Matthew 6:9-13

[PennEd]

Maybe.......need/should........... but you know what I'm gonna say

need to obey Him........should obey Him?

I don't think it is implicit...........I think what one faces is SEVERE REPROACH and CHASTISEMENT from God if one does NOT......He will get ya back on the straight and narrow one way or the other........

There are just those here who do not believe one has to do anything........just read the Suicide thread.......and I know you have been, look at some of the responses there........

Thanks, and God bless you and yours

This is pretty much exactly what I think brother. The only caveat being that He is going to transform us so that we will obey, and if we continue not to, I believe that chastisement will eventually be physical death.

Blessings to you and your's as well.

 

[p_rehbein]

I'd like to know what father sets his child up to fail, and when they do, says screw this I'm out of here.

Dunno, perchance you can expand a bit on that?

We live in a fallen creation, we are not perfect beings (yet)........ Is God to blame when we fail? I don't think so. I believe we have a choice, but others don't think we do. So, maybe they blame God, I don't.

As well, I never ONCE said anything about God saying "screw this, I'm outta here." So, maybe someone I have on ignore said it?

God IS FAITHFUL to forgive. He will NEVER leave or forsake us........Have always said that and always believed that...........we, however, can surely forsake Him..........I believe that because I believe in free will.

 

[p_rehbein]

Doing some research, and saw that folks on other Sites are talking about this too........or, have in the past, didn't check the dates

forgiveness - perpetual or do we need to constantly ask for ...

• www.christianforums.com
• › Forums

I think that God forgives us and makes us clean when we accept Jesus, but when we sin after we've accepted Him, we still have to ask for forgiveness.God will forgive us as soon as we ask if we're honestly asking for forgiveness, of course, but just because we've accepted Jesus doesn't mean weget a free pass to do what we want.

 

[p_rehbein]

Some more reading........

What Does the Bible Say About Forgiveness of Sins?
www.christianbiblereference.org/faq_forgiveness.htm
When we have sinned, we can ask God for forgiveness, as in the Lord's Prayer: and forgive us our sins, just as we have forgiven those who have sinned against us. (TLB, Matthew 6:12)

Availability of Forgiveness
The good news is that, no matter how serious the sin, God is always seeking us out and is willing to forgive and forget our sins and give us a fresh start. As long as we live, it is never too late to ask for forgiveness and make a new start!

So Jesus used this illustration: "If you had one hundred sheep, and one of them strayed away and was lost in the wilderness, wouldn't you leave the ninety-nine others to go and search for the lost one until you found it? And then you would joyfully carry it home on your shoulders. When you arrived, you would call together your friends and neighbors to rejoice with you because your lost sheep was found. In the same way, heaven will be happier over one lost sinner who returns to God than over ninety-nine others who are righteous and haven't strayed away! (NLT, Luke 15:3-7)​

When we have sinned, we can ask God for forgiveness, as in the Lord's Prayer:

and forgive us our sins, just as we have forgiven those who have sinned against us. (TLB, Matthew 6:12)​

Related verses: Psalms 25:7, Psalms 32:1-2, Isaiah 43:25, Matthew 1:21, Matthew 18:12-14, Matthew 26:28, Luke 15:11-32, Acts 10:43, Acts 13:38, Romans 4:7-8, Hebrews 10:17.

Conditions of Forgiveness
Although God is always ready and willing to forgive us, He requires two things of us as conditions of forgiveness: repentance and forgiveness of others. Depending on the circumstances, confession and restitution may also be needed.

 

[ljs]

There is a process to sanctification, do you acknowledge that? If so, then being made worthy to be presented Holy and Blameless to Him is a process. Getting saved is STEP ONE....of a life journey........in my opinion. Jesus said this, and the Apostle Paul said this.

1st Corinthians 6:11
And such were some of you , But ye are WASHED , ye are SANCTIFIED, ye are JUSTIFIED , in the name of the Lord Jesus , and by the spirit of our God .

If your saved , your already these things

 

[p_rehbein]

1st Corinthians 6:11
And such were some of you , But ye are WASHED , ye are SANCTIFIED, ye are JUSTIFIED , in the name of the Lord Jesus , and by the spirit of our God .

If your saved , your already these things

Colossians 1:19) For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell; 20) And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they bethings in earth, or things in heaven.
21) And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled
22) In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
23) If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

Matthew 24:10) And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11) And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 12) And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.


Matthew 13:18) Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower. 19) When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side. 20) But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it; 21) Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22) He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
23) But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.


There are many, many more Scriptures that show that sanctification is a process......a life long process.......The Apostle Paul spent much of his Ministry telling us this.........one example is when he taught the difference between Carnal and Spiritual Christians.

thanks.......

 

[BaptistBibleBeliever]

to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
23) If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel

Yes, some Christians stop being the vibrant ambassadors for Christ that Paul encouraged them to be . . . well, I guess Paul won't be able to present them unreproveable at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

But hey, God can . . . and God will . . .

"Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen"
Jude 1:24-25).

I mean, that is if you are willing to simply take God at His Word and not claim that this verse is obviously a mistranslation from the Greek or some copyists error.

"And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work" (II Corinthians 9:8).

I am so glad that GOD IS ABLE!

If He wasn't Christians might be able to lose their salvation or something.

 

[p_rehbein]

1st Corinthians 6:11
And such were some of you , But ye are WASHED , ye are SANCTIFIED, ye are JUSTIFIED , in the name of the Lord Jesus , and by the spirit of our God .

If your saved , your already these things

Additional thoughts for you:

1 Corinthians 3:1) And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.

Hebrews 5:12) For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

The Apostle Paul taught of these two types of Believers. They surely existed in the Church at that time, and, even today, the Church has both Carnal and Spiritual Believers. To be sure, they are both saved, and will receive eternal life, however there are differences between the two, and these differences have caused much disputations over the years, even from the founding of the Church by Paul and the other Apostles.

The main distinction between the Carnal and the Spiritual is Sanctification. Sanctification is simply the receiving of the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit. Paul taught this, and stressed the need for Believers to receive the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit so they could grow to their fullest within the Church and in Christ.

The way to Sanctification is laid out in the Book of Acts. It is achieved by having Sanctified Believers lay hands on and pray over a new convert.

Acts 8:14) Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
(For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

Acts 19:1) And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

There is one instance in Scripture where people received the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit (were Sanctified) without the laying on of hands. Actually, without the laying on of human hands.

At Pentecost, when the Disciples were all gathered in the Upper Room:
Acts 1: And when they were come in, they went up into an upper room, where abode both Peter, and James, and John, and Andrew, Philip, and Thomas, Bartholomew, and Matthew, James the son of Alphaeus, and Simon Zelotes, and Judas the brother of James.
These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brethren.

2:1) And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

The reason for this difference is quite simply because at that time there were no Sanctified Believers in the Church, for none of them had received the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit. It was the Spirit Himself who “laid hands on them.” Thus preparing them to go forth and establish Gods Church here on earth……Saved, Sanctified, Justified!

Again, I stress that both the Carnal and Spiritual Believers are saved and are a child of God. As they were at the beginning of the Church, and have been throughout all the years since, and are now, and will be when the Eastern Sky splits, and Christ returns.

For me, there are differences that become apparent when I fellowship with other Believers, and it is easy to determine of the two which they are. These are my thoughts, and are not meant to hurt or belittle anyone, so do not be offended.

The Carnal focus on the Earthly, while the Spiritual focus on the Heavenly.

The Carnal pray for their desires, while the Spiritual pray for their needs.

The Carnal focus on their personal gain, while the Spiritual focus on the gain of others.

The Carnal focus on the baptism of John, while the Spiritual focus on the baptism of Christ.

The Carnal focus on the person preaching the Gospel, while the Spiritual focus on the Gospel being preached.

The Carnal focus on the traditions of man, while the Spiritual focus on the Doctrines of God.


For me, both of these are my Brothers and Sisters in Christ, and I am happy to fellowship with either.

 

[preacher4truth]

Additional thoughts for you:

More error on your part.

 

[CharliRenee]

Yes, I confess my sins to God and others as a means to hold myself accountable. If I can not name my sins to God or others, what am I hiding. We do it for healing also.. and openness..

We are so on the same page, yes yes yes. Accountability is a blessing that sets us free, ironically. I don't know about you, but I can always use more healing and transparency.

 

[CharliRenee]

His prayer shows us to ask for forgiveness and to make sure we also forgive. I believe He died so we can be set free, but a part of that freedom includes growth and mercy. I think seeking mercy and extending it is something that brings communion with Him, because it is who He is. How can we grow or hope for change if we are dissensitized to the affects of our wrong doings or the error of our ways? Redemption's nature includes remorse and regret for things that we hope not to repeat, right? I don't understand why we wouldn't want to be forgiven for not walking in the way we know He wants. I know, though, before I ask, He knows the unspoken regret of my heart. And I know because my remorse is sincere, so will be His mercy.

 

[oldethennew]

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Yesterday at 11:26 AM
 #351




1COR. 9:27.
But, I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means,
when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.-rejected-reprobate-unfit.

HEB. 3:6.
But Christ as a Son over His own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing
of the hope firm unto the end.

1JOHN 2:2-3-4-5-6.
And He is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

And hereby we do know that we know Him, if we keep His Commandments.

He that saith, I know Him, and keeps not His Commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

But whoso keeps His Word, in him verily is The Love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in Him.

11PETER 2:20-21-22.
For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ,
they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

For it had been better for them not to have known=recognized-ascertained' the way of Righteousness,
than, after they have known it, to turn from The Holy Commandment delivered unto them.

But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again;
and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

JOHN 8:51.
Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep My saying, he shall never see death.

ACTS 10:35.
But in every nation he that fears Him, and works righteousness, is accepted with Him.

ROMANS 11:22.
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness,
if thou continue in His goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

HEB. 10:35.
Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.

JOHN 14:15.
If you Love Me, keep My Commandments.

21.
He that has My Commandments, and keeps them, he it is that Loves Me: and he that Loves Me
shall be Loved of My Father, and I will love him, and will manifest Myself to him.

15:10.
If you keep My Commandments, you shall abide in My Love; even as I have kept My Father's Commandments,
and abide in His Love.

1JOHN 2:24.
Let that therefore abide in you, which you have heard from the beginning. If that which you have heard
from the beginning shall remain in you, you also shall continue in The Son, and in The Father.

 

[Zmouth]

So Jesus used this illustration: "If you had one hundred sheep, and one of them strayed away and was lost in the wilderness, wouldn't you leave the ninety-nine others to go and search for the lost one until you found it?

Notice that he spoke this parable to those who had no shepherd? See Mark 4:11

And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand. Luke 8:10

So unless you were a hireling then you would not know that you didn't even know that you didn't know the first thing a shepherd must must know in order to watch over his flock.

But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep. John 10:12​

The second thing you can count on is that the shepherd knows is never leave nor forsake the flock at any time.

The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep. John 10:13​

And then you would joyfully carry it home on your shoulders.

Did anybody hear the boy cry wolf?

When you arrived, you would call together your friends and neighbors to rejoice with you because your lost sheep was found.

Your hireling.
John 15:22 John 15:24 2 Tim 4:13

 

[JaumeJ]

Everyone here who responded negatively to my Post...........I suggest you take the time to read the "Suicide" thread on the BDF, then get back to me.............. Thanks

I cannot find an emoticon for patience and ongsuffering, but if Icould it would be by your post(s) asking people to actually read your post before replying…….I know the feeling.

 

[p_rehbein]

Notice that he spoke this parable to those who had no shepherd? See Mark 4:11

And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand. Luke 8:10

So unless you were a hireling then you would not know that you didn't even know that you didn't know the first thing a shepherd must must know in order to watch over his flock.

But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep. John 10:12​

The second thing you can count on is that the shepherd knows is never leave nor forsake the flock at any time.

The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep. John 10:13​

Did anybody hear the boy cry wolf?



Your hireling.
John 15:22 John 15:24 2 Tim 4:13

uh, you do know you are responding to an Article...............and not what I said?

 

[trofimus]

Thank you for that.........I know other OSAS folks who also do, and good! So, with that in mind, please take the time to read the Thread titled "Suicide" on the Forum Page now, and tell me how many times you see your thoughts stated there.............

God bless

I do not think that the last thing I will do in life is the decisive thing.

Also, I do not believe that my salvation depends on all my sins to be recognized, repented and confessed.

The prayer of "Our Father" gives me a rule that I should confess that I am still a sinner in a need of God's forgiveness.

When I have some bigger sin in my life, I ask for forgiveness specifically, but I realize that 90% of sins go unnoticed in my life, therefore I ask for forgiveness of all my sins, regularly.

But I do not believe that I will not be saved if I die before night and therefore before my regular confessing ;-)

 

[Zmouth]

uh, you do know you are responding to an Article...............and not what I said?

Well I did ask if you noticed that he spoke this parable to those who had no shepherd. I was just wondering.

But as far as the rest, uh, I was just comparing scripture with scripture since I would hope you believe that the scripture is spiritual

 

[p_rehbein]

Well I did ask if you noticed that he spoke this parable to those who had no shepherd. I was just wondering.

But as far as the rest, uh, I was just comparing scripture with scripture since I would hope you believe that the scripture is spiritual

Yes, BUT all of that comment you are speaking of was an Article posted as FYI, so when you stated "p,rehbein siad" it looks like I said what you are quoting............and that can be misleading for those reading the Thread, right?

Anyhoo.......just wanted to clarify that I did not say what the Article said. I didn't even say I agreed or disagreed with what was said, I simply posted it (and several others) as FYI for those reading the Thread......

Thanks.......

 

[p_rehbein]

I do not think that the last thing I will do in life is the decisive thing.

Also, I do not believe that my salvation depends on all my sins to be recognized, repented and confessed.

The prayer of "Our Father" gives me a rule that I should confess that I am still a sinner in a need of God's forgiveness.

When I have some bigger sin in my life, I ask for forgiveness specifically, but I realize that 90% of sins go unnoticed in my life, therefore I ask for forgiveness of all my sins, regularly.

But I do not believe that I will not be saved if I die before night and therefore before my regular confessing ;-)

Did you read the Thread? If so, did you take note of the number of comments that directly state what I spoke of in the OP of this Thread? That is why I asked you to read the Suicide Thread.......... To see if your thoughts are mirrored by those expressed in that Thread.

 

[trofimus]

Did you read the Thread? If so, did you take note of the number of comments that directly state what I spoke of in the OP of this Thread? That is why I asked you to read the Suicide Thread.......... To see if your thoughts are mirrored by those expressed in that Thread.

Just few posts, I am not interested in that thread.

I cannot speak for anyone else but myself... I believe in OSAS, I confess my sins regularly and I do not think that I must confess all my sins specifically to be saved...