Not By Works

[calibob]

Whats all this "isms" dogma? Lol

I was taught that ISM stands for I, Self and Me.

 

[Jewel5712]

I was taught that ISM stands for I, Self and Me.

Or..me..self .n i if youre dyslexic..lol

 

[VCO]

benhur said:
There does not have to be agreement on any particular doctrine, but we can be in harmony concerning Jesus Christ. We believe in him and we are brothers in the gospel of Jesus Christ. I will never, as you have said, agree 100% of what you believe, but we can shake hands about Jesus, and commune at the same sacrament table.

I would really like you to ANSWER those questions that I ask on page 3609.

This will make it easier for you:

Let's Find Out if you Believe in the SAME Jesus Christ as most of those on this site actually DO BELIEVE IN?

What ALL do you believe about Jesus Christ for SURE?

Is HE the Second Personage of the SINGULAR DEITY we call the Holy Trinity?

IS HE EQUAL TO GOD?

Is HE a Fully Man and Fully GOD at the same time?

Is HIS SALVATION COMPLETE at the time HE GIVES IT AS A FREE GIFT, FOREVER?

Did HE FULLFILL the LAW for US?

Did HE Willing Lay Down HIS LIFE, or did the ROMAN'S Kill Him?

Did HE PAY FOR ALL SINS, (PAID IN FULL), except the One Sin of Blaspheming the Holy Spirit?

Do you Believe in the BODILY RESURRECTION OF JESUS CHRIST?

Do you Believe HE Ascended into Heaven and SITS AT THE Right of HIS FATHER IN HIS RESURRECTED, GLORIFIED, PHYSICAL BODY?

Do you Believe HE IS Coming AGAIN, to RULE ON THIS EARTH FROM THE THRONE OF DAVID FOR A 1000 YEARS?


Now If you do not answer all of those questions Honestly and TRUTHFULLY, with the answers that are very similar to us; you give us a reason to believe You do not worship the SAME Jesus Christ that WE ALL DO? All mainline Churches could answer them with the answers being almost identical. SO TELL US THE TRUTH ABOUT THE JESUS THAT YOU WORSHIP.

Matthew 24:23-27 (NASB)
23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Behold, here is the Christ,' or 'There He is,' do not believe him.
24 "For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect.
25 "Behold, I have told you in advance.
26 "So if they say to you, 'Behold, He is in the wilderness,' do not go out, or, 'Behold, He is in the inner rooms,' do not believe them.
27 "For just as the lightning comes from the east and flashes even to the west, so will the coming of the Son of Man be.

 

[calibob]

Or..me..self .n i if youre dyslexic..lol

When I talk smack about Isims, I am also saying something about myself, even Alcoholism. Alcoholics become slaves to a false god. It is always difficult to break free from ISIMs'. Jesus gave us the way. No man can sanely say he didn't. But they'll say he didn't. It's just a thorn in the flesh and his grace is sufficient for me. That's all there is to say about it.

Religions' also make slaves of their followers. Like @dcontroversal said. They try to make monkeys of us, slaves to their dogma and unfortunately it works for more than a few. There is another way, the true Gospel of Jesus of Nazareth. Joshua Ben Joseph. In English; Son of God from the House of Joseph. No other way. No other way. King of kings and Lord of lords' Glory Halaleula!

 

[TruthTalk]

I was taught that ISM stands for I, Self and Me.

Hi Calibob, I heard the same thing you are talking about only it was, Me, Myself, and I.... The meaning of this idiom I was told meant, singularity or aloneness, as in, i did this by myself...

 

[mailmandan]

Complete nonsense, your fake gospel is not even believable. You are a deceiver and I do not believe one word that you are saying.

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not my works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It’s just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT.

It’s a shame that human pride will not allow works-salvationists to come to Christ. Their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

 

[Jewel5712]

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not my works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It’s just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT.

It’s a shame that human pride will not allow works-salvationists to come to Christ. Their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

Morning dan! Nicely said btw

 

[TruthTalk]

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not my works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It’s just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT.

It’s a shame that human pride will not allow works-salvationists to come to Christ. Their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

Thank you Dan, we are saved "unto good works", not by them. Benhur will tell you upfront that his righteous works will not save him, but he is twisting the truth because he will turn around an say "lack of fruit or works", and you will not receive eternal life. The bible does not support his belief.

Benhur consistently refuses to accept the true gospel, and he consistently misinterprets scripture to support his false belief. Everyone has shown him the correct interpretations but he turns a blind eye because again his false belief will not allow his mind to accept anything contrary. A pity because he will die in his sin, lest he should stop believing a lie and come to Christ. As you say, it is "PRIDE" the original sin in the garden.

God bless!

 

[TruthTalk]

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not my works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It’s just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT.

It’s a shame that human pride will not allow works-salvationists to come to Christ. Their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

Hi again mailmandan, here is a quote that went around at our Church a long time ago. Jim Elliot was a Baptist Missionary to Ecuador. Benhur would gain Eternal Security if he would only give up his counterfeit gospel.

"He is no fool who gives up what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose."

Quote:
"Jim Elliot. Philip James Elliot (October 8, 1927 – January 8, 1956) was an evangelical Christian who was one of five missionaries killed while participating in Operation Auca, an attempt to evangelize the Huaorani people of Ecuador. Read more at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Elliot

 

[benhur]

Benhur, good works will not save you nor will they keep you saved. You are professing a completely false gospel, you need to repent and turn back to God; "The righteous shall live by faith."

benhur, your gospel is something you have concocted in your own mind. Rarely will you bring up the Cross and how Jesus suffered and died for the forgiveness of our sins. It is shameful that you have been feeding all of us a load of false information for almost a year now, you are a deceiver and a liar.

Romans1:17

For in the gospel the righteousness of God is revealed--a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, just as it is written: "The righteous will live by faith."

​

I am not a liar. I am aware that God hates a liar, therefore I do not knowingly lie. Prove to me that I am a liar, and if you can, then I will repent and recieve forgiveness from Jesus. So show me where I lied, so I can go through that process.

If you cannot show me where I lied, then maybe you should go through the repentence process yourself. Look forward to your research.

If you don't want to do the research, then give me an apology for such harsh words, so I can forgive you.

 

[benhur]

Thank you Dan, we are saved "unto good works", not by them. Benhur will tell you upfront that his righteous works will not save him, but he is twisting the truth because he will turn around an say "lack of fruit or works", and you will not receive eternal life. The bible does not support his belief.

Benhur consistently refuses to accept the true gospel, and he consistently misinterprets scripture to support his false belief. Everyone has shown him the correct interpretations but he turns a blind eye because again his false belief will not allow his mind to accept anything contrary. A pity because he will die in his sin, lest he should stop believing a lie and come to Christ. As you say, it is "PRIDE" the original sin in the garden.

God bless!

Do you believe that I have no faith in Christ?

Do you believe that I believe that the only way to heaven is my good works?

You confuse good works and the fruit that good works produces. Good works is not fruit. The fruit is a byproduct of good works. For instance, if you preach Christ and convert someone to Christianity, that person is the fruit of your good works. If you give a helping hand to your neighbor and help him out of a tight jam in his life and he asks why you helped him and that discussion leads to his conversion to Jesus Christ, then this man is the fruit of your good works. I could give you thousands of examples.

John 15:2 says that all branches IN ME that produce no fruit, will be taken away. I interpret this scripture to say: Jesus is talking about saved people, because they are branches IN HIS VINE. All people are not in the vine of Jesus. Only beleivers are IN HIS VINE. Therefore all the believers (saved persons) IN HIS VINE who do not produce fruit through their good works, will be cast of and taken away. IOW, no OSAS.

Now if you think this is a lie, it is not to me, therefore I am not knowingly lying. It is my interpretation of the scripture that I think is true. If you have another interpretation, fine, that is what you think is true also. I would not call you a liar just because you interpret scripture differently from me. So watch you use of the word liar.

 

[benhur]

________________ church. Hmmm?

I guess your church is so invisible that you can't even find it either . . . though I would be inclined to insert a <cult> church.

If that would make you feel good, then do it.

 

[VCO]

Thank you Dan, we are saved "unto good works", not by them. Benhur will tell you upfront that his righteous works will not save him, but he is twisting the truth because he will turn around an say "lack of fruit or works", and you will not receive eternal life. The bible does not support his belief.

Benhur consistently refuses to accept the true gospel, and he consistently misinterprets scripture to support his false belief. Everyone has shown him the correct interpretations but he turns a blind eye because again his false belief will not allow his mind to accept anything contrary. A pity because he will die in his sin, lest he should stop believing a lie and come to Christ. As you say, it is "PRIDE" the original sin in the garden.

God bless!

Benhur, PLEASE READ THIS TOO, as I would like to resolve the issue of "do you or don't you" believe in the Same Jesus Christ as we do.

There is something that does ring True with him or is he that confused. That is why I asked that long Series of Questions about CHRIST, to get his take on How He Would Answer Them, so we know where he is coming from. Most of us here would answer those questions almost identical, in fact, those questions are commonly answered very similarly among all mainline congregations. So it seems clear that his Church is not mainline, but how far over towards the line does he go, between border line Christian Denomination or full blown Psuedo-Christian Cult. I have NO idea, because he evades questions about his SPECIFIC BELIEFS. I hope he will be honest enough to TELL US about the CHRIST they have interpreted the term to mean. I some how feel, that he will just keep dodging those questions.

His religion seems to be involved in this:

 

[VCO]

________________ church. Hmmm?

I guess your church is so invisible that you can't even find it either . . . though I would be inclined to insert a <cult> church.

We have had a GREAT Number of Peolple ask Benhur that same question, and he refuses to answer that question. I have been trying to get that answer from him for months. You may be right in your inclination.

 

[BillG]

The mind is a tricky thing. When the subconscious cannot accept the truth it lies to the conscious mind (confabulates) to believe a false narrative that the conscious mind can accept like the Son of god died for me but I don't deserve it. so to make me feel better I'll make something up so I can feel better about my self like I can deserve it. Yes, that's the ticket and the just ooses out.

Others like my me who felt they did not deserve it worked in order to be accepted and loved by God, never made feel better.

In fact the opposite result.
Because we are going to slip up and when we do more guilt and condemnation comes upon us, then we must do better.

Miserable life indeed.
Forgiveness and acceptance has no place in the mind of such.
Just a vain hope we get into heaven.

If your mind is fed and you feed on it then your life is .

 

[BillG]

I am not a liar. I am aware that God hates a liar, therefore I do not knowingly lie. Prove to me that I am a liar, and if you can, then I will repent and recieve forgiveness from Jesus. So show me where I lied, so I can go through that process.

If you cannot show me where I lied, then maybe you should go through the repentence process yourself. Look forward to your research.

If you don't want to do the research, then give me an apology for such harsh words, so I can forgive you.

So you are not willing to forgive unless you have an apology?

Not very Jesus like is it?

Did Jesus wait for an apology before he forgave?

As you have said many times Jesus will not forgive us unless we forgive others.
Which you and I have often discussed your thoughts and mine.

So now you have fallen foul of your thoughts.

Father forgive them for they no not what they do.

He did not ask for an apology first.

 

[dcontroversal]

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not my works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It’s just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT.

It’s a shame that human pride will not allow works-salvationists to come to Christ. Their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

Amen bro.....Let go and Let God.......Just think Adam was made, walked and talked with God, had one rule, broke it and then ATTEMPTED BY HIS OWN EFFORT TO COVER HIS SHAME, HIS SIN AND RESTORE HIS POSITION WITH GOD....Cain followed the same path and offered the works of his hands and then got angry when he was rejected to the point that he rose up and killed his RIGHTEOUS BROTHER WHO HAD FAITH...

Workers for, Cainologists and Pharisees at the end of the day do not trust Christ or have genuine faith that Christ will save them regardless of what they say....the fact they add self effort proves this point and places them in the "MANY" GROUPING THAT JESUS SPEAKS OF.....

Lord, Lord have we not done<---exactly what the workers for, Cainologists and Pharisees peddle....!!

 

[calibob]

So you are not willing to forgive unless you have an apology?

Not very Jesus like is it?

Did Jesus wait for an apology before he forgave?

As you have said many times Jesus will not forgive us unless we forgive others.
Which you and I have often discussed your thoughts and mine.

So now you have fallen foul of your thoughts.

Father forgive them for they no not what they do.

He did not ask for an apology first.

I am not a liar. I am aware that God hates a liar, therefore I do not knowingly lie. Prove to me that I am a liar, and if you can, then I will repent and recieve forgiveness from Jesus. So show me where I lied, so I can go through that process.

If you cannot show me where I lied, then maybe you should go through the repentence process yourself. Look forward to your research.

If you don't want to do the research, then give me an apology for such harsh words, so I can forgive you.

… "and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us.."

 

[NoNameMcgee]

So you are not willing to forgive unless you have an apology?

Not very Jesus like is it?

Did Jesus wait for an apology before he forgave?

As you have said many times Jesus will not forgive us unless we forgive others.
Which you and I have often discussed your thoughts and mine.

So now you have fallen foul of your thoughts.

Father forgive them for they no not what they do.

He did not ask for an apology first.

amen

 

[dcontroversal]

So you are not willing to forgive unless you have an apology?

Not very Jesus like is it?

Did Jesus wait for an apology before he forgave?

As you have said many times Jesus will not forgive us unless we forgive others.
Which you and I have often discussed your thoughts and mine.

So now you have fallen foul of your thoughts.

Father forgive them for they no not what they do.

He did not ask for an apology first.

I have a friend that is like this.....and boy dies he hold a grudge......the grace of God is preemptive.....

Where sin abounds, grace abounds the more....