Church is it even biblical
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J
my opinion is bases on Solomons temple, it was a holy place meant to house the name of the Most High. when the Father gave instructions to build it He was very specific on each and every detail, it was a most holy place, therefore one would conduct themsleves in the most respectful way when gathered together inside. this would make it much different than the blacksmiths shop where you make tools. you can praise the Most High in both places but both places are not the same. any place of worship IMO should use Solomons temple as its example.
Nope. It's not as easy as you think; appointment by the assemblies was only to bring organization within the assembly and not to teach or preach the word of God. From the time of Adam, God specifically appointed those that brought the word of God to the people in the form of kings/angels/prophets/judges/Himself and lastly the apostles and 1st century witnesses. From that time there has never been an appointment.
Jer 31:
31“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
32It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to d them, e ”
declares the Lord.
33“This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,” declares the Lord.
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
34No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord.
31“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
32It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to d them, e ”
declares the Lord.
33“This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,” declares the Lord.
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
34No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord.
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Christians can meet all they want but for what? What's the reason for meeting?
Jesus's coming is not something that one can say here or there He is or it is in the future or it was in the past. He is and was and is to come the Almighty - meaning that Jesus has always been coming since the 1st century and will continue until the end of age. Likewise, resurrection of end times saints is not something that one can say it will be in the future or it has already happened because it is a continuous thing that happens daily since the 1st century.
If these fundamental truth is lost so easily through the idea of modern churches and self appointed shepherds, then you know why God has lamented severally about the self appointed teachers and prophets.
Jesus's coming is not something that one can say here or there He is or it is in the future or it was in the past. He is and was and is to come the Almighty - meaning that Jesus has always been coming since the 1st century and will continue until the end of age. Likewise, resurrection of end times saints is not something that one can say it will be in the future or it has already happened because it is a continuous thing that happens daily since the 1st century.
If these fundamental truth is lost so easily through the idea of modern churches and self appointed shepherds, then you know why God has lamented severally about the self appointed teachers and prophets.
You're making the claim that since the 1st century there has never been a genuine teacher or preacher.
I think we could find any number of flaws in this proposition in a variety of ways: Biblically, historically, and philosophically.
Since I have sincerely never heard of any other Christian holding this view, I can't imagine why I'd bother debating it.
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When do you think this (below) was to take place?
Jer 31:
31“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
32It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to d them, e ”
declares the Lord.
33“This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,” declares the Lord.
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
34No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord.
Jer 31:
31“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
32It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to d them, e ”
declares the Lord.
33“This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,” declares the Lord.
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
34No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord.
This Issue:
There are lots of people who have a bad experience in a church, and simply "presume" that all churches must be bad.
It's a purely emotional decision, and contrary to scripture.
The world is full of people like this, who are just emotionally upset.
Some of them... some of them... actually try to come up with biblical grounds to JUSTIFY their personal, unbiblical behavior.
People always try to justify unbiblical behavior.
People always try to justify sin.
Now, we can all understand people being upset.
We can all understand people might be genuinely mistreated, and that leaves a scar.
We can all understand that.
But that's really as far as it goes.
We can be kind, and understanding, but we needn't really worry about someone dreaming up bad doctrine to justify their behavior.
...
There are lots of people who have a bad experience in a church, and simply "presume" that all churches must be bad.
It's a purely emotional decision, and contrary to scripture.
The world is full of people like this, who are just emotionally upset.
Some of them... some of them... actually try to come up with biblical grounds to JUSTIFY their personal, unbiblical behavior.
People always try to justify unbiblical behavior.
People always try to justify sin.
Now, we can all understand people being upset.
We can all understand people might be genuinely mistreated, and that leaves a scar.
We can all understand that.
But that's really as far as it goes.
We can be kind, and understanding, but we needn't really worry about someone dreaming up bad doctrine to justify their behavior.
...
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2 Tim 4:
1In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who will judge the living and the dead, and in view of his appearing and his kingdom, I give you this charge: 2Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. 3For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. 5But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.
6For I am already being poured out like a drink offering, and the time for my departure is near. 7I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith. 8Now there is in store for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day—and not only to me, but also to all who have longed for his appearing.
The clue is in the prophesy- the time comes when people will heap for themselves teachers....That time is now.
1In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who will judge the living and the dead, and in view of his appearing and his kingdom, I give you this charge: 2Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. 3For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. 5But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.
6For I am already being poured out like a drink offering, and the time for my departure is near. 7I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith. 8Now there is in store for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day—and not only to me, but also to all who have longed for his appearing.
The clue is in the prophesy- the time comes when people will heap for themselves teachers....That time is now.
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This is irrelevant because I wasn't discussing the definition of ekkelesia;
I was discussing the OPs quite transparent, and quite common, motivation for this entire thread.
It's quite common.
A. People have some bad experience at a particular assembly of believers.
B. Then they decide they don't want to ever be part of an assembly again.
c. Then they start dreaming up some bad doctrine to justify their BEHAVIOR.
This is old.
This has been occurring since the 1st century.
Paul talked about it.
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That does not sound at all like Biblical Christianity to me. Do you reject the passages about waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Paul also warned about men who taught that the resurrection had come already (bold emphasis mine)
II Timothy 2
15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 16 But shun profane and idle babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness. 17 And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort, 18 who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”
20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay, some for honor and some for dishonor. 21 Therefore if anyone cleanses himself from the latter, he will be a vessel for honor, sanctified and useful for the Master, prepared for every good work.
I read an interesting exegesis of this article that said that Paul was likely referring to Korah's rebellion, where the ground opened up, and the people were told to depart from these wicked men. The author said the Greek here, translated 'iniquity' could refer to the set of persons or things characterized by iniquity.
It would seem Paul is comparing these men who taught that the resurrection had already occured to vessels of dishonor, also, from whom the one who would be a vessel of honor must cleanse himself.
Paul also warned about men who taught that the resurrection had come already (bold emphasis mine)
II Timothy 2
15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 16 But shun profane and idle babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness. 17 And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort, 18 who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”
20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay, some for honor and some for dishonor. 21 Therefore if anyone cleanses himself from the latter, he will be a vessel for honor, sanctified and useful for the Master, prepared for every good work.
I read an interesting exegesis of this article that said that Paul was likely referring to Korah's rebellion, where the ground opened up, and the people were told to depart from these wicked men. The author said the Greek here, translated 'iniquity' could refer to the set of persons or things characterized by iniquity.
It would seem Paul is comparing these men who taught that the resurrection had already occured to vessels of dishonor, also, from whom the one who would be a vessel of honor must cleanse himself.