Jesus is not coming back. He already did in 70 A.D.
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Not really - I'm convinced of the FP position - any unresolved issues regarding the MOS and the mark etc in my view would not change it. I've pitched me tent.
As JC said, and I take this as an irrefutable fact:
Luke 21:22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
Nite nite Bro So.
You made the following statement;
"that is why he could tell Caiphas
that he would see him coming in clouds. Clouds represent Gods
judgement in this context. Judgement came to Jerusalem in AD70"
I was keying off that.
Sorry for the inconvenience.
O
obedienttogod
Guest
Outside the fact the religious leaders rejected Christ and His message, there really is NOTHING RELATIVE to the Jewish nation why 70 A.D. should be considered a point of judgement. People are forgetting the fact the Romans hated their enemies, and the Jews were one of them. The Romans attacked everyone around Mesopotamia. The Jews were just a matter of time before Rome attacked them.
I just do not see how anyone can conclude the 70 A.D. was judgement by God, when in reality, we know how Rome felt about the Jews and it was just a matter of time before they would attack the Jews.
70 A.D. HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH GOD'S JUDGEMENT!!
Anyone who believes as such needs medication!!
I just do not see how anyone can conclude the 70 A.D. was judgement by God, when in reality, we know how Rome felt about the Jews and it was just a matter of time before they would attack the Jews.
70 A.D. HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH GOD'S JUDGEMENT!!
Anyone who believes as such needs medication!!
O
obedienttogod
Guest
PAY ATTENTION TO THIS: VERY IMPORTANT!!
Had the 70 A.D. destruction not happened, and as result the Jews became a scattered people, WE WOULD NOT HAVE THE WORD of GOD LIKE WE HAVE.
BECAUSE of the 70 A.D. destruction, people preserved the scrolls so that today we have them and use them as proofs for our own Canon. This is why 70 A.D. happened = to spread the GOSPEL, not because of judgement.
Anyone who believes 70 A.D. was about the Judgement of God, should make an appointment to your nearest shrink now, because YOU NEED SERIOUS HELP!!
Had the 70 A.D. destruction not happened, and as result the Jews became a scattered people, WE WOULD NOT HAVE THE WORD of GOD LIKE WE HAVE.
BECAUSE of the 70 A.D. destruction, people preserved the scrolls so that today we have them and use them as proofs for our own Canon. This is why 70 A.D. happened = to spread the GOSPEL, not because of judgement.
Anyone who believes 70 A.D. was about the Judgement of God, should make an appointment to your nearest shrink now, because YOU NEED SERIOUS HELP!!
I remember talking to you guys a few months ago when I was defending amillennialism. Locutus, you said something that got me thinking. It was about the time statements and how Christians ignore them.
I started thinking about those and realized I was ignoring them and not being fair with them. I also kept thinking about the resurrection of Dan 12: 1-3,7 and that the Scripture states that that resurrection/judgment can only take place in the first century at the time of the Roman king and the end of Daniel's 70 weeks prophecy. Jesus also states in many Scriptures that He is returning with the kingdom before His generation passes away.
I have since left the amillennial viewpoint and I am convinced that the Bible teaches the FP view.
I think the FP view has no problem passages because it is what the Scripture teaches. We don't know exactly what the MotB was or who the MoS was but nevertheless the Scripture makes it clear that it happened before/during the siege and fall of Jerusalem. The time framework will not allow for any other interpretation.
Really? I don't understand how this is so "mind boggling" to you that 70 AD was the end of the age, when this is exactly when God took His temple off the earth, as well as the priesthood genealogies, and the whole Jewish system, to bring in the new age of grace. It would make no sense if this wasn't the case, your outlook makes no sense to me at all.
If you want to restrict me to the Preterist/Amill category I am Partial. My position though is more in line with New Covenant/ Dominionist
I see the Bible as a complete unfolding revelation of Christ using Covenants Types and Symbols throughout scripture. I believe that
Gods purpose for humanity is to bring us back to the Pre Fall Adamic condition under God and to have dominion over creation once
again as promised in Revelation in a new heaven and new earth.
Keep in mind that Jesus spoke of what Daniel stated in Dan12:1-4[6-7] in His words of Matthew 24:21.
Daniel 12:1-4 is not speaking of a physical-bodily resurrection (like v.13 is), but that which corresponds with a number of other passages regarding Israel coming up out of the graveyard of nations, where "scattered" [notice the Lk21:24 etc, their scattering], so that Daniel 12:1-4 speaks of what Ezekiel 37:1-14[20-23] does [the "dry bones" prophecy], and Romans 11:15 does ["what shall the receiving of them [Israel] be, but LIFE FROM THE DEAD"], and Hosea 5:15-6:3 does ["after two days"..." in the third day"], and Isaiah 26:16-21 does [note the "birth pangs"], and John 6:39 does [distinct from v.40]; etc... Notice that in Matthew 24 the "beginning of birth pangs" come BEFORE this "see and flee" point in time; but in Luke 21 the birth pangs come AFTER the "see [Jeru surrounded by armies] then flee" and the 70ad section ends with verse 24's scattering, whereas Daniel 12:1-4 DOES NOT! (but the "deliver" instead!) Daniel 12 CONTEXT speaks only of Israel (that is the context there), not a so called "general resurrection"...
A quote from William Kelly:
[quoting]
" "For then" (our Lord says) "shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be." Many, I am aware, apply this to the destruction of Jerusalem by Titus, and to the great calamities that then broke up the Jews. But there is one essential point of difference that ought not to be overlooked. The Jewish people were not delivered then. Whereas, when Daniel's prophecy is accomplished, they are, and must be, delivered - not at a subsequent epoch, but at that time. If Daniel is a true prophet (and no one who reveres the Lord, and rightly weighs His words, will question it), it is not that his prophecy failed, but that it remains to be fulfilled. Our Lord distinctly and positively quotes from that prophecy, and from the very chapter (Dan. 12) we are considering. And what does He connect with Israel's deliverance? His own coming as the Son of man from heaven. Who can say that this has been? The Romans, instead of being broken down in the time of Titus, were allowed to enslave the Jews. These were not then delivered, nor, up to the present moment, have they ever been the masters of their own temple, nor allowed to be in their own land, even as ordinary men. If there is one race more peculiarly proscribed in the Holy Land, it is the Jewish. The Turks, the present possessors of it, have held it for many a long year; and all, whether Crusaders or Saracens, have agreed to shut out the Jews. So that there has been nothing like the Son of man coming to deliver Israel. Michael has not stood up for them in that sense yet.
"Thus, what I have shown from the Old Testament is amply confirmed by the New. Prophet after prophet, all distinctly furnish the same outline, i.e. a time of trouble, such as never was before, followed immediately by a deliverance such as Israel has never yet enjoyed. It is perfectly plain, as we all believe, that these prophecies are of God, that it is only a question of waiting God's time for Himself to accomplish them to the very letter. As our Lord says in this same chap. 24 of Matthew, "Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My words shall not pass away." It is not only that the general strain is true, but not one jot nor one tittle shall pass till all be fulfilled. The notion that God has cast away His people, Israel, because He is now in mercy filling up the blank season of their rebellion against the Lord Jesus and the gospel, is distinctly treated in Romans 11, as the offspring of Gentile conceit. For not only is God able to graft the natural branches into their own olive tree, but when the fulness of the Gentiles is come in, all Israel shall be saved according to clear prophecy. They are to become objects of divine saving mercy at the end, as we now; only in their case it will be in their land. "And the Redeemer shall come to Zion," etc.
"If this be so, we have an important key to the prophecy of Daniel. Although the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans was so near, yet the Lord distinctly looks onward to another time. And what makes it the more remarkable is, that one evangelist does give us the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans, but also distinguishes it from this future time of trouble. In Luke 21 is the chief reference of a positively prophetic kind to the Roman destruction of Jerusalem. And mark the difference of the language: "And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed about with armies." Not a word about the abomination of desolation standing in the holy place. Luke passes over this entirely, and introduces what Matthew does not mention - Jerusalem encompassed with armies. "When ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out," etc. That is, the Lord prescribes exactly the same course to be taken by the Jews in Jerusalem, whether at the approaching sack of the city by the Romans (as in Luke), or at the future desolation that should fall upon it (as in Matthew). So far there was an analogy between the two things: the godly were to flee away; they were not to trust to vain hopes of deliverance through some pretended Messiah, but were to know from the lips of the Lord Himself, that Jerusalem was to fall under the hand of the Gentiles. If any wanted to escape, it must be outside Jerusalem. "And let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto." No matter what people may say of the necessity of any keeping their feast, their path of safety is to avoid Jerusalem. There is no deliverance for Israel yet. "For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled."
"Luke, it will be observed, does not say, This is the time of trouble, such as was not since the beginning of the world. There is the most surprising perfectness of expression. […]"
[end quoting; source: Bible Hub, William Kelly Commentary, on Daniel 12]
https://biblehub.com/commentaries/kelly/daniel/12.htm
[quoting]
" "For then" (our Lord says) "shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be." Many, I am aware, apply this to the destruction of Jerusalem by Titus, and to the great calamities that then broke up the Jews. But there is one essential point of difference that ought not to be overlooked. The Jewish people were not delivered then. Whereas, when Daniel's prophecy is accomplished, they are, and must be, delivered - not at a subsequent epoch, but at that time. If Daniel is a true prophet (and no one who reveres the Lord, and rightly weighs His words, will question it), it is not that his prophecy failed, but that it remains to be fulfilled. Our Lord distinctly and positively quotes from that prophecy, and from the very chapter (Dan. 12) we are considering. And what does He connect with Israel's deliverance? His own coming as the Son of man from heaven. Who can say that this has been? The Romans, instead of being broken down in the time of Titus, were allowed to enslave the Jews. These were not then delivered, nor, up to the present moment, have they ever been the masters of their own temple, nor allowed to be in their own land, even as ordinary men. If there is one race more peculiarly proscribed in the Holy Land, it is the Jewish. The Turks, the present possessors of it, have held it for many a long year; and all, whether Crusaders or Saracens, have agreed to shut out the Jews. So that there has been nothing like the Son of man coming to deliver Israel. Michael has not stood up for them in that sense yet.
"Thus, what I have shown from the Old Testament is amply confirmed by the New. Prophet after prophet, all distinctly furnish the same outline, i.e. a time of trouble, such as never was before, followed immediately by a deliverance such as Israel has never yet enjoyed. It is perfectly plain, as we all believe, that these prophecies are of God, that it is only a question of waiting God's time for Himself to accomplish them to the very letter. As our Lord says in this same chap. 24 of Matthew, "Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My words shall not pass away." It is not only that the general strain is true, but not one jot nor one tittle shall pass till all be fulfilled. The notion that God has cast away His people, Israel, because He is now in mercy filling up the blank season of their rebellion against the Lord Jesus and the gospel, is distinctly treated in Romans 11, as the offspring of Gentile conceit. For not only is God able to graft the natural branches into their own olive tree, but when the fulness of the Gentiles is come in, all Israel shall be saved according to clear prophecy. They are to become objects of divine saving mercy at the end, as we now; only in their case it will be in their land. "And the Redeemer shall come to Zion," etc.
"If this be so, we have an important key to the prophecy of Daniel. Although the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans was so near, yet the Lord distinctly looks onward to another time. And what makes it the more remarkable is, that one evangelist does give us the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans, but also distinguishes it from this future time of trouble. In Luke 21 is the chief reference of a positively prophetic kind to the Roman destruction of Jerusalem. And mark the difference of the language: "And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed about with armies." Not a word about the abomination of desolation standing in the holy place. Luke passes over this entirely, and introduces what Matthew does not mention - Jerusalem encompassed with armies. "When ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out," etc. That is, the Lord prescribes exactly the same course to be taken by the Jews in Jerusalem, whether at the approaching sack of the city by the Romans (as in Luke), or at the future desolation that should fall upon it (as in Matthew). So far there was an analogy between the two things: the godly were to flee away; they were not to trust to vain hopes of deliverance through some pretended Messiah, but were to know from the lips of the Lord Himself, that Jerusalem was to fall under the hand of the Gentiles. If any wanted to escape, it must be outside Jerusalem. "And let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto." No matter what people may say of the necessity of any keeping their feast, their path of safety is to avoid Jerusalem. There is no deliverance for Israel yet. "For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled."
"Luke, it will be observed, does not say, This is the time of trouble, such as was not since the beginning of the world. There is the most surprising perfectness of expression. […]"
[end quoting; source: Bible Hub, William Kelly Commentary, on Daniel 12]
https://biblehub.com/commentaries/kelly/daniel/12.htm
Thanks for sorting that out in regards to where you are at - the Dominionist "theology" to me is off the rails, not sure if any one has done a thread critiquing it.
Thanks for the feedback delirious, FP is challenging to other peoples with deeply held eschatologies.
lol, ask about http://penelope.uchicago.edu/josephus/war-2.html and the mark among the FP camp and see if it's foggy grey or black and white...
Yo Bro - Penelope doesn't make any mention of FP as far as I can tell lol.. It's just ol' Jose again.
O
obedienttogod
Guest
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Nope, Rome was about war.
This is just the time period before, during, and after Yeshua:
1st century[edit]
- Battle of the Teutoburg Forest (9) – German leader Arminius ambushes three Roman legions under Publius Quinctilius Varus.
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Weser_River
- Battle of the Weser River (16) - Legions under Germanicus defeat German tribes of Arminius.
- show
Roman conquest of Britain (43-96)
- show
Boudica's uprising (60-61)
- show
First Jewish–Roman War (66-73) [1]
- show
Domitian's Dacian War (87-88)
I do think that the old kingdom on Earth and of earthly substance was judged in the days of old, I think this because Jesus Christ stated as He came and as He went He stated that warning of what He was bringing with Him and what would come following it after He went.
Nothing in the Word of God changes through out all its times down here, there realy is nothing new under the sun down here when it comes to the Word of God. All is kept for an example unto all even the Christians were warned about the costs of receiving its Grace while turning and looking for greater than that Grace that was given unto them, even citing the example made of the earthly kingdom of old that was destroyed and removed from the Earth.
Over long periods of time people drift off through it and with it, not all do while many others do, being caught up in the changes or shifts of their culture they live in and the pressures of conformity from it, even the lure of its offerings from secular presenters of it, they take with them what Word they still held onto and there it is applied by others choices of applying it to instead something other they chose, since they rather it be applied to what they rather have it applied to for their own ratherings alone and those ratherings favor their own interpretations of its definition. They define by opinion what it solid as a rock and defines its self in the old and in the new while never changing its definition at all. It instead confirms its Word and Way in which it meant by the Old it confirms its Way in the New and never changed its Way or Word only fulfilled it and delivered it.
As far as the judgment of the earthy kingdom of old it was not a thing that had not happened before, there was an example in its past that stood to be a guide for all to go by even then in its time of judgment, none how knew the Word of old and kept it could be without understanding its actual Words in that Word and its Way it all was carried out in their past days.
It was not Peter the man who was the Rock, it was his confession and in that his testimony unto that Rock he believed in, yet, people apply it to Peter as though The Rock is Peter and stand Peter up to build in and upon, truthful or not people do take it that way.
The Rock as defined as to who it is in the old.
Deuteronomy 32:4
He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.
The same it was for the judgment and to wrath that follows it was.
Matthew 10:34
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
Revelation 6:4
And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.
They have corrupted themselves, their spot is not the spot of his children: they are a perverse and crooked generation.
Matthew 17:17
Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me.
John 18:36
Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight,
that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Acts 3:14
But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
Acts 3:15
And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
These things happened before as well in the old and went the same course for it other than more was set aside to come a last time without any further continuance of the old that was to be removed and the new be the Way from then on out as promised it would come and do just that.
Isaiah 59:20
And the Redeemer shall come to Zion, and unto them that turn from transgression in Jacob, saith the LORD.
Isaiah 59:19
So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.
Deuteronomy 32:5
They have corrupted themselves, their spot is not the spot of his children: they are a perverse and crooked generation.
Matthew 17:17
Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me.
Acts 2:40
And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Acts 2:39
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Colossians 1:26
Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
Colossians 1:27
To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
Colossians 1:28
Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:
John 8:19
Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.
John 8:20
These words He spoke in the treasury, as He taught in the temple; and no one seized Him, because His hour had not yet come.
John 8:21
Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come.
The example already written and recorded of this situation at hand when unseen coming Christ Jesus came not seen and covered with the clouding when he left. The Gospel its was hidden an as of mystery unto those who already rejected it.
Today people still wait for Elijah to come when already did through John The Baptist who also was put to death.
Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Matthew 11:12
And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
1 Kings 18:9
And he said, What have I sinned, that thou wouldest deliver thy servant into the hand of Ahab, to slay me?
1 Kings 18:10
As the LORD thy God liveth, there is no nation or kingdom, whither my lord hath not sent to seek thee: and when they said, He is not there; he took an oath of the kingdom and nation, that they found thee not.
1 Kings 18:11
And now thou sayest, Go, tell thy lord, Behold, Elijah is here.
1 Kings 18:12
And it shall come to pass, as soon as I am gone from thee, that the Spirit of the LORD shall carry thee whither I know not; and so when I come and tell Ahab, and he cannot find thee, he shall slay me: but I thy servant fear the LORD from my youth.
Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Matthew 11:12
And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
Matthew 11:13
For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
Matthew 11:14
And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.
Matthew 11:15
He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Revelation 2:11
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
Luke 8:8
And other fell on good ground, and sprang up, and bare fruit an hundredfold. And when he had said these things, he cried, He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
1 Kings 18:13
Was it not told my lord what I did when Jezebel slew the prophets of the LORD, how I hid an hundred men of the LORD'S prophets by fifty in a cave, and fed them with bread and water?
Matthew 10:40
He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Luke 10:16
He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.
There was bloodshed and violence spreading forth in Noah's days as the people were decreasing and mingling in a spreading forth or the diverse from them ones.
It was there from the beginning with Cain who murdered his brother who did not see things the way Cain did and take up Cain's argument as his own.
It was there in the kindgom of all that was destroyed and the people carried away in its flood of judgment.
Even as Christians we still have to head the warning of such ways of the man of this world and flesh and not go that way with them.
Nothing in the Word of God changes through out all its times down here, there realy is nothing new under the sun down here when it comes to the Word of God. All is kept for an example unto all even the Christians were warned about the costs of receiving its Grace while turning and looking for greater than that Grace that was given unto them, even citing the example made of the earthly kingdom of old that was destroyed and removed from the Earth.
Over long periods of time people drift off through it and with it, not all do while many others do, being caught up in the changes or shifts of their culture they live in and the pressures of conformity from it, even the lure of its offerings from secular presenters of it, they take with them what Word they still held onto and there it is applied by others choices of applying it to instead something other they chose, since they rather it be applied to what they rather have it applied to for their own ratherings alone and those ratherings favor their own interpretations of its definition. They define by opinion what it solid as a rock and defines its self in the old and in the new while never changing its definition at all. It instead confirms its Word and Way in which it meant by the Old it confirms its Way in the New and never changed its Way or Word only fulfilled it and delivered it.
As far as the judgment of the earthy kingdom of old it was not a thing that had not happened before, there was an example in its past that stood to be a guide for all to go by even then in its time of judgment, none how knew the Word of old and kept it could be without understanding its actual Words in that Word and its Way it all was carried out in their past days.
It was not Peter the man who was the Rock, it was his confession and in that his testimony unto that Rock he believed in, yet, people apply it to Peter as though The Rock is Peter and stand Peter up to build in and upon, truthful or not people do take it that way.
The Rock as defined as to who it is in the old.
Deuteronomy 32:4
He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.
The same it was for the judgment and to wrath that follows it was.
Matthew 10:34
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
Revelation 6:4
And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.
They have corrupted themselves, their spot is not the spot of his children: they are a perverse and crooked generation.
Matthew 17:17
Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me.
John 18:36
Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight,
that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Acts 3:14
But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
Acts 3:15
And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
These things happened before as well in the old and went the same course for it other than more was set aside to come a last time without any further continuance of the old that was to be removed and the new be the Way from then on out as promised it would come and do just that.
Isaiah 59:20
And the Redeemer shall come to Zion, and unto them that turn from transgression in Jacob, saith the LORD.
Isaiah 59:19
So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.
Deuteronomy 32:5
They have corrupted themselves, their spot is not the spot of his children: they are a perverse and crooked generation.
Matthew 17:17
Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me.
Acts 2:40
And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Acts 2:39
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Colossians 1:26
Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
Colossians 1:27
To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
Colossians 1:28
Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:
John 8:19
Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.
John 8:20
These words He spoke in the treasury, as He taught in the temple; and no one seized Him, because His hour had not yet come.
John 8:21
Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come.
The example already written and recorded of this situation at hand when unseen coming Christ Jesus came not seen and covered with the clouding when he left. The Gospel its was hidden an as of mystery unto those who already rejected it.
Today people still wait for Elijah to come when already did through John The Baptist who also was put to death.
Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Matthew 11:12
And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
1 Kings 18:9
And he said, What have I sinned, that thou wouldest deliver thy servant into the hand of Ahab, to slay me?
1 Kings 18:10
As the LORD thy God liveth, there is no nation or kingdom, whither my lord hath not sent to seek thee: and when they said, He is not there; he took an oath of the kingdom and nation, that they found thee not.
1 Kings 18:11
And now thou sayest, Go, tell thy lord, Behold, Elijah is here.
1 Kings 18:12
And it shall come to pass, as soon as I am gone from thee, that the Spirit of the LORD shall carry thee whither I know not; and so when I come and tell Ahab, and he cannot find thee, he shall slay me: but I thy servant fear the LORD from my youth.
Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Matthew 11:12
And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
Matthew 11:13
For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
Matthew 11:14
And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.
Matthew 11:15
He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Revelation 2:11
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
Luke 8:8
And other fell on good ground, and sprang up, and bare fruit an hundredfold. And when he had said these things, he cried, He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
1 Kings 18:13
Was it not told my lord what I did when Jezebel slew the prophets of the LORD, how I hid an hundred men of the LORD'S prophets by fifty in a cave, and fed them with bread and water?
Matthew 10:40
He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Luke 10:16
He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.
There was bloodshed and violence spreading forth in Noah's days as the people were decreasing and mingling in a spreading forth or the diverse from them ones.
It was there from the beginning with Cain who murdered his brother who did not see things the way Cain did and take up Cain's argument as his own.
It was there in the kindgom of all that was destroyed and the people carried away in its flood of judgment.
Even as Christians we still have to head the warning of such ways of the man of this world and flesh and not go that way with them.
I debunked your threads then, and I can debunk this one too!
Just the fact that you say "it was fulfilled, but we dont know exactly what the mark of the beast was or who the man of sin was" PROVES that those never happened. If it had happened, WE WOULD KNOW ABOUT IT, clearly, undisputed!
As brother Ahwatukee pointed out earlier in this thread: here is how it works:
A: Prophecy is made:
B: Prophecy is fulfilled.
For example: Messiah riding to town on a donkey -> fulfilled!
Not like this: Messiah riding to town on a donkey -> Never fulfilled, maybe, we dont know, but it was fulfilled probably, maybe donkey symbolizes something, who knows.
If there is no certain fulfillment of it, then its YET TO BE FULFILLED. Coming up soon!
Apparently you haven't read Judges, Samuel, Kings, Chronicles, Jeremiah, or Ezekiel.
Every single time that any enemy was permitted to attack Israel, it was all about the judgment of God. Jesus Himself prophesied the destruction of the temple as the judgment of God. He continually warned the people of impending judgment.
No the events didn't happen people still are possessed Satan isn't in the Jesus jail so that is contradicting