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Not By Works
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...During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission. Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him and was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek. Hebrews 5:7-10
Why? Ask Paul not me.
...We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. The man who says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is A LIAR, and THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM. But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him MUST WALK AS JESUS DID. 1 John 2:3-6
Why?...ask John, not me.
...in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit. Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. The mind of sinful man is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God. Romans 8:4-14
...Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers.
Galatians 6:7-10
Why again?...ask Paul, not me.
... Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?” “Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.” Matthew 19:16-17
Still asking why...ask Jesus whom you CLAIM as your LORD or MASTER but you treat Him as your SERVANT.
...“Why do you call me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say? Luke 6:46
...“You have said harsh things against me,” says the Lord. “Yet you ask, ‘What have we said against you?’ “You have said, ‘It is futile to serve God. What did we gain by carrying out his requirements and going about like mourners before the Lord Almighty? But now we call the arrogant blessed. Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape.’” Then those who feared the Lord talked with each other, and the Lord listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the Lord and honored his name. “They will be mine,” says the Lord Almighty, “in the day when I make up my treasured possession. I will spare them, just as in compassion a man spares his son who serves him. And you will again see the distinction between the righteous and the wicked, between those who serve God and those who do not.
Malachi 3:13-18
Now if you're still asking why, take Paul's brotherly advise to you.
...All of us who are mature should take such a view of things. And if on some point you think differently, that too God will make clear to you. Only let us live up to what we have already attained. Philippians 3:15-16
And King Solomon's WISDOM concludes:
...Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole duty of man. For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every hidden thing, whether it is good or evil. Ecclesiastes 12:13-14
An observation. Sheep get killed by wolves, lions, bears. Wonder from the protection of the shepherd and bad things
happen.
Fear. These guys hate the idea that walking away from Christ is fear of loss or harm, and fear is sin, unbelief, so the
wandering sheep cannot die, but even in death the Lord is with them.
So even a picture of the tragic death of a strayed believer, is too much. What does scripture say
My brothers, if one of you should wander from the truth and someone should bring him back, remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of his way will save him from death and cover over a multitude of sins
James 5:19-20
The fallen away brother is lost and doomed to death and judgement, until they are brought back.
Sounds like a lost sheep can die lost. Not actually what these guys want to hear, maybe, but it is there.
This parable is taken that all strayed sheep will be found and brought back.
Jesus is emphasising the effort a shepherd goes to find the lost.
Jesus has not brought back the lost sheep of Israel, and many potential disciples who walked away.
It is just a parable of intent, not a promise of security. The cornerstone of the parable is repentance
of the sheep, which if not achieved means the sheep is truly lost.
But when the heart is hard and cold, and desperate promises must be looked at only one way, the
hard reality is too big to face.
I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent.
Luke 15:7
Yes, this is what James big Brother taught him about lost sheep.
I post this scripture almost everyday.
It’s up to “someone”, not Jesus, to go after those who go astray.
James uses the same word as Jesus does in the parable of the lost sheep.
Sinner.
A brother who wanders from the truth has returned to being a sinner.
Lost.
- likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents
No one in their right mind would contend that the lost need to be saved.
Unfortunately, we have brothers and sisters in Christ, right here on this Forum who twist the truth and make excuses.
“What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing. And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and neighbors, saying to them, Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’ I say to you that likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance. Luke 15:4-7
The undeniable truth is, His sheep who wander away and become lost, are as sinners in need of repentance.
They are in danger of losing their soul to death.
- he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death
Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins. James 5:19-20
I just posted this scripture, in response to dc.
He never responds with truth, just derogatory statements.
JPT
The prodigal son is a good example.
Return to the Father in humility and confess your sin, asking for forgiveness.
If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9
JPT
Zechariah 11
Open your doors, Lebanon,
so that fire may devour your cedars!
Wail, you juniper, for the cedar has fallen;
the stately trees are ruined!
Wail, oaks of Bashan;
the dense forest has been cut down!
Listen to the wail of the shepherds;
their rich pastures are destroyed!
Listen to the roar of the lions;
the lush thicket of the Jordan is ruined!
so that fire may devour your cedars!
Wail, you juniper, for the cedar has fallen;
the stately trees are ruined!
Wail, oaks of Bashan;
the dense forest has been cut down!
Listen to the wail of the shepherds;
their rich pastures are destroyed!
Listen to the roar of the lions;
the lush thicket of the Jordan is ruined!
This is what the Lord my God says: “Shepherd the flock marked for slaughter. Their buyers slaughter them and go unpunished. Those who sell them say, ‘Praise the Lord, I am rich!’ Their own shepherds do not spare them. For I will no longer have pity on the people of the land,” declares the Lord. “I will give everyone into the hands of their neighbors and their king. They will devastate the land, and I will not rescue anyone from their hands.”
So I shepherded the flock marked for slaughter, particularly the oppressed of the flock. Then I took two staffs and called one Favor and the other Union, and I shepherded the flock. In one month I got rid of the three shepherds.
The flock detested me, and I grew weary of them and said, “I will not be your shepherd. Let the dying die, and the perishing perish. Let those who are left eat one another’s flesh.”
Then I took my staff called Favor and broke it, revoking the covenant I had made with all the nations. It was revoked on that day, and so the oppressed of the flock who were watching me knew it was the word of the Lord.
I told them, “If you think it best, give me my pay; but if not, keep it.” So they paid me thirty pieces of silver.
And the Lord said to me, “Throw it to the potter”—the handsome price at which they valued me! So I took the thirty pieces of silver and threw them to the potter at the house of the Lord.
Then I broke my second staff called Union, breaking the family bond between Judah and Israel.
Then the Lord said to me, “Take again the equipment of a foolish shepherd. For I am going to raise up a shepherd over the land who will not care for the lost, or seek the young, or heal the injured, or feed the healthy, but will eat the meat of the choice sheep, tearing off their hooves.
“Woe to the worthless shepherd,
who deserts the flock!
May the sword strike his arm and his right eye!
May his arm be completely withered,
his right eye totally blinded!”
who deserts the flock!
May the sword strike his arm and his right eye!
May his arm be completely withered,
his right eye totally blinded!”
Exactly.
Matthew records more of an explanation from Jesus about His instructions of going after a brother who sins.
“What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep, and one of them goes astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine and go to the mountains to seek the one that is straying? And if he should find it, assuredly, I say to you, he rejoices more over that sheep than over the ninety-nine that did not go astray. Even so it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones should perish. “Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector. Matthew 18:12-17
Here is the process that Jesus gave to restoring a wayward brother.
- Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.
- But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’
- And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.
Consider him as a heathen and tax collector is clear.
JPT
He said to him again a second time, “Simon, son of Jonah, do you love Me?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Tend My sheep.” John 21:16
JPT
Any wonder why we are warned that the mark cant be forgiven, and that rejecting the Holy Spirit, the only sin that cant be forgiven, and most Christian don't get it the same thing? Well I wont be here then! Well how come your still here? Why have you not left, already. "Its no longer I that lives but Christ." If your still trapped inside the box of your understanding, that's why your still here, not identified in the death of Christ. The mark of the enemy is being filled with violence: if your still here your still vulnerable.
The only Way of escape is in the Will of God: To live as Jesus lived:
"Consider all Joy, Pray without ceasing, in everything give thanks, for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you."
The reference for the mark of the enemy:
"Because of the abundance of your trade, you sinned and became filled with violence." cut and paste on google for context of the fall.
If you believe your taken away before this happens more and more, I suggest leaving, "Now is the accepted time of salvation."
As members of His body, Life is no longer about me. There is hidden meaning in parables through the bible, more than you and I know, so much so that "If any man thinks he knows, he doesn't know as he should." Jesus is saved, "I have the power to lay down My Life and I have the power to take it up again."
Understanding doesn't get you there. This is about abiding in Him: Love as Jesus Loved. Shure there will be those saved through the fire, and if you want to call that saved, people in Romans 2 will be in that group as well, people from all walks of life who have not rejected the Holy Spirit poured out on all flesh. "As much as you have done it to the least of my brethren you did it to me." its about being One Spirit with God, walking in perfect Love that delivers us from all fear. The Holy Spirit carries us, while we are absent from the body but present with the Lord. Hey I though you were the one that did not want to be here when trouble comes? Do you realise we can be going in circles in the wilderness and not entering in. "Strive to enter in at the straight gate, for many I say to you shall seek to enter in and shall not be able." Depends what your satisfied to call salvation. ""For this cause we both labour (work) and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God who is the saviour of all men, especially of them that believe.
Many Babes in Christ in Christ believe they have arrived, they have been thought this. They arrived at the Saviour of all men, but did not follow Him in His sufferings to cease from sin, wanting their life back. I have been there and was still in God's hands but not having overcome the world obviously, not even a friend of God. As you can tell I'm a poor teacher: barely becoming a friend of God. You may not care for if, it requires work to get past yourself, but we all suffer whether a follower or a babe no longer getting his way.
*Notice - Brethren, if anyone "among" you wanders from the truth..turns a "sinner" from the error of his way.. Some would argue that James says this one who turned from the truth was a "sinner," and was "among" but "not of" the Brethren, then he wasn’t previously saved. That fits 1 John 2:19 - They went out "from" us, but they were "not of" us..
IF this person was a genuine believer, yet how do we know for sure this is the second death in the lake of fire? In Matthew 26:38, Jesus said: "My soul [psuche] is deeply grieved, to the point of death." Jesus was not saying that His soul was deeply grieved to the point of spiritual death, Rather, Jesus was talking about physical death, his human life. In Revelation 16:3, "The second angel poured out his bowl into the sea, and it became blood like that of a dead man; and every living soul [psuche] in the sea died". In 1 Peter 3:20 "... God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, [psuche-souls] were brought safely (saved from drowning, physical death) through the water" by the ark (Hebrews 11:7).
"Soul" is rendered from the Greek word "psuche" and is also translated as "life". The word "psuche" is never translated as "spirit." In 1 Corinthians 5:5, we read - I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, (physical death) so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus (no second death).
Jesus covered our sins in one way (Romans 4:7) by bringing forgiveness for all believers, yet sins can also be covered in a different way. In Proverbs 10:12, we read: Hatred stirs up strife, But love covers all sins. In 1 Peter 4:8, we read: And above all things have fervent love for one another, for "love will cover a multitude of sins." Where there is strife, there is hatred and unless love prevails, the strife will get worse. Love covers offenses and sins when a believer turns back from error.
So is this wanderer a professing Christian, whose faith is not genuine, or a sinning Christian, who needs to be restored? For the former, the death spoken of in vs. 20 is the "second death" (Revelation 21:8); for the latter, it is physical death (1 Corinthians 11:29-32; 1 John 5:16).
Not leather bound, but in very decent shape.....I am in a good mood.....if I had a way to give it to you I would......add it to your collection....I took it down from my book shelf to make more room and was going to use it for fire starters HAH and thought I better check this one..
It's you who continues to twist the truth in cynical fashion. In context, we see that Jesus is directing this parable to the Pharisees and scribes who complained, saying that Jesus receives sinners and eats with them, while failing to recognize because of pride and self righteousness that they were sinners themselves. The main point of this parable is not that a Christian lost their salvation and had to regain it back again, but the absolute importance of finding the one lost sheep -- there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance.
You try to make this parable teach that this one "sheep" in this case was a saved person who lost their salvation and had to get saved all over again, but to no avail. You conveniently forget what Jesus said in Matthew 5:5 - These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: “Do not go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans. 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
In Luke 19:10, we read - for the Son of Man has come to seek and to save that which was lost. Not lost their salvation and had to get saved all over again. Your alleged undeniable truth is inconclusive and biased.
Why is it so hard to understand that it was not rejecting the Holy Spirit....it was believing that the work Christ was doing was not by the power of the Holy Spirit, but rather the power of the devil......<-----UNBELIEF into CHRIST............geesh...ONE that WILL not believe....THEY CANNOT be forgiven because FORGIVENESS is found IN NO OTHER!!!!!!!!
U
UnderGrace
Guest
Salvation cannot be undone once a person has believed.
Suffering for or like Jesus does not save.
The saved person has entered through the straight gate.
If we could live as Jesus lived why did He come to earth?
Suffering for or like Jesus does not save.
The saved person has entered through the straight gate.
If we could live as Jesus lived why did He come to earth?
"deceiving" - are you scared of being deceived, of not having the truth, of only listening to the right
preachers or the right ideas? Then welcome to self deception city.
The church used to ban books based on their censorship and only the right books got approved.
The cornerstone of the revolution in our society was the printing press, the ability to say what you want
and tell people about it. Of course what was told normal made sense and was informative else what was
the point of printing it. Our whole faith, churches, schools, science, technology rely on this very principle.
And the bed rock is Jesus, who we listen to and follow. He is our guide, so ask Him.
Got a problem, ask Jesus and look at what He said and what His solutions are. Let His word dwell constantly
in your heart and mind. For He is the bread of life, the very sustenance of our souls and Spirits in God.
Jesus believed in this ministry so much, He told His disciples to listen to the Holy Spirit who would teach them
about everything. Things have not changed. Let God teach you, listen to Him, dwell in Him, praise and worship
Him with a repentant hearts, confessing ones sins and asking for help through our weaknesses.
And if the unbelievers, false teachers and heretics want to say this is evil and wrong, then you know who they
are.
And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven.
Nor are you to be called 'teacher,' for you have one Teacher, the Christ.
Matt 23:9-10
I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear.
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.
He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you.
All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you.
John 16:12-15
The Holy Spirit dwells within each repentant believer and through the word He teaches us.
I don't believe that satan himself enters anyone Bill. I did take a course on demonology. Something I didn't know until the course is that satan and the fallen angels are in the 2nd heaven. Demons are body less spirits from the first age.
They cannot enter the spirit of believers, but can torment the soulish part of us. Like the spirit of depression.
You can't medicate a demon.
Thanks for your generosity, I have a hardback copy but always looking to upgrade to leather for my collection. I certainly wouldn't start fires with It. LOL. I'D say it's worth $20.....leather $80-$100......I used to work for a Bible bookstore that had a large used book section. I bought libraries from retired preachers For the store.......I sure miss them days
I don't want to cause any fear in any of us here so I'll also give the way of protection from torment.
The Word of God. The first line of defense is praise.
The Word of God. The first line of defense is praise.