Goodnewsman, the doctrine of perserverance, when taught rightly has not strengthened the hands of the wicked. Unfortunately, it has been twisted and perverted by people who say that you can have saving faith that is what James describes as dead faith
Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Goodnewsman, the doctrine of perserverance, when taught rightly has not strengthened the hands of the wicked. Unfortunately, it has been twisted and perverted by people who say that you can have saving faith that is what James describes as dead faith
N
NoNameMcgee
Guest
john 10
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
________
1 peter
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
________
Romans 11:
29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
_______
John 6:36-40
36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
________
1 peter
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
________
Romans 11:
29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
_______
John 6:36-40
36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
All of the promises of Christ, verbiage, context, power of Christ, word of God that must be chunked and or twisted beyond the truth in order for one to peddle a losable salvation is beyond sickening.......the few on this thread peddling that crap are going to be the same ones that find themselves in the many group at the end of the day...they do not really trust JESUS....I can say this because they interject themselves and what they do in order to remain saved....that is not biblical salvation
MANY will say, LORD LORD have WE NOT (KEPT ourselves saved)........good luck with that............
(oh, I never said they never come back. I said you talk about prodigals that never come back)
ANd you called me false for quoting you.
lolololololololololol!!!!
how is it a bad analogy?
you talk about bearing fruit. then, when presented with a real life question about a tree bearing fruit ( in this case, a nut, but same thing). you have a short circuit and just yell " BIBLE ".
one more chance- is the pecan tree still a pecan tree, even though it did not bear fruit last season, and if so, why?
Define "repent."
If it's ask "forgiveness" for sins - then no. All sin has already been forgiven, so what's the point of continually asking for forgiveness?
If it's "confess" sins to God - then yes. It's good relationally and as a means of sanctification.
If it's "turn" from sin - good luck. Nobody but Jesus has managed to do that.
If any of the above is as a means to maintain salvation - then absolutely not.
Yes, it is still a pecan tree but it is a bad analogy, because the Bible teaches that ALL TRUE BELIEVERS BEAR FRUIT.
And the tree analogy is not mine, it is JESUS' analogy. SO if you have an issue with it, take it up with Him.
And to say a believer can be born again (DC was talking about seed and sprout) for three years and never bear fruit is hard to swallow, because love is a fruit, and He who loves not, knows not God.
a believer can backslide and become unfruitful, but DC was talking about initial salvation.
God lies post 596
What does this mean? They are in a saved state, but didnt make a commitment?
WHICH IS IT!`?
yes, it is still a pecan tree.
now, why?
and yes Jesus said believers will bear fruit. but, he did not say exactly how much and how often. He made s general statement.
Why? Because He is the root and we are the branches
how often?
Do you fluctuate between love and not love?[/QUOTE]
yes, He is the root, we the branches,
but, this was my point- the pecan tree, though it did not bear any fruit last season, is still a pecan tree because it is still rooted.
so, you see, you just contradicted your own theology- a Christian is a Christian if they truly believe in Christ, even though they may not bear fruit every season, just as my pecan tree is still a pecan tree , even though it did not bear fruit last season.
thank you for proving you wrong.
I have studied and been a christian for a DECADE and I would still consider myself a ROOKIE at best! My mind isnt made up on many subjects and im still LOOKING INTO THEM. From all points of view.
Saying 75% of your church is "RESCUED" from other baptist churches means either two things: Either these were some garbage baptist churches and you rescued them to sound-doctrine, OR you are just creeping in UNAWARES and taking the sheep and indoctrinating with some UNSOUND doctrine.
THE LORD KNOWS!
yes, He is the root, we the branches,
but, this was my point- the pecan tree, though it did not bear any fruit last season, is still a pecan tree because it is still rooted.
so, you see, you just contradicted your own theology- a Christian is a Christian if they truly believe in Christ, even though they may not bear fruit every season, just as my pecan tree is still a pecan tree , even though it did not bear fruit last season.
thank you for proving you wrong.[/QUOTE]
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Simple question...do you believe that a person can get saved and then not bear ANY fruit for the first three years of their salvation?
Yes or no
Then go read post 596 of God lied.
this is the question that was under discussion when you came in.
and it's funny that you were so shocked at the thought that you said "SHOW ME ONE POST WHERE SOMEONE SAID THAT". You couldn't even believe that someone would say such a thing. But now, you are defending it. Because now you realize that it was the infallible DC that said it, and the Deceiver Maccabeus who is refuting it.
I know according to dcon I'm idiotic for asking this question but here we go anyhow:
1.) Why does our advasary, the devil (not me dcon, lol) continue attacking us? 1 Peter 5
2) if Satan believed we were eternally secured unconditionally why would he waste his time?
3) why does Ephesians 6 tell is to put on the whole armour of God and we are in a warfare?
The Bible mentions the book of Life 4 times. 3 of the 4 it talks of blotting out your name from it. If this isn't possible why did God warn us about it?
Many on here said ananias and Sapphira went to heaven even after lying to the Holy ghost and falling dead. Is that not a contradiction to Rev 21?
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 21:8 KJV
1.) Why does our advasary, the devil (not me dcon, lol) continue attacking us? 1 Peter 5
2) if Satan believed we were eternally secured unconditionally why would he waste his time?
3) why does Ephesians 6 tell is to put on the whole armour of God and we are in a warfare?
The Bible mentions the book of Life 4 times. 3 of the 4 it talks of blotting out your name from it. If this isn't possible why did God warn us about it?
Many on here said ananias and Sapphira went to heaven even after lying to the Holy ghost and falling dead. Is that not a contradiction to Rev 21?
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 21:8 KJV
yes, He is the root, we the branches,
but, this was my point- the pecan tree, though it did not bear any fruit last season, is still a pecan tree because it is still rooted.
so, you see, you just contradicted your own theology- a Christian is a Christian if they truly believe in Christ, even though they may not bear fruit every season, just as my pecan tree is still a pecan tree , even though it did not bear fruit last season.
thank you for proving you wrong.[/QUOTE]
Repeat for your attention...
and it's funny that you were so shocked at the thought that you said "SHOW ME ONE POST WHERE SOMEONE SAID THAT". You couldn't even believe that someone would say such a thing. But now, you are defending it. Because now you realize that it was the infallible DC that said it, and the Deceiver Maccabeus who is refuting it.
Repeat...
and it's funny that you were so shocked at the thought that you said "SHOW ME ONE POST WHERE SOMEONE SAID THAT". You couldn't even believe that someone would say such a thing. But now, you are defending it. Because now you realize that it was the infallible DC that said it, and the Deceiver Maccabeus who is refuting it.
and it's funny that you were so shocked at the thought that you said "SHOW ME ONE POST WHERE SOMEONE SAID THAT". You couldn't even believe that someone would say such a thing. But now, you are defending it. Because now you realize that it was the infallible DC that said it, and the Deceiver Maccabeus who is refuting it.
the devil attacks us because he wants to take us out of commission, to neutralize our influence and ministry.
That is why we put on the whole armor of God.
changing the subject won't hide the fact that you just contradicted your own belief system.
as far as " show me where .... " I have already said " I stand corrected " twice.
but, that's o.k., you see the truth, heck, you just ADMITED truth, but since it goes against your belief system, you have to shove truth away.