Not By Works

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

If you think that I only take one verse to come to a conclusion on any given biblical concept, you need to lay off the juice!!

Why not address the post and instead say this my friend?

 

[VCO]

I'll just reply to this then put you back on ignore.

So to whatever question you have in mind I will say AGAIN that LOVE IS THE ANSWER because GOD IS LOVE and so He has to be the TRUTH.

I noticed that when you and your OSAS group quote scriptures, you do not include verses that would not fit your doctrine such as in 1 Corinthians 13 where you ignore or skip verse 2 and the same with Romans 3:31 etc.

Jesus clearly said,

...He replied, “Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: “‘These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.’ You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men.” And he said to them: “You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions! For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.’ But you say that if a man says to his father or mother: ‘Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is Corban’ (that is, a gift devoted to God), then you no longer let him do anything for his father or mother. Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.” Mark 7:6-13

I do not alter nor reject any scripture like you and your group do, and regarding losing salvation, I believe that Ananias and Saphira is a good example along with those in the book of Jude. Jesus even said to the Church in Sardis that He has not found their deeds complete in the sight of God and told them to repent and OBEY what they heard and received or else He will come like a thief and we know what He meant about it.

The parables and the warnings about false prophets and teachers and deceivers would also be good examples of God's righteous JUDGMENT in regards to salvation on both believers and unbelievers.

..Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole duty of man. For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every hidden thing, whether it is good or evil. Ecclesiastes 12:13-14

No Argueless, everything fits the way we Interpret it. Your Theory only creates Contradictions. Bye Now.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

Appropriated your "boom" above to a correct description.

Don't act like that wasn't the heaviest punch you've ever felt...

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Why not address the post and instead say this my friend?

Here is your problem my friend...you are taking one verse from the whole and extrapolating it. I can do that and come up with some of the worst doctrine(s) out there. But you can not take a verse and extrapolate it and consider that to be solid hermeneutics.

.

Maybe because he was adressing an accusation you made?

 

[preacher4truth]

Don't act like that wasn't the heaviest punch you've ever felt...

Keep studying bro, and if not, get into a good church, and I pray God answers Paul's prayer in you from Ephesians 1:15-23. Read it, not in a hurry and meditate on what Paul is saying and the LORD will give you understanding. Note how Paul says this in 2 Timothy 2:7.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I am sorry, But the responses in here are just amazing, Instad of sticking to what the bible says, People attack others like little children, “You interpret these verses wrong, your ignoring what the bibe says, Why do you not extrapolate this verse etc etc)

If people can not respond to others in a kind, non combative way, How do you expect people to respond to you that way.

I think it is time for some people to learn som respect (I say this because A few I have just met and can judge that person or his motives) and others who have been here long enough and continue to same nonsense over and over, to grow up!

 

[VCO]

Impossible for him to do.....the very deception he decries about is indeed the very deception that he peddles.....!!

I had to put Argueless on my permanent IGNORE LIST For:

1. For his refusal to answer my questions.
2. Purely FALSE ACCUSATIONS about OSAS, saying we Only reference Verses that support our Position.
3. CONTINUED False Doctrine,
Acts 20:30 (ESV)
30 and from among your own selves will arise men speaking twisted things, to draw away the disciples after them.

The questions he completely ignored were: What does BORN AGAIN mean to you, and HOW IS ONE BORN AGAIN?
I am convinced he HAS NO ANSWER, and he seems to not care, probably because he is only interested in proclaiming his False Doctrines. And the final straw was his repeated insults about OSAS, which I warned him about at least twice before. I have tried numerous times to explain OSAS, but he has been blinded by his teacher with False Doctrines, in my opinion.

I absolutely believe there are no contradictions in the BIBLE, when you interpret it CORRECTLY. Any time a person THINKS he found a contradictions, he has made an ERROR in Interpretation in at least one verse or BOTH.

Why do I believe in putting people on my IGNORE LIST?

The answer to that is in the Scriptures:

Titus 3:10 (NIV)
10 Warn a divisive person once, and then warn him a second time. After that, have nothing to do with him.

That word in the GREEK is only used ONE TIME in the Bible. It is hairetikos, and it means "to Cause Division, or factious person".
I know that I give them MORE than two chances.

 

[VCO]

Coffee, anybody?

View attachment 192185

Had mine after my Fasting Blood Test, probably looked like this:

 

[Budman]

Keep studying bro, and if not, get into a good church, and I pray God answers Paul's prayer in you from Ephesians 1:15-23. Read it, not in a hurry and meditate on what Paul is saying and the LORD will give you understanding. Note how Paul says this in 2 Timothy 2:7.

 

[TruthTalk]

Appropriated your "boom" above to a correct description.

Yep, I'm relentless for the truth. Reformed and relentless, Jude 1:4.

Still waiting, and will for eternity wait for any anti-Calvinist to use any contextual exegesis to prove their teachings against such as true.

The fact is they cannot contextually and/or exegetically do so.

No, they cannot do so.

There are many books written to give attempt, yet every single Scripture given is taken completely out of context. That is a fact. This is just one fact that has helped me understand the Gospel and the importance of proper interpretation.

The choose yourself into heaven doctrine via free will (while said decisional regeneration is clearly refuted by Scripture) is a new comer doctrine that's been around for about 150 years plus or minus. The Scriptures that refute this decisional salvation are completely rejected as the opponents merely pit another passage, out of context, against them as if it neutralizes the truth. It's actually sad to watch.

The misinterpretations and misapplications of "all" in Scripture via this decisional regeneration doctrine have led to antinomianism, Universalism, FGT, denial and even ridicule of the evidence of conversion, believe-ism, easy-believism, sinners prayer salvation, "ask Jesus in your heart," ridicule of self-examination, presumptive deception, listen here: false assurance, and such a severe hatred for works that any type of works are mocked as a works gospel.

This sort of teaching has also denied Sovereign electing grace as these falsely believe God chose them only because he saw they would choose them, turning the gift of eternal life into a reward. Those who believe and embrace the fact God has elected unconditionally those whom he willed to save are mocked as being "special" because they believe he chooses based on nothing good in man and only according to his purpose, Romans 9:11ff, Ephesians 1:4ff.

Hmmm. Think that over.

They were chosen because God saw them do something good (and/or because out of their own sincere love for God they came to him ) yet we're special? That's just absurd and anyone promoting that idea doesn't have much sense. Lastly it has embraced the Romans 9:20 man.

Hi Preacher, doesn't our collective angst here create the perfect storm for change. Your concern and my concern is for the proper "interpretation and application", of scripture. There is so much misapplied scripture going on around here that it creates 'to much theological divisions' among the brotherhood of believers.

I am seeing former Christian friendships appear to dissolve before my very eyes and that should not be.

Spiritual Wisdom: Ephesians1:15-23
15) For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, 16) I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers 17) and asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you a spirit of wisdom and revelation in your knowledge of Him.18) I ask that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened, so that you may know the hope of His calling, the riches of His glorious inheritance in the saints, 19) and the surpassing greatness of His power to us who believe. He displayed this power in the working of His mighty strength, 20) which He exerted in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly realms, 21) far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age, but also in the one to come. 22) And God put everything under His feet and made Him head over everything for the church, 23) which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.

Great Awakening

• First (c. 1730–1755)​
• Second (c. 1790–1840)​
• Third (c. 1855–1930)​
• Fourth (c. 1960–1980)​

 

[TruthTalk]

Merry Christmas Birthday Celebration to our Savior Jesus Christ

“Glory to God in the highest,
and on earth peace to men
on whom His favor rests!”

The Shepherds and the Angels
8) And there were shepherds residing in the fields nearby, keeping watch over their flocks by night. 9) Just then, an angel of the Lord stood before them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were terrified. 10) But the angel said to them, “Do not be afraid! For behold, I bring you good news of great joy that will be for all the people: 11)Today in the City of David a Savior has been born to you. He is Christ the Lord! 12) And this will be a sign to you: You will find a baby wrapped in swaddling cloths and lying in a manger.”
13) And suddenly there appeared with the angel a great multitude of the heavenly host, praising God and saying:

14) “Glory to God in the highest,
and on earth peace to men
on whom His favor rests!”

 

[preacher4truth]

Hi Preacher, doesn't our collective angst here create the perfect storm for change. Your concern and my concern is for the proper "interpretation and application", of scripture. There is so much misapplied scripture going on around here that it creates 'to much theological divisions' among the brotherhood of believers.

I am seeing former Christian friendships appear to dissolve before my very eyes and that should not be.

Spiritual Wisdom: Ephesians1:15-23
15) For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, 16) I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers 17) and asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you a spirit of wisdom and revelation in your knowledge of Him.18) I ask that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened, so that you may know the hope of His calling, the riches of His glorious inheritance in the saints, 19) and the surpassing greatness of His power to us who believe. He displayed this power in the working of His mighty strength, 20) which He exerted in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly realms, 21) far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age, but also in the one to come. 22) And God put everything under His feet and made Him head over everything for the church, 23) which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.

Great Awakening

• First (c. 1730–1755)​
• Second (c. 1790–1840)​
• Third (c. 1855–1930)​
• Fourth (c. 1960–1980)​

Agreed.

Here is the problem today: Very few allow the correction of Scripture, 2 Timothy 3:16, and very few accept the negative aspects of reproving, rebuking as prescribed by Paul in 2 Timothy 4:1-4.

Many won't allow correction due to the fact they have not grown in their understanding while accepting they've held to error. This is why 2 Timothy 3:16 was written, some and many believers hold to error concerning the Gospel, and many outright reject these truths to such an extent they pit Scripture against Scripture to support their errant views.

Unity is to be guarded, it is not manufactured nor created by compromise, putting aside truth &c; Ephesians 4:1-7. The foundation of unity is truth (One Lord, one faith, one baptism...as in the text) which is why we have disunity as not accepting correction creates pride, and pride will not allow some to receive any correction, even when Scripture is clear.

For the record my love and care for my differing brothers has not changed while I stand firm and unrelenting on the untruncated Gospel. Even though issues arise we are to still obey the call to offer correction and preach truth as mandated. Let's not be as some who construe this as unloving and not of God and I'm not suggesting you've ever done this dear brother.

My brother and I loved each other very much, and we also fought. But we'd protect one another in a heartbeat.

 

[Hevosmies]

I have issues with both sides of the coin and have always said there is a balance to be struck between both views based upon scripture.....

What do you suggest? Im talking about the "balance to be struck between both views" meaning arminians and calvinists I guess?

How do we reconcile these? I'd be very interested to know.

 

[preacher4truth]

There is no "balance" between electing grace and choosing one's own self into heaven. Stop looking for balance and instead accept the truths of Scripture that are so plain and clear.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

Keep studying bro, and if not, get into a good church, and I pray God answers Paul's prayer in you from Ephesians 1:15-23. Read it, not in a hurry and meditate on what Paul is saying and the LORD will give you understanding. Note how Paul says this in 2 Timothy 2:7.

15 Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints,

16 Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;

17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,

20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

23 Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

______

7 Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things.
_______

thanks for callin me bro

it put a smile on my face

Still waiting, and will for eternity wait for any anti-Calvinist to use any contextual exegesis to prove their teachings against such as true.

The fact is they cannot contextually and/or exegetically do so.

No, they cannot do so.

I have no teachings to push, but I'd love to talk about God and His Word with you

we don't even need to bring up the word calvin again

There are many books written to give attempt, yet every single Scripture given is taken completely out of context. That is a fact. This is just one fact that has helped me understand the Gospel and the importance of proper interpretation.

I promise to not use any books other than the bible
You were the one who told me it's ok to listen to other members of the body in Christ (twice now)

and even if it was a rough one
I appreciate the first time as much as the second

The choose yourself into heaven doctrine via free will (while said decisional regeneration is clearly refuted by Scripture) is a new comer doctrine that's been around for about 150 years plus or minus. The Scriptures that refute this decisional salvation are completely rejected as the opponents merely pit another passage, out of context, against them as if it neutralizes the truth. It's actually sad to watch.

I am not really well versed on the history of different doctrine and won't rely on them to examine my heart and Gods word while relying on Him for truth... buuuuut I am no longer opposed to having a nice conversation with someone who I may disagree with what I've seen and take that back to Gods feet in prayer if I sense any truth in it

that being said, I do not give myself any credit for choosing Jesus

I heard
and I believed

and I'm grateful for that... not proud... it was not me... it was Him

what drove me in the start was fear <- because i believed

now it is love <- because i believe

and i do not take credit for that faith... as if i needed to choose "ya ok now i decide to believe"....

The misinterpretations and misapplications of "all" in Scripture via this decisional regeneration doctrine have led to antinomianism, Universalism, FGT, denial and even ridicule of the evidence of conversion, believe-ism, easy-believism, sinners prayer salvation, "ask Jesus in your heart," ridicule of self-examination, presumptive deception, listen here: false assurance, and such a severe hatred for works that any type of works are mocked as a works gospel.

This sort of teaching has also denied Sovereign electing grace as these falsely believe God chose them only because he saw they would choose them, turning the gift of eternal life into a reward. Those who believe and embrace the fact God has elected unconditionally those whom he willed to save are mocked as being "special" because they believe he chooses based on nothing good in man and only according to his purpose, Romans 9:11ff, Ephesians 1:4ff.

Well if not understanding how the word all is being used in context is causing all those things... then we all ought to make sure when we see it in scripture we know how its being used.....

also I believe God chose me because He loves me... and without that love being first made known to me I would have never loved Him...(even if it was made known to me, I needed Him to give me a heart which could love Him)

They were chosen because God saw them do something good (and/or because out of their own sincere love for God they came to him ) yet we're special? That's just absurd and anyone promoting that idea doesn't have much sense. Lastly it has embraced the Romans 9:20 man.

who has promoted this idea?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

What do you suggest? Im talking about the "balance to be struck between both views" meaning arminians and calvinists I guess?

How do we reconcile these? I'd be very interested to know.

You can not reconcile them, they are 2 different gospels.

 

[TruthTalk]

View attachment 192204

Hi Budman, please show proof that Calvinism teaches predestination to hell
and that it teaches God will send children to hell, I don't see it.

Your choice of graphics to explain your view of Calvinism is in poor taste don't you think.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Hi Budman, please show proof that Calvinism teaches predestination to hell
and that it teaches God will send children to hell, I don't see it.

Your choice of graphics to explain your view of Calvinism is in poor taste don't you think.

If a person is not regenerated, and not given the opportunity to have the ability to be saved, Then by not chosing them to heaven, they are in fact. Chosen or predestined to hell.

Unlike those who believe God elects those who through his foreknowledge, do the will of God (see and believe) according to their free will. Those who end up in hell were offered the same gift, they chose to reject it,, They destined themselves to hell.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

God is all knowing, this includes knowing not only every action and word but the cause for them... not only to us believers but even those who reject our awesome Lord and savior Jesus Christ

He knew our grandchildrens last words before adam was created....

His knowledge in this does not exclude us from having free will, we just can not see the outcome as He can....

His hand is outstreched to all...even though who He knows will reject Him

and they will have no excuse before Him


Who here would believe any of this is untrue? (and why please)

 

[NoNameMcgee]

God is all knowing, this includes knowing not only every action and word but the cause for them... not only to us believers but even those who reject our awesome Lord and savior Jesus Christ

He knew our grandchildrens last words before adam was created....

His knowledge in this does not exclude us from having free will, we just can not see the outcome as He can....

His hand is outstreched to all...even though He knows who will reject Him

and they will have no excuse before Him


Who here would believe any of this is untrue? (and why please)

whoops made a typo

(fixed it in the reply)