The Abomination of Desolation
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Abomination - and unclean thing or idol
Make desolate - Make unclean or desolate
Spoken of a temple. Or holy place. That is made unclean when an idol is placed or sacrificed in the most holy place.
OT example. Antiochus Epiphanes sacrifed a pig in the holy of holys, making it desolate
Jesus said we would see it STANDING IN THE HOLY PLACE - (thus inspite of popular belief, it is not the temple being destroyed, the holy place must be intackt, and the Idol or uncean thing must be present inside the holy place for it to be seen)
Also note. Jesus said we could see it.. “when you see it, RUN....”
It would be impossible for the nation and all those Jesus spoke to to see inside the Holy Place in Jesus day, in first century, or any century pre worldwide TV era. Ie, until the last 100 years. Was impossible to be fulfilled.
Make desolate - Make unclean or desolate
Spoken of a temple. Or holy place. That is made unclean when an idol is placed or sacrificed in the most holy place.
OT example. Antiochus Epiphanes sacrifed a pig in the holy of holys, making it desolate
Jesus said we would see it STANDING IN THE HOLY PLACE - (thus inspite of popular belief, it is not the temple being destroyed, the holy place must be intackt, and the Idol or uncean thing must be present inside the holy place for it to be seen)
Also note. Jesus said we could see it.. “when you see it, RUN....”
It would be impossible for the nation and all those Jesus spoke to to see inside the Holy Place in Jesus day, in first century, or any century pre worldwide TV era. Ie, until the last 100 years. Was impossible to be fulfilled.
Good point bro! Many have not thought of this. (BY MANY IM LOOKING AT YOU PRETERISTS!!)
Think about this too: how can the world see the two witnesses without current technology?
Now in the context of our bodies as being temples, the only way that I can think of that the adversary concerned can sit inside our temples, is by technological means. Here is a question, considering the day and age we live in, the merging of man and machine, is the reference to Rev 13.3 a being that has become a cyborg? Now how the head wound got healed there is not enough information, but the advancements in nanotech and robotics, reading up on the 2045 iniative, one has to ask questions.
Maybe what is being done to us people is that the human race is slowly over the decades becoming bio-tech compatible for the new world order, and that whatever the mark of the beast is, that will complete the process?
Is injecting nanobots into people programmed to target the individuals brain to be reprogrammed to be a compatible bio-tech drone slave unit compatible for this society? What better way to ensure people submit to insane and sickening agenda's than by having their brains reprogrammed so said individual can no longer distinguished between fact or fiction. Ready to receive instructions on how to operate, literally having a voice in your head telling you what to do. The ultimate act of political correctness, peoples literally having words put into their heads, so as to be politically correct.
Question, how bad of a abomination is it that a person who willingly subjects himself/herself to be implanted with a technology that can change him/her into a zombie, and as a result never again able to tell the difference between good and evil ??
When the beasts system is initiated, the whole world who are not written in the book of life are going to worship it (Revelation 13:4).
True worship means adoration. The whole world will have an adoration for the beasts system; so much so that they will ask: What other system can contend with such a perfect system (Revelation 13:4)?
Even the saints will be worn out and overcome by the results and arguments the beasts mouth will make in favor of its system (Daniel 7:27 & Revelation 13:7).
The saints being overcome means the beasts system will be sitting in the hearts of the Lords temple, where it should not (2 Thessalonians 2:4).
Revelation 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
Revelation 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
2 Thessalonians 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
Hey bro. I agree with you that in the ultra-charismatic churches its like you said, mostly preaching on the spiritual gifts and FALSE prophecies and predictions and emotionalism. Its a feminine movement, ran by emotional people. No doubt.
But: Have you considered that the reason we didn't see this in the early church writings is because Israel was not an independent nation back then?
Also did you consider that we dont have all the church writings, catholics did a good job of eradicating different views. AND also the early church guys are not infallible. Some of them were teaching straight up heresy, Paul said after his departure there would be ravenous wolves not sparing the flock.
Many of the reformers brought alot of stuff from the catholic church into their churches.
Now that Israel IS here as an independent nation, its a different story. They didnt have that back then. Also consider that people in the 1800s were saying this, that in order for Jesus to return Israel must exist as a nation, people thought they were crazy but then in 1948 it came to reality!
There would have to be a motive to have billions of people willingly have themselves implanted with technology that changes them into zombies.
I can't think of one.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Not sure how this relates to my comments concerning the abomination of desolation. Can you explain
Sorry, I thought you had responded to my interpretation to the abomination that maketh desolate.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Well if your saying it is anything OTHER than an actual Idol being placed in the most holy place (ie, your taking a symbolic approach) then yes, I was. And I would recommend looking up the purpose of prophesy and why God prophesies, and how a symbolic interpretation would destroy the purpose of prophesy and Gods intended purpose for it.
Do you agree that even if the dispensationalism is true, not caring about it, about temple, about Jerusalem, about politics, about what various "prophets" and pastors teach about it etc. will have no negative effects in the life of a Christian?
Do you actually see billions of people adoring/worshiping some kind of object in a newly built temple in Jerusalem?
What text of Daniel do you use?
I wanted to study the topic, but I got lost in variability.
a) Jewish MT text
b) Theodotion
c) Old Greek
So we have three base lines. The text is very ambiguous in all of them, so we can come up with many possible translations for any of the lines.
I ended up with dozens of possible readings and I gave up.
I wanted to study the topic, but I got lost in variability.
a) Jewish MT text
b) Theodotion
c) Old Greek
So we have three base lines. The text is very ambiguous in all of them, so we can come up with many possible translations for any of the lines.
I ended up with dozens of possible readings and I gave up.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
You do not need millions of people adoring some kind of object. You just need the object. Thats what an abomination of desolation is.
The jews will not adore it anyway, It is a sign for them to run to the place God has prepaired to protect them, (see matt 24 with rev 12: 14) so I am confused why you would even use this line of reasoning?
The abomination that maketh desolate is a sign for the Jews in the land of Israel to run when they see its system set up, which according to scriptures, the whole faithless world will adore (Revelation 13:8). That means billions of people.
Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
The woman in Rev 12 are the faithful in Christ throughout the world who flee when the dragon makes his appearance through the power his vests in the beast (Revelation 13:2).
They are fed with the spirit of God for a time, times, and half a time (Rev 12:14) constituting 1,260 days (Rev 12:6).
Daniel 7:25 describes this event as a time, times, and the dividing of time in which the beasts mouth wears out the saints.
This means the woman in Revelation 12 is another description for the saints in Daniel 7.
Revelation 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
Revelation 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
Revelation 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
I wish to amend this my earlier post to read: The abomination that maketh desolate is a sign for the faithful throughout the world to run when they see the beasts system being set up.
This would then make more sense with the data in Revelation 12:12 where the woman (the saints) throughout the world flee into the wilderness where they are fed the Word, away from the serpents face.
Revelation 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
That doesn't change the fact that the prophecies for Israel must be fulfilled, which are directly related to end of the age. I presented the prophecy regarding Israel being desolate and barren and that God was going to revive her, which He has. All you have to do is look at her history. Whether or not you recognize the importance of what has transpired regarding Israel, she is one of the major red flags identifying that we are in the end times, for that last seven years of the seventy sevens that were decreed upon her must be fulfilled. God said that he would restore her and make her into a great nation and that He would cause the land of Israel to be like Eden. As of 1948 Israel has become a great nation and God has restored her and the land is a flourishing Eden. These you cannot deny, for all one has to do is look back a few hundred years to see the change.
By the way, I never apply my own meaning to prophecy. Discrediting others is just the on-going knee-jerk reaction to things they don't understand.
You need to open your eyes, because the signs that we are that last generation and that we are in the end-times is all to obvious.
We should all be looking for the blessed hope and speed its coming.
"You ought to live holy and godly lives
"You ought to live holy and godly lives as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming."