Calvinist Kitchen...stirring the pot
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Nope!
That is what Paul tells us in Romans . . .
"For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another) In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel" (Romans 2:12-16).
In many regards the faith (or obedience to conscience) of the heathen far surpassed that of the Jew who had the law but disobeyed it because he figured he could since he was a Jew.
That is what Paul tells us in Romans . . .
"For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another) In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel" (Romans 2:12-16).
In many regards the faith (or obedience to conscience) of the heathen far surpassed that of the Jew who had the law but disobeyed it because he figured he could since he was a Jew.
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I'm only telling you what Paul said about the conscience before the giving of the law. There are those that knew right from wrong because of their ability to discern. So, they chose to do right - and God honored that. That was all before the Jew came on the scene. But Paul is still comparing the man under conscience to the Jew under law. And the Jew more often than not was faulted for using his title 'Jew' as a replacement for any duty he had to do right.
Remember, Paul does say that a man may be saved by good works . . . if those works exceed God's standards. Well, before the Law, there was no measuring stick, so God honored the right living of those that didn't know any better but knew what it was to obey his conscience.
Remember, Paul does say that a man may be saved by good works . . . if those works exceed God's standards. Well, before the Law, there was no measuring stick, so God honored the right living of those that didn't know any better but knew what it was to obey his conscience.
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The reason the gentiles by nature followed the law is the law is written in our dna, We are made in the image of Christ.
That is the point Paul was trying to make.
Abraham was saved by faith, Not by works of any type. Thay is how salvation was granted to all men and women of all time..
That is the point Paul was trying to make.
Abraham was saved by faith, Not by works of any type. Thay is how salvation was granted to all men and women of all time..
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No, it was not
Even David understood sacrifice and burnt offering God did nto desire.
You have God holding a group of people to different standard than other people.
God is the same yesterday today and tomorrow. Salvation has, and always will be by grace.
The law was a tutor to lead people to christ. It could NEVER make anyone rightous, not one person was ever justified by any part of the law
Even David understood sacrifice and burnt offering God did nto desire.
You have God holding a group of people to different standard than other people.
God is the same yesterday today and tomorrow. Salvation has, and always will be by grace.
The law was a tutor to lead people to christ. It could NEVER make anyone rightous, not one person was ever justified by any part of the law
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The Law was added . . . it didn't have to be added . . . Israel insisted. But since they did insist, now the Law is the Old Testament standard. Israel, as a nation, forsook grace and demanded law.
"And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD" (Exodus 19:8).
Too bad Israel chose Law over grace.
But then, Israel can hardly be referred to as geniuses when it comes to their national decisions.
"Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children" (Matthew 27:25).
Again . . .
"Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator" (Galatians 3:19).
"And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD" (Exodus 19:8).
Too bad Israel chose Law over grace.
But then, Israel can hardly be referred to as geniuses when it comes to their national decisions.
"Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children" (Matthew 27:25).
Again . . .
"Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator" (Galatians 3:19).
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First of all, the blood of those sacrificed animals could forgive sins, cover sins, but never take them away. This is the righteousness found under the law. It was self righteousness for obeying the law. God's righteousness is found through the shed blood of Jesus Christ. It was not yet available to those OT saints.
Leviticus 19
21 And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the Lord, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, even a ram for a trespass offering.
22 And the priest shall make an atonement for him with the ram of the trespass offering before the Lord for his sin which he hath done: and the sin which he hath done shall be forgiven him.
Exodus 34
6 And the Lord passed by before him, and proclaimed, The Lord, The Lord God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth,
7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.
Forgiveness of sin was available to the man who live by the law, but his sin was not forgotten as under the blood of Christ.
Another example:
Luke 1
5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
Romans 10
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
Leviticus 19
21 And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the Lord, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, even a ram for a trespass offering.
22 And the priest shall make an atonement for him with the ram of the trespass offering before the Lord for his sin which he hath done: and the sin which he hath done shall be forgiven him.
Exodus 34
6 And the Lord passed by before him, and proclaimed, The Lord, The Lord God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth,
7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.
Forgiveness of sin was available to the man who live by the law, but his sin was not forgotten as under the blood of Christ.
Another example:
Luke 1
5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
Romans 10
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
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You ignore the fact that the inspired word of God is in Hebrew, Aramaic and koine Judeo Greek. Not English. Translators do their best but they are human. Errors have occurred in translations. That is why I use my smart phone as my Bible. I have a web page on biblegateway.com and select book and chapter. Then I can easily switch between translations to compare the language in each. My favorites are KJV, NIV, ESV, and AMPC. What I like about AMPC is it puts the different meanings of a word in parentheses. This verse is a favorite of mine for demonstrating this. Look at "believes in".
John 3 AMPC
16 For God so greatly loved and dearly prized the world that He [even] gave up His only begotten (unique) Son, so that whoever believes in (trusts in, clings to, relies on) Him shall not perish (come to destruction, be lost) but have eternal (everlasting) life
John 3 AMPC
16 For God so greatly loved and dearly prized the world that He [even] gave up His only begotten (unique) Son, so that whoever believes in (trusts in, clings to, relies on) Him shall not perish (come to destruction, be lost) but have eternal (everlasting) life
The old testament saints were regenerated and were given the indwelling of the Holy Spirit (Isa 63:11). The natural man does not have the ability to discern spiritual things.(1 Cor 2:14) Election started before the foundation of the world and is evidenced throughout the scriptures.
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Foolish question. Along with Rev 22:18 no attempt is being made to add or subtract words. Only the attempt to create a correct translation. Where do you come up with this idiocy?
We are all flawed human beings and make mistakes as a result. This is why the more recent translations are made by committees not single persons. What one misses hopefully will be caught by someone else.
We are all flawed human beings and make mistakes as a result. This is why the more recent translations are made by committees not single persons. What one misses hopefully will be caught by someone else.
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