Praying in Tongues

[GraceAndTruth]

Jonathan Edwards recorded an ecstatic experience of his own evidently. Not tongues or any sign gifts, just some kind of exhilaration. But to lack any of this is nothing to worry about.

I've had my own "experience" of God's reality.......but I have yet to break out in gibberish, song or a poem.

 

[GraceAndTruth]

No doubt the Scriptures plot the winding down of the sign gifts. However there is also no doubt that there is no explicit proof of cessation other than perhaps the one statement made by Paul, which is certainly debatable.

and history

 

[cv5]

and history

And objective observation and cogent unbiased assessment.
The present day blubbering babblers are bogus no doubt about that.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Healing isn't mentioned in 1 Corinthians 13. It's irrelevant to the discussion of tongues.

well it isn't going well with that topic so another must be introduced to begin another argument

 

[7seasrekeyed]

And objective observation and cogent unbiased assessment.
The present day blubbering babblers are bogus no doubt about that.

reduced to insults and bad alliteration then?

common objective of some seems to be call names and just make plain nasty posts with no relevance to the topic

such wisdom can hardly be refuted...oh wait.

yes it can.

open the Bible, read it and actually believe it

God is invisible. you must have a hard time with that too

 

[7seasrekeyed]

I disagree. Healing is definitely a component of the sign gifts. It certainly was for the 12 and 70 in the gospel accounts.

but it is not the topic of this thread

such a bold move on your part

 

[RickyZ]

yup

but he also said he desired that all would speak in tongues so I suspect the fault is not with God's favoritism

I've often found it interesting that while Paul said tongues was the least of the gifts, and he said not all will receive it, he also said it was the only one he wished we all would do.

 

[RickyZ]

So your discernment trumps my discernment?

I tried to aim that at a broader perspective than just at you. Yes discernment has ceased not just in the world but among a lot of Christians. It's part of the polarization of the world, the farther you get to an edge the less you can see of the other side. And you have to see both sides to have something to discern between. So as a personal poke my apologies, as a broader warning I stand by it.

Here's where I see our discernment part -

I look at history and early christian writers.
I look at where this newish outbreak of "tongues etc" came from, that history also and the people that promoted it.
I look at the reaction of prominent pastors of that time like Johathan Edwards, Geroge Whitfield and Augustus Toplady.

And I look at WHO is on the WOF list of 'approved preachers'.
And I look at their whole attitude to the bible, and what other money grubbing schemes they can come up with.

You look at all these peripheral things and make a pronouncement. It's AAAAll bad

I look at the Bible and I try what it says. Then I look at the results and decide whether it's right or not, whether it does what it says it will do. And to that I have to say, yes, it does.

Now, this is when I look at that list of people you make your first source of information, and yeah, I'll agree with your discernment that they are all out to lunch.

That's where we part. You discern based on the actions of other people. And I agree with you about the actions of other people.

I discern based upon trying what the Bible says, and seeing if I get the prophesied result. And you won't agree with that.

Does one trump the other? Only God really knows, but I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say, yeah.

 

[cv5]

but it is not the topic of this thread

such a bold move on your part

Why thank you. I am here to help. Sincerely.

 

[wolfwint]

yup

but he also said he desired that all would speak in tongues so I suspect the fault is not with God's favoritism

But this not equalize what he said in 1. Cor. 12, 30 and what he said there is clear for me.

The professors of sign gifts for today are to say the least of dubious reputation. Nutter carnival barkers and sinister false prophets for the most part. Doomed to hell the blatant decievers one and all.

......turn to the prison epistles, the four letters written shortly after the end of the Book of Acts, while Paul was a prisoner in Rome—Ephesians, Colossians, Philemon and Philippians…and we find that there is not one word about tongues, or the gift of healing. Even where we might have expected Paul to write of tongues in the passage about being “filled with the Spirit” in Ephesians 5:17, he has nothing to say about tongues. And as for the gift of healing, we read of a co-worker of Paul’s, Epaphroditus, who fell seriously ill during this time (Phil. 2:25-30) and Paul no longer had the gift of healing, and was no longer able to heal as he did only a few years earlier in Acts 28:9. The sign gifts were no longer operating at the time that Paul wrote the Prison Epistles.

I agree with you Till your last sentence. Anyhow they stopped After the apostolic Time. Exactly when nobody knows. Thats Why we dont find this teaching during the churchhistorie.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

I've often found it interesting that while Paul said tongues was the least of the gifts, and he said not all will receive it, he also said it was the only one he wished we all would do.

I agree

Now I desire you all to speak in tongues, but rather that you should prophesy. Now the one prophesying is greater than the one speaking in tongues, unless he should interpret, so that the church might receive edification. I Corinthians 14:5

prophesy meaning to expound on what is known here is my take...not foretelling events

and noting that if a person interprets, it is equal to prophesy which is direct in the language of the hearer

good point

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Those are my observations. Feel free to make your own. And yes, all of the nonsensical jibberish so called tongues that I have ever heard were uttly bogus sensationalist garbage fit for the dung heap.

you sure can backpedal when someone calls you out on your abusive language dude

Why thank you. I am here to help. Sincerely.

hopefully, you will rather get some help here LOL!

 

[7seasrekeyed]

But this not equalize what he said in 1. Cor. 12, 30 and what he said there is clear for me.

that is some confusing comparison

seems some people will go to great lengths to explain why they do not believe what the Bible clearly states

 

[garee]

I agree

Now I desire you all to speak in tongues, but rather that you should prophesy. Now the one prophesying is greater than the one speaking in tongues, unless he should interpret, so that the church might receive edification. I Corinthians 14:5

prophesy meaning to expound on what is known here is my take...not foretelling events

and noting that if a person interprets, it is equal to prophesy which is direct in the language of the hearer

good point

Unless “tongues” are interpreted by the Holy Spirit as during Pentecost when God did the interpreting can they help the Church?

Is a private interpreter needed to mediate and translate between the speaker and the hearer or do we not know God after the private interpretation of men as if we did need a man to teach us?

I would think if the sounds of the speaker’s voice mean nothing to me I am a foreigner to him, and he is a foreigner to me.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Unless “tongues” are interpreted by the Holy Spirit as during Pentecost when God did the interpreting can they help the Church?

Is a private interpreter needed to mediate and translate between the speaker and the hearer or do we not know God after the private interpretation of men as if we did need a man to teach us?

I would think if the sounds of the speaker’s voice mean nothing to me I am a foreigner to him, and he is a foreigner to me.

I wasn't talking to you.

while this is a public forum, I see no need to start another merry go round as you so obviously desire to do

in other words, kindly move on

 

[garee]

you sure can backpedal when someone calls you out on your abusive language dude



hopefully, you will rather get some help here LOL!

While I am not promoting abusive language seeing we do not wrestle against flesh and blood and we are all brothers and sisters in Christ. Tongues is a sign as a curse against those who mocked God with their oral traditions of the fathers. With mocking lips he mocked them brining His word in other languages other than Hebrew alone . The language offended the faithless Jews and still does to this day . Refusing to hear the new testament in false pride. They still seek after a signs and wonders gospel not acknowledging the veil is rent.

I would suggest we walk, or understand God not seen by faith, the unseen eternal and not by sight , the temporal after a signs and wonders gospel (no sign gifts) .Spiritual yes, signs no.

2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight

 

[garee]

I wasn't talking to you.

while this is a public forum, I see no need to start another merry go round as you so obviously desire to do

in other words, kindly move on

Another?

I am still waiting for your answer in respect to the law found 1 Corinthians 14:21-22 as to what the sign confirms, a blessing or a curse and who it is pointing at? Once you give that answer then we can move on. The foundation must be established to start the merry go round then the rest of the doctrine can be built?

In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.Wherefore tongues are for a sign, "not to them that believe", but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.1 Corinthians 14:21-22

What does the law say?

 

[garee]

That info has been shared with you a thousand times, and a thousand times you have looked right past it. Would a thousand and one times make it any clearer?

Yes it has been made clear. Charismatics seek after a sign and wonders gospel to cause a wonderment to confirm they have the Holy Spirit . Why else would they seek after making a noise with no understanding to confirm something?

 

[Dino246]

Yes it has been made clear. Charismatics seek after a sign and wonders gospel to cause a wonderment to confirm they have the Holy Spirit . Why else would they seek after making a noise with no understanding to confirm something?

Which Charismatics? Quote them please.

 

[Dino246]

Unless “tongues” are interpreted by the Holy Spirit as during Pentecost when God did the interpreting can they help the Church?

The Holy Spirit didn't interpret at Pentecost. The Holy Spirit enabled the disciples to speak in other tongues. See Acts 2:4.