Hi Undergrace, agree if something is dead then it had to be alive at one point in time, sounds to me like TheQuestion is refering to James2:14 again,
Ephesians2:8-10
Not By Works
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Ephesians2:8-10
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UnderGrace
Guest
Hi Undergrace, agree if something is dead then it had to be alive at one point in time, sounds to me like TheQuestion is refering to James2:14 again,
Ephesians2:8-10
Exactly, people read the word "save" and think that the word is always referring to saving faith, James is not writing about saving faith in this passage.
HAHAHAHHAHHAHAHH that has got to be the biggest farce of a reply I have ever seen by a working for Cainologist.....the following alludes your mentality
con·text
ˈkäntekst/
noun
- the circumstances that form the setting for an event, statement, or idea, and in terms of which it can be fully understood and assessed.
"the decision was taken within the context of planned cuts in spending"
synonyms:circumstances, conditions, factors, state of affairs, situation, background, scene, settin
U
UnderGrace
Guest
The only churchianity people I have met on this thread are the ones that preach/teach works are necessary to prove salvation or that works are part of salvation. Hmm isn't that ironic.
The only churchianity people I have met on this thread on the ones that preaches works are necessary to prove salvation or that works are part of salvation. Hmm isn't that ironic.
Gonna be a lot of working for Cainologists that make the proverbial "MANY" grouping before Jesus because they cannot grasp or are not willing to grasp the actual context of JAMES......
Hi Undergrace, you are correct that they are misinterpreting James2:14, and I will add that they will also say; 'you see, because without works you will lose your eternal salvation.' Therefore salvation is by works or else your faith is dead.
Oh my then we all better get to work trying to keep ourselves saved with our wonderful self-righteous deeds.
I can't recall anywhere in the Bible that Jesus said
"If you want to be saved then you must do works in order to be saved"
If I'm wrong can anyone post Bible verses where Jesus said that.
My understanding is that if that was the case then Jesus would have said something along the lines of
"Here is the way to be saved, I command you to do this, you must do xxxxx amount of works, never sin again, be baptised in the Holy Spirit, speak in tongues, I've shown you the way, now go and do it. I don't need to die on the cross and you do not need the Holy Spirit, go with it kids, be perfect just as I am"
Hmmm
Let's look at what Jesus said
John 6:28
28 Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?”
John 6:29
29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”
John 16:7-9
7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me;
John 19:30
30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, “It is finished!” And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.
John 14:15-18
Jesus Promises Another Helper
15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
I can't recall anywhere in the Bible where Jesus said "If you want to be saved then do this"
But what I do see is that Jesus said "The first work is faith in him, then the Holy Spirit will be in us when we come to believe in him, he will be our helper, and as result we will obey his commandments because we love him"
It's all about love.
It's out of love for him we do works, not in order to loved and accepted.
We have already been accepted when he said "It is finished" when we place true genuine faith in him.
Think about it, if it's not genuine faith in him then we would not have been given the Holy Spirit, the deposit of our inheritance.
It's faith that saves, not works.
As our faith grows then also our works grow.
Just evidence of faith in action.
"If you want to be saved then you must do works in order to be saved"
If I'm wrong can anyone post Bible verses where Jesus said that.
My understanding is that if that was the case then Jesus would have said something along the lines of
"Here is the way to be saved, I command you to do this, you must do xxxxx amount of works, never sin again, be baptised in the Holy Spirit, speak in tongues, I've shown you the way, now go and do it. I don't need to die on the cross and you do not need the Holy Spirit, go with it kids, be perfect just as I am"
Hmmm
Let's look at what Jesus said
John 6:28
28 Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?”
John 6:29
29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”
John 16:7-9
7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me;
John 19:30
30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, “It is finished!” And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.
John 14:15-18
Jesus Promises Another Helper
15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
I can't recall anywhere in the Bible where Jesus said "If you want to be saved then do this"
But what I do see is that Jesus said "The first work is faith in him, then the Holy Spirit will be in us when we come to believe in him, he will be our helper, and as result we will obey his commandments because we love him"
It's all about love.
It's out of love for him we do works, not in order to loved and accepted.
We have already been accepted when he said "It is finished" when we place true genuine faith in him.
Think about it, if it's not genuine faith in him then we would not have been given the Holy Spirit, the deposit of our inheritance.
It's faith that saves, not works.
As our faith grows then also our works grow.
Just evidence of faith in action.
AMEN Bill...there are none.........our new member is now peddling watchtower dogma in another thread...denying Jesus is God and peddling that he had a beginning and was created.......
Silly JW’s - there’s only room for 144,000, and he ain’t one of them. Hey, God won’t even remember him.
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Gladly!~
Matt 28:19- Go (a COMMAND) therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age.
Not "Go therefore and build churches, paying men to preach to you."
It's sickly ironic that so many SCREAMING they believe Jesus DON'T- and Judge those that DO!
You don't believe Jesus....but rather the false, satanic dogma of a man who started his own false religion....Charles Taze Russell.....and for one who believes in works for salvation you are breaking the rules of this site by posting Jehovah's Witness dogma....
In the other thread he is pushing a created Jesus that is not God and when I called him on his JW roots he lied and called me dishonest.....more of his working for dogma I guess....
So where in the verse that you quote does it say in order to be saved?
Did not Peter have an issue to start with in taking the gospel to the gentiles?
Is that why Paul and Peter had an argument.
Is that not why God gave him a vision about unclean.
That was my above quote you responded to.
Hmmm! So you know me, what I believe and why.
Is it breaking rules by quoting Jesus and his God and Father, Heckler?
If so, let me know- and I will leave, knowing this is ANYTHING BUT a Christian Forum.
You mean we will be saved if we choose to ignore the Command of our King?
What church do YOU go to?