Not By Works

[dcontroversal]

You find the truth boring? You don't understand what I said?

I did not go against Jesus' own words and I properly harmonized Scripture with Scripture in order to reach the proper conclusion on doctrine. What did Jesus say in John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26? Anything about works salvation? NO. *Hermeneutics.

Just like the blind Pharisee....one must be willing to open their eyes to see.....any salvation that must be maintained by man is no salvation of or from the Lord!

 

[Budman]

I’ll get back with you on this post later. It’s hard for me to deliver mail and post on Christian Chat at the same time.

So, that's why my packages are always late! 😠

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Well, many of the Christians at Corinth had no good works to show - in fact, they were pretty carnal. Some had even died, yet Paul called them believers.

One can be carnal, and still have somethingto show for it

Faith works, i find it hard to believe you trust someone yet never do anything they say

 

[Budman]

One can be carnal, and still have somethingto show for it

Faith works, i find it hard to believe you trust someone yet never do anything they say

Well, one can resist doing good works for the reason I stated in the predestination thread. We still have free will, and the flesh to influence us. Only one work is actually required:

"Then they inquired, “What must we do to perform the works of God?” Jesus replied, “The work of God is this: to believe in the One He has sent.”

Notice they said "works" and Jesus said "work".

 

[calibob]

One can be carnal, and still have somethingto show for it

Faith works, i find it hard to believe you trust someone yet never do anything they say

 

[dcontroversal]

One can be carnal, and still have somethingto show for it

Faith works, i find it hard to believe you trust someone yet never do anything they say

I know we disagree on the parable of the sower, but your post is exactly why I believe the parable shows 4 possible results from the word of God in any man

A. Rejects, no conversion lost
b. Receives, converted, no fruit other than belief due to no growth spiritually
c. Receives, converted, stunted fruit due to being choked out spiritually due to the world
d. Receives, converted, much fruit due to spiritual growth

Obviously the many go the way of "a".....

I beleieve the bible bears out the above truth based upon the word "receives" in the parable and other biblical truths such as the warning in Luke, Conrintihians, etc.....

 

[dcontroversal]

View attachment 192910

What qualifies as a work? Sometimes is is just going....Abraham believed God and it was put to his account as righteousness.....what was it that Abraham had done....this is not speaking of being "whacked" nor is it speaking of him offering Isaac....what did he do? He left his home and went looking for a city whose builder and maker is GOD while being led to the land of promise.....sometimes the "work" is just to go!

 

[NoNameMcgee]

I know we disagree on the parable of the sower, but your post is exactly why I believe the parable shows 4 possible results from the word of God in any man

A. Rejects, no conversion lost
b. Receives, converted, no fruit other than belief due to no growth spiritually
c. Receives, converted, stunted fruit due to being choked out spiritually due to the world
d. Receives, converted, much fruit due to spiritual growth

Obviously the many go the way of "a".....

I beleieve the bible bears out the above truth based upon the word "receives" in the parable and other biblical truths such as the warning in Luke, Conrintihians, etc.....

very interesting brother🤔

i have never considered the second soil from that perspective

i will pray on this

thank you for sharing

 

[dcontroversal]

amen


i could not un-believe even if i tried my hardest....

i know in my heart who my Father is

i have heard His Word
i believe it

i have seen His works in me

there is nothing that can separate me from Him


i can't wake up and choose to believe fire is cold
or ice is hot
or that i have the power to teleport
or 2+2=3,578.12

but none of these sound as crazy as turning from the truth which i know


"we are not of them who draw back unto perdition, but of them that believe to the saving of the soul"

"they went out from us, but they were not of us for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us, but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us"

Amen and you know why that is.....it is because JESUS BEGAN the work of faith and he will finish it and complete it......unlike the salvation losers that must MAINTAIN IT THEMSELVES.....the reason they must MAINTAIN IT is because they have never really trusted into Christ biblically.....this is an absolute truth.....ig one goes into this believing THEY MUST DO SOMETHING TO KEEP OR MAINTAIN IT....who are they really trusting in...NOT CHRIST TO FINISH IT, BUT THEMSELVES to maintain it!!!!

This is a self evident truth!!!!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Well, one can resist doing good works for the reason I stated in the predestination thread. We still have free will, and the flesh to influence us. Only one work is actually required:

"Then they inquired, “What must we do to perform the works of God?” Jesus replied, “The work of God is this: to believe in the One He has sent.”

Notice they said "works" and Jesus said "work".

I am with ya bro, only the work of God saves.

I am just saying i believe if you truely have faith in someone, you will at least do something they say. If you don’t do anything a person says, how can you claim you have faith.

And also, i think we may be interpreting the word work differently

 

[dcontroversal]

very interesting brother🤔

i have never considered the second soil from that perspective

i will pray on this

thank you for sharing

amen brother...just think....the Corinthian brothers with works burnt must fit somewhere, as well as those in Luke whose heart is weighed down by riotous living and or even the prodigal son........within the parable where would one place those immature in the faith like the Corithian fornicator who Paul calls a brother? The bible is clear on believers that are saved....some are as faithful as and bear much fruit, some are spiritually immature and never advance much past the milk, and some are worldly which chokes out the fruit like weeds in a garden....anyway my view is the parable covers all three as well as those who never believe and remain lost....it seems to bear out to me....

 

[Budman]

Hey bud, rom 4 is talking about before salvation

"However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness" (Romans 4:5)

I wanted to point out that Paul says "does" not work, not "did" not work. He is speaking in the present tense, so I think he is clearly talking about those who are already believers.

 

[Hevosmies]

I know we disagree on the parable of the sower, but your post is exactly why I believe the parable shows 4 possible results from the word of God in any man

A. Rejects, no conversion lost
b. Receives, converted, no fruit other than belief due to no growth spiritually
c. Receives, converted, stunted fruit due to being choked out spiritually due to the world
d. Receives, converted, much fruit due to spiritual growth

Obviously the many go the way of "a".....

I beleieve the bible bears out the above truth based upon the word "receives" in the parable and other biblical truths such as the warning in Luke, Conrintihians, etc.....

could you explain this a bit more.

How do is choked out spiritually is SAVED? or d.
because Jesus said every tree that doesnt bear fruit is cut off to the fire so, how do we explani that with choked out spiritually still saved?

 

[Budman]

i think we may be interpreting the word work differently

Perhaps. No worries though, Bro!

 

[calibob]

What qualifies as a work? Sometimes is is just going....Abraham believed God and it was put to his account as righteousness.....what was it that Abraham had done....this is not speaking of being "whacked" nor is it speaking of him offering Isaac....what did he do? He left his home and went looking for a city whose builder and maker is GOD while being led to the land of promise.....sometimes the "work" is just to go!

We can never repay just like we cannot become our own parents but we can try to please God and do things out of gratitude like trying to please and obey. We are less perfect than most can admit but if we seek to please him more than ourselves because we can rather than because we have to I think it counts for much.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I know we disagree on the parable of the sower, but your post is exactly why I believe the parable shows 4 possible results from the word of God in any man

A. Rejects, no conversion lost
b. Receives, converted, no fruit other than belief due to no growth spiritually
c. Receives, converted, stunted fruit due to being choked out spiritually due to the world
d. Receives, converted, much fruit due to spiritual growth

Obviously the many go the way of "a".....

I beleieve the bible bears out the above truth based upon the word "receives" in the parable and other biblical truths such as the warning in Luke, Conrintihians, etc.....

I believe only one of them produced fruit, so only one had faith.

The other three are examples of other different responses to the gospel.

A. Rejects, no conversion lost
B. Recieves, (believes) but since it was not rooted in christ, (had no root) they walked away
C. Others tried to mix the world with christ,, but again, since had no root, what they truely had faith in chocked their “belief” in christ out and they walked away (the antichrist of 1 john who dpearted but were never saved)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Perhaps. No worries though, Bro!

Oh no worries at all bro!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

View attachment 192910

What does that say about Jesus who hung out with sinners?

 

[dcontroversal]

Yeah well. I'm a girl, I tend to be sensitive and boy do I get attacked on this thread!

I did answer you BTW, about 3 posts ago.
Check it out.

Fran.....we do not attack you personally, but what you believe and espouse.....I am sure that in person you are probably as nice as they come.......but make no mistake, I believe you push that which is false and that is what I stand against.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

"However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness" (Romans 4:5)

I wanted to point out that Paul says "does" not work, not "did" not work. He is speaking in the present tense, so I think he is clearly talking about those who are already believers.

He is, but he is saying how they became righeous, like abraham, not by works, but by faith.