Not By Works

blue_ladybug · Feb 4, 2019

OK so this is only my opinion?

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whomever shall believe on Him shall not perish, but have everlasting life.

No book, chapter or verse given here. So in YOUR estimation, that ^^^ is merely just my opinion? And not scripture?

TruthTalk · Feb 4, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

@TruthTalk

This will be in reply to your post no. 83,470
in which you posted many verses that you believe OSAS to be true.
Here is why they are NOT true.... One by one...

"The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,"
Romans 8:16
IF we have been born from above and are children of God, this is true.

John 5:24 - "has eternal life"
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me 'has eternal life'. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
We have eternal life IF we HEAR the word of God and BELIEVE in HIM.

John 3:36 - "has eternal life"
Whoever believes in the Son 'has eternal life'; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
Right again. Whoever BELIEVES, present tense, and whoever OBEYS.

Ephesians 2:8-9 - "have been saved"
For by grace you 'have been saved' through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Every church I know of believes we are saved by faith...this is justification. An act of God whereby we are declared innocent.

John 10:28 - "never parish"
I give them eternal life, and they will 'never perish', and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
Correct. For as long as we ABIDE IN CHRIST. See John 15:1-6
Nothing can snatch us out of the hand of God,,,,except our own free will decision to stop making Him our Lord.

1 John 5:13 - "that you may "know" that you have "eternal life."
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God 'that you may know that you have eternal life."
Correct. "to you WHO BELIEVE in the name of the Son of God.
Again....present tense. For as long as we believe, we have eternal life. Now in spirit and soul...and at the resurrection, in body. Which is immortality.

Romans 8:1 - "no condemnation"
There is therefore now 'no condemnation' for those who are in Christ Jesus.
Amen. God loves those who love His Son. Those IN JESUS will not be judged and are not in God's wrath.

Romans 10:13 - "will be saved"
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord 'will be saved.”
This requires much more time. Calling on the name of the Lord is not enough.
Not those who call Lord Lord, but those who do the will of My Father. Mathew 7:21
Also James 1:22...be not only hearers of the word...but doers of the word.

John 3:16 - "have eternal life"
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but 'have eternal life."
Yes. Whosoever BELIEVES in Him.....Again Present tense.

Romans 10:13-14 - "will be saved"
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching?
I don't understand why you posted this...

John 10:27-30 - "I give them eternal life"
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. 'I give them eternal life', and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one.”
No one will snatch the sheep out of God's hands.
But the lost sheep DID wander away, didn't he?
And could you show me where we lost our free will to walk out of His hand??

John 6:37 - "I will never cast out"
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me 'I will never cast out."
Amen. Jesus turns no one away!

John 14:16 - our advocate "The Holy Spirit", will be with us "forever"
"And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and 'be with you forever.
The Holy Spirit will be here on earth forever for whoever wants to make good use of Him.
He also will not abandon us who desire to abide with Him.

Romans 8:38-39 - "nothing will separate us from the love of God."
For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Jesus did say that some believe for a while and then abandon their faith.
Luke 8:13
Luke 15:24
Now....
If I list the same number of verses showing how the N.T. writers, and Jesus, believed we could become lost again...would you be willing to explain each one?

I feel like I've been hit by a drive by poster; everything that you posted missed the target and you continue to misinterpret scripture so that you can push a "losable salvation." You are an unreasonable person because you are blinded by your bias and false presuppositions. There is no way to have a dialog type conversations with a stubborn person, you can have it your way.

GodsGrace101 · Feb 4, 2019

blue_ladybug said:

Guess your time is up.
Couldn't answer, could you.
Too late if you answer now....

And, how am I supposed to know that's scripture?
I may not be as biblically K owledgeable as you are.

And this is my last post re this nonsense.

mailmandan · Feb 4, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

Was already explained in post #83,073. - https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/not-by-works.146296/page-4154#post-3839046

blue_ladybug · Feb 4, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

It's John 3:16. But you already knew that, Fran. You're just finding any flimsy excuse to flat out deny that scripture IS scripture, even without it's reference site..

GodsGrace101 · Feb 4, 2019

TruthTalk said:

So you are not willing to answer with your presuppositions if I post Only 14 verses proving one can lose their born again status?

You dont seem very secure in Your presuppositions.

GodsGrace101 · Feb 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

I'm on a phone right now.. Cant write too much.
Which part don't you get?

oldethennew · Feb 4, 2019

OMG, not the 'I'm on the phone excuse again' - please, let's allow ourselves to 'grow-up',
and then, we can really begin to 'grow-up'...

justpassinthrough · Feb 4, 2019

dcontroversal said:

No interpretation to it.

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. Romans 8:1

For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life. Galatians 6:8

Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9

For this you know, that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience. Therefore do not be partakers with them.
Ephesians 5:5-7

JPT

mailmandan · Feb 4, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

This was already explained to you in post #80,758 and post #80,766.

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/not-by-works.146296/page-4038
https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/not-by-works.146296/page-4039

Jesus.

Thrown away.

Remain, tarry, not to depart, continue to be present.

Taken away. Just like Judas Iscariot.

People who have two kinds of connections with Christ as the vine (the merely cosmic which bears no fruit, the spiritual and vital which bears fruit).

No. Apart from Christ we can do nothing.

Thrown away, gathered, cast into the fire, burned.

justpassinthrough · Feb 4, 2019

oldethennew said:

The ole logical fallacy.

You can’t refute the truth, so you demean and attack the Lord’s people.

Then you tell them to grow up??? LOL. THATS FUNNY!!!

You are very childish and immature.

Stay on your milk toast and let the grow ups discuss the truth.

JPT

Argueless · Feb 4, 2019

Why do you think that BELIEVERS were warned not to be DECEIVED?

...He replied, “The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. Whoever has will be given more, and he will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him. This is why I speak to them in parables: “Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand. In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah: “‘You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving. For this people’s heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them.’ But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. For I tell you the truth, many prophets and righteous men longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it. “Listen then to what the parable of the sower means: When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is the seed sown along the path. The one who received the seed that fell on rocky places is the man who HEARS THE WORD and at once RECEIVES IT with joy. But since he has no root, he lasts only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, he quickly FALLS AWAY. The one who RECEIVED THE SEED that fell among the thorns is the man who HEARS THE WORD, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it, making it UNFRUITFUL. But the one who RECEIVED THE SEED that fell on good soil is the man who HEARS THE WORD and UNDERSTANDS IT. He PRODUCES A CROP, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown.”

The Parable of the Weeds
...Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in HIS FIELD. But while everyone was sleeping, HIS ENEMY came and SOWED WEEDS AMONG THE WHEATS, and went away. When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared. “The owner’s servants came to him and said, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?’ “‘An enemy did this,’ he replied. “The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’ “‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may root up the wheat with them. LET BOTH GROW TOGETHER UNTIL THE HARVEST. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’” Matthew 13:11-30

Both the weeds and wheat grow in the same FIELD.

...The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. “As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and THEY WILL WEED OUT OF HIS KINGDOM everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear. Matthew 13:38-43

Who will the angels WEED OUT of GOD'S KINGDOM?

Aren't they supposed to belong to GOD'S kingdom to be weeded out of it?

...At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come. Matthew 24:10-14

....“To the angel of the CHURCH in Sardis write: These are the words of him who holds the seven spirits of God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead. Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God. Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you. Revelation 3:1-3

The church is the BODY OF CHRIST whom He will SAVE. Ephesians 5:23 WEEDED OUT OF every wickedness.[/QUOTE]

GodsGrace101 · Feb 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

Took a look MMD.
The Greek doesn't help you any...
Tomorrow.

mailmandan · Feb 4, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

What part of post #80,073 did you not get? - https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/not-by-works.146296/page-4154#post-3839046

mailmandan · Feb 4, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

It helps a lot, but it doesn't help those who have closed their eyes to the truth and are only interested in accommodating their biased doctrine at all costs.

oldethennew · Feb 4, 2019

let's be REAL here my brothers and sisters, we either give our 'whole heart' or, we just give a little to make us feel good,
then, eventually the 'little' runs out and we find ourselves right back where we started from, - please know that this is just
NOT possible, for when our Precious Saviour calls us out of this wicked world, He would NEVER put us back into it -
our brand-new journey begins, and we would NEVER/EVER want to go back there...

GodsGrace101 · Feb 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

Will reply tomorrow anyway....
Not for you, but for those seeking the truth.

I wonder how we understood the Bible before Greek lexicons??

UnderGrace · Feb 4, 2019

blue_ladybug said:

Oh yes, we should also keep in mind that the orginal text did not have chapter and verse, so where does that leave us?

oldethennew · Feb 4, 2019

'Great peace have they who Love Thy Law, and nothing shall offend them'...

UnderGrace · Feb 4, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

Untrue.

This conversation goes way back to 2017.

Saying "someone" does not post scripture is a false assertion.

There is no new scripture we can cite, remember the canon is closed, the various verses have been given over and over....that is the point!!!

Now please follow along because I think we have made our case abundantly.

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