

hahhaj You really think God requires oxygen, gas and man's idea of Physics to have an eternal lake of fire to torment the devil, fallen agnels the beast, false prophet <-- which is a man and theblost which die as enemies of Christ for eternity?........interesting......

 

[SIMON55]

Is Sodom still burning?

The "eternal fire" of hell is one hot topic! It has been misunderstood by the majority of people for many centuries. Here are examples and scripture to show its true meaning.

"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:" (Matt 25:41)​

It is not the fire itself but its effects that are everlasting as in Jude 7:

"Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire."(Jude 7)​

Note that "everlasting fire" (Matt 25:41) and "eternal fire" (Jude 7) are from the same original words. Of course, Sodom and Gomorrah are not still burning yet they "are set forth for an example" of the results of a sinful course.

"And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;" (2Pet 2:6)​

The wicked will be burned up not burning forever in an eternal fire.

"And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts." (Mal 4:3)​

"But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away." (Psa 37:20)​

The punishment is everlasting destruction:

"Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power" (2 Thess 1:9)​

It is the destruction, not the process that is forever. The Bible's use of terms like eternal and everlasting can be understood better by some examples.


Further examples of forever to show its meaning

"And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free: Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever." (Exo 21:5-6)​

In this case, the slave is opting to stay with his master and serve him for as long as he lives and it is termed forever.

"But Hannah went not up; for she said unto her husband, I will not go up until the child be weaned, and then I will bring him, that he may appear before the LORD, and there abide for ever." (1 Sam 1:22)​

Of course, Samuel only abided there for a limited period of time.

"I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God." (Jon 2:6)​

In Jonah's case forever was only a few days although it may have seemed like an eternity.


By one count, "forever" is used 56 times in the Bible to describe things that have ended.
//www.jesus-resurrection.info/eternal-fire.html

Not to sound argumentative at all but just to ask a question ....have you seen some of the videos of Sodom an Gamora .....there is still a remnant of its remains....

The sulphur brimstone is still there in like one inch or so size rocks.....on the ground in bushes embedded in the structure walls.....
..........Its pure white sulphur not found anywhere on earth all other sulphur has a yellowish shading.....
.....after all this time it still retains its fuel you can hold a match to it and it ignites.....burns smells like sulphur.....😀

 

[SIMON55]

hahhaj You really think God requires oxygen, gas and man's idea of Physics to have an eternal lake of fire to torment the devil, fallen agnels the beast, false prophet <-- which is a man and theblost which die as enemies of Christ for eternity?........interesting......

Not if you will reread it brother D I said I realize God isn't necessarily restricted by physics like that I realize he created everything so our understanding of things doesn't compare to his. But the verse is written in comparison of human understanding.
.......as long as I don't wind up in the LOF I'll be happy for God to have it however he chooses !!!!
But.....you didn't address the greater question I posed to you......what would be the point in retaining the LOF after judgment.....?
Are we going to need a reminder.....or is it possible we could lose a favorable judgment after gaining it ?
😀

 

[dcontroversal]

Not if you will reread it brother D I said I realize God isn't necessarily restricted by physics like that I realize he created everything so our understanding of things doesn't compare to his. But the verse is written in comparison of human understanding.
.......as long as I don't wind up in the LOF I'll be happy for God to have it however he chooses !!!!
But.....you didn't address the greater question I posed to you......what would be the point in retaining the LOF after judgment.....?
Are we going to need a reminder.....or is it possible we could lose a favorable judgment after gaining it ?
😀

My bad migo....there is no point necessarily other than Whatsoever God does, it is everlasting, nothing added or taken away and God does this so men may fear before him....Ecclesiastes 3

 

[Deade]

God’s Memorials​

Rev. 14:9-11 “And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.”

Some things are preserved in God's memory that is just as good as having them on file or archived digitally. His recall is 100%. Here is a case for something in God's memory:

Mark 9:47, 48 "And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire: Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched." Come on, a maggot that never dies. What is that?

Be aware that Sheol and Hades simply refers to the grave. Our doctrine of a dwelling place of the dead is inserted into Strong's Concordance as a reference. The reference in Revelation where they are tormented day and night forever, their smoke ascending forever could refer to something captured on film, therefore forever preserved. The reference in Mark 9:44: "Where their worm dieth not and the fire is not quenched" I believe is another example of that. It just does not make sense of a maggot that never dies. Anyway, hades is finally tossed into the lake of fire. You can't do that with a dwelling place.

All said, as I stated before all scripture has to fit together, in what we teach, or none of it is valid. Some things were presented in parables with figurative speech. Some things maybe we don't quite understand yet. God will not reveal some things until He is ready for us to know. I feel Lazarus and the rich man is a parable despite the proper names.

 

[Magenta]

Not to sound argumentative at all but just to ask a question ....have you seen some of the videos of Sodom an Gamora .....there is still a remnant of its remains....

The sulphur brimstone is still there in like one inch or so size rocks.....on the ground in bushes embedded in the structure walls.....
..........Its pure white sulphur not found anywhere on earth all other sulphur has a yellowish shading.....
.....after all this time it still retains its fuel you can hold a match to it and it ignites.....burns smells like sulphur.....😀

So it is not burning unless someone lights a match to it?

 

[Magenta]

We have had this dance before and the verbiage is clear.....and for sure we will not change each others mind on this one.....

The lake of fire is forever and all.who end up there will burn for eternity

The verbiage. Yes Dead is dead, not alive somewhere being torured by a just, good, merciful and loving God