Then what you're saying is people can repent, after death, at the judgement seat? Because that was the discussion.
question about the Nature of God
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No,I'm saying that a person has to repent sincerely whenever they do repent whether they repent minutes before death or whenever they repent before they leave earth.
I'm sorry Subhumanoidal I went back and I read the post that you were responding to and you were right.forgive me.
I will still stand by the statement that if a person is given them message of God in this world and they reject the Gospel of Jesus and the Atonement He secured on the cross they will be damned in eternity.. They will not have a second chance..
Jesus did go and preach to those in hell.. But they had not heard His message because they died before His revelation..
So there is no hope for those who have died after rejecting the Word of God.. No hope at all..
The Spirits in Prison had not heard the Gospel.. The revelation of the Way of salvation of Jesus Christ.. They died before the times of Jesus and thus never knew about His Way.. So Jesus went down to them and preached His Word..
So in this case there is a second chance to hear the gospel, if you did not have that chance on earth? That seems fair.
I don't agree with you and I'm not going to be dogmatic about this because there's doubt as to the certainty of what this verse means...
1 Peter 3:19
19in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison,
What I don't agree with is that anyone or any spirit (angels?) could possibly be given a second chance.
What do you think of those in prison being the persons in Abraham's Bossom in
Luke 16:22?
we shouldn't leave 1 Peter 3:20 out; it gives us information about exactly which imprisoned spirits 3:19 is talking about..
which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing
That is what i believe happened when Jesus went down there and preached to them.. But don't look upon it as a second chance.. These people get A chance to respond to the Message of Jesus..
Angels are not given any chances as far as the Atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ is concerned.. That Atonement was secured for us Humans because we are lower then the Angels.. The Angels who are higher beings then us and have been in the presence of our Glorious God have no excuses for their rebellion.. The day satan rebelled against God was the day that sealed his eternal doom along with the other angels that allied themselves in satans rebellion..
Also i am not dogmatic to resist your point that Jesus only preached to the people on Abraham's side of the divide in hell.. But i am moved to believe that the Atonement Jesus secured and offered to us living sinners from his time till the second coming would also be offered to the sinners that lived before the Time of Jesus back to the times of Adam and Eve..
So does this mean that ONLY those of Noah's time were given a second chance?
This doesn't sound right....
It WAS offered.
Didn't those of the O.T. get saved by faith?
Some were righteous with God...right with God.
THEY are the ones that went to Abraham's Bossom.
Jesus died to release of from the bondage to sin and to open the gates of heaven.
Mathew 27:51
When the veil was torn from top to bottom when Jesus died,,,this was the opening of the Holy of Holies...the opening of the gates of heaven which all could access, not only the High Priest.
Also, it's pretty much been established that Jesus never went to hell.
Where has it been established that Jesus never went to hell.. If he went to the Souls in prison He went to the souls in Hell.. Abraham and those with him where in hell although separated by a gulf from those suffering from the hot part of as shown in the story of Lazarus.. Abraham and the Rich man where close enough to talk to each other..
Yes,,,there was a chasm between them,,,
but they were NOT in hell.
Also, we have to remember that the word "hell" was translated incorrectly in all of the N.T. except for
2 Peter 2:4.
The translators used hell for every Hebrew word:
Gehenna
Sheoul
Hades
Hades would be Abraham's Bossom in Luke 16.
Jesus went there to free those that were in the comfort of A's Bossom.
Those that were in hell, were there forever. They were already judged and the gates of heaven did not open for THEM.
@Adstar
I found this link... (there are more)
https://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/did-jesus-go-to-hell-faq.htm
QUESTION: Did Jesus Go to Hell?
ANSWER:
More specifically, did Jesus go to hell between His death on Good Friday and His resurrection on Easter Sunday? The Apostles' Creed states that Jesus, "was crucified, dead, and buried. He descended into hell. The third day he rose again from the dead." The Athanasian Creed, speaking of Jesus, asserts, "Who suffered for our salvation, descended into hell, rose again the third day from the dead." Therefore, two of the three great ancient creeds affirm that Jesus "descended into hell" sometime between His crucifixion and resurrection. But is that what the Bible teaches?
The short answer to this question is: "No." The biblical authors were more accurate in their use of words than some of our Bible translators or creed writers. There are two Greek words for the abode of the dead. (Greek is the language in which the New Testament of the Bible was originally written.) Hell (Geenna in Greek, also called the lake of fire and the eternal fire) was made for the Devil and his minions (Matthew 25:41) and will be occupied by all the unrighteous after the last judgement (Revelation 19:20-21 and 20:10-15). There is no biblical evidence that anyone has gone there or will go there until after Jesus' Second Coming (Revelation 19:11-16). This includes Jesus Himself.
The other Greek word is Hadas (from which we get the English word Hades). This is the region of the dead. Before Jesus' ascension, the spirits of all people went to Hades. After His ascension, only the spirits of unbelievers go to Hades, while the spirits of believers go directly to be with the Lord (2 Corinthians 5:1-8). It is into this region that Jesus entered after His crucifixion (Acts 2:25-31 in which Peter quotes from Psalm 16:9-10). Ephesians 4:8-10 says that Jesus, "had descended into the lower parts of the earth." This may also speak of Jesus' visit to Hades before His ascension. Finally, Romans 10:7 refers to Jesus in "the abyss" while He was among the dead. After the final judgment, Hades will be cast into Hell (Revelation 20:14). Therefore, the longer answer is: "Yes, Jesus descended into Hades but not into Hell."
So, how did the idea of Jesus descending into Hell get incorporated into the church creeds? The early church taught that Jesus descended into Hades. The Old Roman form of the Apostles' Creed (about A.D. 140) did not have the phrase, "He descended into Hell", and it did not appear in the Nicene Creed (A.D. 325). It seems to have been a late addition (perhaps around A.D. 390). The phrase first appeared in the Creed of Aquileia, (4th century, in the Latin words descendit in inferna - descended into Hades). In addition, the Athanasian Creed, which does contain the phrase, may not have been written until the time of Charlemagne (8th century). So, why the addition? One possible explanation is that at the end of the fourth century (around A.D. 381) the church was battling the teachings of Apollinaris. He taught that Jesus was not fully human - He had a human body and soul, but a divine spirit. The church, on the other hand, taught that Jesus had to be fully human for His death to be a true death and an effective sacrifice for sin. To demonstrate that Jesus was fully human, with a human spirit, the church may have added the Latin phrase from the Creed of Aquileia to the more popular Apostles' Creed. By the time of the Middle Ages, the words Hell and Hades had become confused and Jesus was thought to have descended into Hell.
L
I found this link... (there are more)
https://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/did-jesus-go-to-hell-faq.htm
QUESTION: Did Jesus Go to Hell?
ANSWER:
More specifically, did Jesus go to hell between His death on Good Friday and His resurrection on Easter Sunday? The Apostles' Creed states that Jesus, "was crucified, dead, and buried. He descended into hell. The third day he rose again from the dead." The Athanasian Creed, speaking of Jesus, asserts, "Who suffered for our salvation, descended into hell, rose again the third day from the dead." Therefore, two of the three great ancient creeds affirm that Jesus "descended into hell" sometime between His crucifixion and resurrection. But is that what the Bible teaches?
The short answer to this question is: "No." The biblical authors were more accurate in their use of words than some of our Bible translators or creed writers. There are two Greek words for the abode of the dead. (Greek is the language in which the New Testament of the Bible was originally written.) Hell (Geenna in Greek, also called the lake of fire and the eternal fire) was made for the Devil and his minions (Matthew 25:41) and will be occupied by all the unrighteous after the last judgement (Revelation 19:20-21 and 20:10-15). There is no biblical evidence that anyone has gone there or will go there until after Jesus' Second Coming (Revelation 19:11-16). This includes Jesus Himself.
The other Greek word is Hadas (from which we get the English word Hades). This is the region of the dead. Before Jesus' ascension, the spirits of all people went to Hades. After His ascension, only the spirits of unbelievers go to Hades, while the spirits of believers go directly to be with the Lord (2 Corinthians 5:1-8). It is into this region that Jesus entered after His crucifixion (Acts 2:25-31 in which Peter quotes from Psalm 16:9-10). Ephesians 4:8-10 says that Jesus, "had descended into the lower parts of the earth." This may also speak of Jesus' visit to Hades before His ascension. Finally, Romans 10:7 refers to Jesus in "the abyss" while He was among the dead. After the final judgment, Hades will be cast into Hell (Revelation 20:14). Therefore, the longer answer is: "Yes, Jesus descended into Hades but not into Hell."
So, how did the idea of Jesus descending into Hell get incorporated into the church creeds? The early church taught that Jesus descended into Hades. The Old Roman form of the Apostles' Creed (about A.D. 140) did not have the phrase, "He descended into Hell", and it did not appear in the Nicene Creed (A.D. 325). It seems to have been a late addition (perhaps around A.D. 390). The phrase first appeared in the Creed of Aquileia, (4th century, in the Latin words descendit in inferna - descended into Hades). In addition, the Athanasian Creed, which does contain the phrase, may not have been written until the time of Charlemagne (8th century). So, why the addition? One possible explanation is that at the end of the fourth century (around A.D. 381) the church was battling the teachings of Apollinaris. He taught that Jesus was not fully human - He had a human body and soul, but a divine spirit. The church, on the other hand, taught that Jesus had to be fully human for His death to be a true death and an effective sacrifice for sin. To demonstrate that Jesus was fully human, with a human spirit, the church may have added the Latin phrase from the Creed of Aquileia to the more popular Apostles' Creed. By the time of the Middle Ages, the words Hell and Hades had become confused and Jesus was thought to have descended into Hell.
L
The final judgement has not happened yet.. It happens after the 1000 year millenial Kingdom.. And when the Judgement is done, those damned will be cast into the eternal Lake of fire..
The Eternal Lake of Fire is not Hell..
Hell will be cast into the eternal lake of fire along with satan and all those who loved unrightiousness..
Revelation 20: KJV
13 "And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. {14} And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. {15} And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."
maybe we're not talking about people, and maybe it's only the spirits who had done something significant in Noah's time who are in prison.
If someone repents, it's because they find that thing they are repenting of repulsive.
Why would someone on judgment day find what they have they have loved repulsive?