Has the law been put aside? If so, when?

[Endoscopy]

I realized Jesus was teaching the Jews when he was delivering his ministry in ancient Palestine.
They would know the laws and what was what being raised to obey them.
I think they would also know those teachings concerning the promise of a messiah. When Jesus met that criteria they'd also know what of the laws no longer applied since he had fulfilled them.

But I also think if the laws of God were to have no importance whatsoever, Jesus would have taught that too. Rather than saying what he did about not one jot nor tittle would pass from the laws until all was accomplished.
He knew the sacrifice of animals to cover sins would end with his sacrifice. Meanwhile, going back to that old testament and the messiah prophecies, not all has been accomplished on that time table as yet.
That would mean those portions of the law that still apply are still in force. While Jesus showed as pertained to the Sabbath that it wasn't he that forbid work on that day. He did this by working miracles on that day.

The book of Mark is where we see the ministry of Jesus begin. I think Mark 7 is pretty clear about the law as Jesus intended it to be recognized.

You leave out he said the laws would be in place until heaven and earth disappear!!!

Matthew 5:17 and 18
17 Do not think that I have come to do away with or [ab]undo the Law or the Prophets; I have come not to do away with or undo but to complete and fulfill them.
18 For truly I tell you, until the sky and earth pass away and perish, not one smallest letter nor one little hook [identifying certain Hebrew letters] will pass from the Law until all things [it foreshadows] are accomplished.

 

[Mountaindude28]

a) The Law is PERFECT, for Yeshua is the walking Torah. Anyone who disregards the Torah, not only disregards Yeshua (who is a walking Torah), but G-d Himself and His perfection...however....

b) The Torah is only obligated to be kept by Jews, NOT Gentiles

c) Gentiles are "graphed" into the Children of Israel and the covenant through "grace" and are still obligated to hold to many "moral" laws and Noachide laws that Paul relates to in Acts 15:20-21.

d) Jews nor Gentiles are greater than one another in Yeshua, but clearly Jews hold spiritual gifts and Gentiles hold physical gifts. Just as a woman hold the right to give birth and is naturally a better nurturer, and a man is more physically strong (through genetic make up of G-d) and is held to be the "bread winner". Are the one together? Yes, but they still have different roles, just like the 12 tribes of Israel were not the same

e) Yeshua "fulfilling" means Yeshua showed us HOW to follow the Torah, because even today, there are many interpretations of the Torah in Judaism and most get it right but Yeshua provides it PERFECTLY. Just having "believe" in Yeshua means nothing. If I said I believe in pink elephants, big deal. It is your WORKS AFTER SALVATION...after our heart becomes pure to G-d, that you love G-d to DO HIS WILL...."your will be done"...

I think that simplifies it

 

[Grandpa]

A walking torah?? What does that even mean?

And how can you possibly reconcile that with scripture?

2 Corinthians 3:5-6
5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

 

[Endoscopy]

a) The Law is PERFECT, for Yeshua is the walking Torah. Anyone who disregards the Torah, not only disregards Yeshua (who is a walking Torah), but G-d Himself and His perfection...however....

b) The Torah is only obligated to be kept by Jews, NOT Gentiles

c) Gentiles are "graphed" into the Children of Israel and the covenant through "grace" and are still obligated to hold to many "moral" laws and Noachide laws that Paul relates to in Acts 15:20-21.

d) Jews nor Gentiles are greater than one another in Yeshua, but clearly Jews hold spiritual gifts and Gentiles hold physical gifts. Just as a woman hold the right to give birth and is naturally a better nurturer, and a man is more physically strong (through genetic make up of G-d) and is held to be the "bread winner". Are the one together? Yes, but they still have different roles, just like the 12 tribes of Israel were not the same

e) Yeshua "fulfilling" means Yeshua showed us HOW to follow the Torah, because even today, there are many interpretations of the Torah in Judaism and most get it right but Yeshua provides it PERFECTLY. Just having "believe" in Yeshua means nothing. If I said I believe in pink elephants, big deal. It is your WORKS AFTER SALVATION...after our heart becomes pure to G-d, that you love G-d to DO HIS WILL...."your will be done"...

I think that simplifies it

The simplest version is Jesus stating the law is in place until the heavens and earth disappear. Read my above quote to that effect!! You ignore that sin is breaking the Law of God!

 

[Endoscopy]

Stupid 5 minute rule again. Was editing within the time frame and the site messed up and by the time I got back the stupid tie time limit expired.
We all sin and come short of the glory of God. That means the law is in place!!!

 

[YDo]

You leave out he said the laws would be in place until heaven and earth disappear!!!

Matthew 5:17 and 18
17 Do not think that I have come to do away with or [ab]undo the Law or the Prophets; I have come not to do away with or undo but to complete and fulfill them.
18 For truly I tell you, until the sky and earth pass away and perish, not one smallest letter nor one little hook [identifying certain Hebrew letters] will pass from the Law until all things [it foreshadows] are accomplished.

I think you mistook my thoughts there. I didn't say the law wasn't effective or abolished.

 

[Endoscopy]

I think you mistook my thoughts there. I didn't say the law wasn't effective or abolished.

How can you say that. I understand everything perfectly since I achieved perfection in everything.
ROFL

 

[Endoscopy]

A walking torah?? What does that even mean?

And how can you possibly reconcile that with scripture?

2 Corinthians 3:5-6
5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

The Torah was created by Moses with the inspiration of God! Jesus said "I and the Father are one." Therefore Jesus was the creator of the Torah inspiring Moses to write it. There is proof of this in the Torah. Several years ago I bought 2 books about codes in the Bible. Some rabbis had seen some in the early chapter of each creating a book of the Torah. 4 had the identical codes and the fifth a different one. Codes start with a specific letter and go either forwards or backwards every so many letters. The college equivalent to our MIT had a group of students get together and design a program to do this automatically. What the found shocked them. There were names of people who were recently died with their birth and deceased dates. One was the current prime Minister. Their version of our secret service took note and foiled an assassination attempt on that date. They published their software so others could use it. It only works on the original languages of the Bible. In 2 messianic texts the name of Jesus with "it is he" along with the names of the disciples excluding Judas and including the person named to replace him. Since 2 had the same name only 11 names are there.

Consider the awesome ability of God to cause the authors of the Bible to include those codes. 2 seperate books filled with them. "Bible Code" and "Bible Code II the Countdown" both by Michael Drosnin. The paper cover for the hard cover books has an example of it. I

 

[Endoscopy]

I just checked and found a third book on the codes, "Bible Prophecy Proved through the Mysterious Bible Codes" by Grant R. Jeffrey.

 

[Blik]

Romans 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

Hebrews 7:18-19
18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

2 Corinthians 3:6-9
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

How is it that you don't understand the scriptures? This is what God has said. This is what He has proclaimed.

Galatians 3:2-3
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Every one of these scriptures promotes keeping the law, it is just that it promotes keeping it in the spirit of the Lord rather than in legalism.

It is like the Lord teaching the difference between celebrating Christmas with fancy china and expensive presents and celebrating it with kindness toward others.

 

[Endoscopy]

Every one of these scriptures promotes keeping the law, it is just that it promotes keeping it in the spirit of the Lord rather than in legalism.

It is like the Lord teaching the difference between celebrating Christmas with fancy china and expensive presents and celebrating it with kindness toward others.

Here is Jesus on the law!

Matthew 5 NIV
The Fulfillment of the Law
17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Grandpa]

Every one of these scriptures promotes keeping the law, it is just that it promotes keeping it in the spirit of the Lord rather than in legalism.

It is like the Lord teaching the difference between celebrating Christmas with fancy china and expensive presents and celebrating it with kindness toward others.

Its much more than that.

It proclaims that the 10 commandments written on stone are the Ministry of Death and Condemnation.

It proclaims that the Spirit is the Ministry of Righteousness and Life.

So it is a pretty important difference.

Its a little bit different than putting the fancy china away and being kind to others. All that is is another form of legalism. Shifting the focus from your rituals to your work. Maybe there are humanists that would applaud this but not Christians. Christians focus on Christ. What comes from our focus on Christ is good work. Such as kindness to others. But not just on Christmas.

 

[Grandpa]

Here is Jesus on the law!

Matthew 5 NIV
The Fulfillment of the Law
17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Here's more Jesus on the law!

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Here's what you can do when you find out you can't do;

Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

 

[Blik]

Here's more Jesus on the law!

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Here's what you can do when you find out you can't do;

Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

You believe is doing as we are told to do, just with that soft heart of yours that you got from Christ.

 

[Endoscopy]

Since the law is in place and we fail to live up to it we sin in breaking the law. This sin ondemns us but Jesus paid the price for us on the cross. His rising the third day is proof he is the Messiah. Thus he freely gives us grace so those who accept his grace are saved through faith in Jesus. This is the gospel message. Too many reject this and think it foolishness and ridicule it. This country was in colonial days and a long time afterwards was a Christian nation. Today only a splinter of it is Christian. The main large protestant denominations have been taken over by secular ministers in it for access to the money. This only left independent churches and sub denominations still preaching the gospel message. Thus only a small splinter of people hear the gospel message. This is a very sad fact.

 

[prove-all]

Stupid 5 minute rule again.

Try typing in a blank notepad, then copy and past in reply box when done,
check any typos, then post reply. Hope this helps anyone.

 

[YDo]

Here is Jesus on the law!

Matthew 5 NIV
The Fulfillment of the Law
17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

How would that apply when we're told no one can keep the law perfectly?
Are we being warned we'll really not enter the kingdom of Heaven that Jesus first said was inside us?

 

[Endoscopy]

How would that apply when we're told no one can keep the law perfectly?
Are we being warned we'll really not enter the kingdom of Heaven that Jesus first said was inside us?

You ask this on a Christian site? What are you?
We are saved by grace through faith in Jesus. Jesus took the sins of us on himself so those who accept his grace are seen by God at judgement as sinless. Basic gospel message. Those who reject him will be judged by the law!!

 

[Blik]

You ask this on a Christian site? What are you?
We are saved by grace through faith in Jesus. Jesus took the sins of us on himself so those who accept his grace are seen by God at judgement as sinless. Basic gospel message. Those who reject him will be judged by the law!!

For some that is the end of the story of living. For others it is the beginning of living for Christ and that is an exciting wonderful journey.

 

[Endoscopy]

For some that is the end of the story of living. For others it is the beginning of living for Christ and that is an exciting wonderful journey.

I agree. My problem was stating your question on this site. It seems to be an atheist point of view.