Not By Works

[Goodnewsman]

The truth is that the deceiver has been deceiving from the beginning until now.

These deceivers will REJECT and NULLIFY the Word and believe the deceiving spirits.(Isaiah 5:20-24, Mark 7:6-13)

...while evil men and impostors will go from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. 2 Timothy 3:13

...THE SPIRIT CLEARLY SAYS that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through HYPOCRITICAL LIARS, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. 1 Timothy 4:1-2

How would we know who were the ones that were deceived?

We know that Eve was deceived when she believed the deceiver and disobeyed God's command.

Who are the deceivers and who were deceived?

..But, dear friends, remember what the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ foretold. 18 They said to you, “In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires.” 19 These are the men who divide you, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit.

...At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come. For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. Matthew 24:10‭-‬14‭, ‬24

...For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants also masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve. 2 Corinthians 11:13‭-‬15

And those that were deceived believed in the deceivers mentioned above and disobeyed God's commands because they were made to believe that they would not surely die, IOW, "always saved". But scriptures warn us not to be deceived;

...Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient. Therefore do not be partners with them. Ephesians 5:6‭-‬7

...Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?” The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’ ” “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. “For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”... Genesis 3:1‭-‬19

Just think what could have happened if Eve did not believe the serpents deception but OBEYED God instead. ...NO NEED TO DISCUSS SALVATION FOR SURE because no one needs to be saved.

The truth is that Adam and Eve were created according to the image of God's righteousness and holiness and they BELIEVE and OBEY God until they got DECEIVED and disobeyed God. If they were deceived, why can't you?

Did God warn us about the deception? If He did, then why refuse to take heed of them?

So who would say now that OBEDIENCE TO GOD HAS NO BEARING IN SALVATION?

AMEN!!!!!! very good post

 

[Goodnewsman]

can you prove this from the scripture?

because in my life, there are those whom i cannot help but love; of whom it is impossible for me to 'choose not to love' -- if i cannot choose to not love them how could i have ever chosen to love them?

if you need someone to convince you that love must have a choice, then i'm sorry but i cant help you man

 

[UnderGrace]

No I do not believe it can take years to truly love God. You think your quotes refer to truly loving God? Forget the greek, just kneel in humility every time you want to read the bible and ask the truth to be revealed to you of what you read by the only one who can lead you into truth. He does not depend on working through the greek to teach you

For some people it can take years, for others maybe not, but it can hindered in believers.

Some people have a very steady walk, others do not.

Why do you guys always want to cut everyone from the exact same cloth, if every Christians performs so perfectly the way you insist we pretty much have to come to the conclusion that those at Corinth were not Christians.

 

[dcontroversal]

the only reason i mentioned the years i've been in the ministry was your laughing telling me i wasn't qualified to talk scriptures. Remember?

I have just caught you in a contradiction. you say my "god" must be very very weak or a liar or he cannot keep his word????

when i was 18 yrs old i was born again and God graciously saved me (i felt like 100 pds lifted from my shoulder) etc......

I THOUGHT YOU BELIEVED THAT I COULD NEVER LOSE MY SALVATION????? WHICH IS IT??? IF YOUR TELLING ME THAT MY god IS NOW A WEAK, LIAR YOUR IN CONTRADICTION TO WHAT YOU SAY YOU BELIEVE

I'M NOT I YOUR BROTHER IN CHRIST???????

1 John 3:14
14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.

I contradicted nothing.......and I stand by what I said....if you believe salvation can be lost, your god must be weak, ineffectual or a liar that cannot keep his word.......I see you left off ALL of the referenced truths that I listed...............hilarious

 

[unclesilas]

For some people it can take years, for others maybe not, but it can hindered in believers.

Some people have a very steady walk, others do not.

Why do you guys always want to cut everyone from the exact same cloth, if every Christians performs so perfectly the way you insist we pretty much have to come to the conclusion that those at Corinth were not Christians.

When did I insist Christians have to perform so perfectly?
There is a big difference you know between living a sinfull lifestyle and performing perfectly

 

[UnderGrace]

When did I insist Christians have to perform so perfectly?
There is a big difference you know between living a sinfull lifestyle and performing perfectly

So which sin does Jesus not atone for?

 

[unclesilas]

For some people it can take years, for others maybe not, but it can hindered in believers.

Some people have a very steady walk, others do not.

Why do you guys always want to cut everyone from the exact same cloth, if every Christians performs so perfectly the way you insist we pretty much have to come to the conclusion that those at Corinth were not Christians.

BTW
As I told you, I love your scripture verse, one of the most understated verses in the bible in my view.

 

[dcontroversal]

No I do not believe it can take years to truly love God. You think your quotes refer to truly loving God? Forget the greek, just kneel in humility every time you want to read the bible and ask the truth to be revealed to you of what you read by the only one who can lead you into truth. He does not depend on working through the greek to teach you

YEP, what ALL deceivers do....reject the truth and come back with some flippant answer........par for the course....I guess that next you will tell me God did not inspire the N.T. in Koine Greek hey..........faith comes by hearing and hearing by the WORD pal............and if we CANNOT trust and believe the word of GOD......we are ALL toast

You never answered....what religion are you

 

[Goodnewsman]

...As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead. James 2:26

...teaching them to OBEY WHATEVER I HAVE COMMANDED YOU… Matthew 28:18-20

...And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and TO LOVE one another as he commanded us.1 John 3:23

...And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love. 2 John 1:6

...For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ NOT ONLY TO BELIEVE ON HIM, but also to suffer for him, Philippians 1:29

How can those who CLAIM to be saved thru Faith ALONE suffer for Christ if they believe and insist that no works of any sort is needed, but to believe/faith ALONE is sufficient to be saved.

Does a person who teaches obedience to God cause another person to sin by doing so?

Would any person who don't have FAITH in God teach obedience to God? Or would the deceiver be TEACHING obedience to God as a deception? Would he not rather teach DISOBEDIENCE in His attempt to deceive the believers?

Is it not those who condemn those who teach obedience to God who DOES NOT HAVE FAITH in God and CAUSES A PERSON TO SIN?

Is it not that sin is the transgression of the law?(1 john 3:4)

Is it obedience to God to break the law?

Did the Holy servants of God such as the prophets and the apostles OBEYED and taught OBEDIENCE to God?

Who then causes another person to sin?

...At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?” 2 He called a little child and had him stand among them. 3 And he said: “I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 “And whoever welcomes a little child like this in my name welcomes me. 6 But IF ANYONE CAUSES ONE OF THESE LITTLE ONES WHO “BELIEVE” IN ME TO SIN, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea. 7 “Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to sin! Such things must come, but WOE TO THE MAN THROUGH WHOM THEY COME FROM! 8 If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be THROWN INTO ETERNAL FIRE. 9 And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be THROWN INTO THE FIRE OF HELL. matthew 18:1-9

...We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. 4 The man who says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: 6 Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did. 1 john 2:3-6

...But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.” Revelation 21:8

...Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things GOD'S WRATH COMES ON THOSE WHO ARE DISOBEDIENT. ephesians 5:6[

AMEN!!!! peter talks about those who are "willingly ignorant"
i believe some are caught up in this osas doctrine because they love to sin and anyone telling them its not ok to do so is an offense to them

 

[unclesilas]

So which sin does Jesus not atone for?

He died for all your sins, past, present and future. And in the knowledge of that, the true power of sin is broken in your life, remember Romans6:14
But though Paul preached you have no righteousness/justification of not committing sin, he still warned believers of the severe consequences of living a lifestyle of sin. I am still hoping an osas proponent will explain to me why their is no contradiction there

 

[unclesilas]

YEP, what ALL deceivers do....reject the truth and come back with some flippant answer........par for the course....I guess that next you will tell me God did not inspire the N.T. in Koine Greek hey..........faith comes by hearing and hearing by the WORD pal............and if we CANNOT trust and believe the word of GOD......we are ALL toast

You never answered....what religion are you

Lets see how well the greek has taught you
Why are sinfull passions aroused in people by the law if they live under it? Romans7:5
Why is the power of sin the law? 1Cor15:56
Why shall sin not be your master for you are not under law but under grace? Rom6:14

 

[UnderGrace]

He died for all your sins, past, present and future. And in the knowledge of that, the true power of sin is broken in your life, remember Romans6:14
But though Paul preached you have no righteousness/justification of not committing sin, he still warned believers of the severe consequences of living a lifestyle of sin. I am still hoping an osas proponent will explain to me why their is no contradiction there

Which sin causes you to loose your salvation?

 

[calibob]

if you need someone to convince you that love must have a choice, then i'm sorry but i cant help you man

Sometimes real love must be tough love! Example: "I'm hurting. I just want to escape for a while." "No man, you've got to deal with it now before it gets out of hand." Sometimes love hurts, get over it.

 

[unclesilas]

You never answered....what religion are you

Im of the following religion. As you have read the greek, please fully explain it to me and the reality of what it means in the Christians life. Thanks:

This is the covenant I will make with them
after that time, says the Lord.
I will put my laws in their hearts,
and I will write them on their minds.’[b]

17 Then he adds:

‘Their sins and lawless acts
I will remember no more. Heb10:16&17

 

[UnderGrace]

BTW
As I told you, I love your scripture verse, one of the most understated verses in the bible in my view.

Yes I did read that, I agree, too bad you cannot discern that it drives a stake right through conditional salvation and reveals its fallacy

 

[dcontroversal]

AMEN!!!! peter talks about those who are "willingly ignorant"
i believe some are caught up in this osas doctrine because they love to sin and anyone telling them its not ok to do so is an offense to them

HAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAH I have not seen one take a statement so far out of context to peddle a false, dishonest statement.....how can you stand behind a pulpit and preach to people while being so dishonest with the word of GOD?

NO honesty, no shame and no truth.........you should stand up tomorrow night and apologize and resign for being so dishonest with the word

The above bolded statement and then ensuing opinion = no honesty whatsoever at all....

 

[unclesilas]

Which sin causes you to loose your salvation?

Ive just told you, Jesus died for all your sins, past, present and future. If you want a list of things that can bar you from the kingdom of heaven, just read Gal5:19-21

 

[dcontroversal]

Im of the following religion. As you have read the greek, please fully explain it to me and the reality of what it means in the Christians life. Thanks:

This is the covenant I will make with them
after that time, says the Lord.
I will put my laws in their hearts,
and I will write them on their minds.’[b]

17 Then he adds:

‘Their sins and lawless acts
I will remember no more. Heb10:16&17

Nice sidestep..............

 

[UnderGrace]

AMEN!!!! peter talks about those who are "willingly ignorant"
i believe some are caught up in this osas doctrine because they love to sin and anyone telling them its not ok to do so is an offense to them

Completely false and slanderous!!!

 

[unclesilas]

Yes I did read that, I agree, too bad you cannot discern that it drives a stake right through conditional salvation and reveals its fallacy

Does it? Explain the verse to me. Why will sin not be your master for you are not under law but under grace?