Not By Works

[Jewel5712]

Yet does grace/mercy mean no obedience? Or that we have been forgiven and it makes me personally gratefull..

John 5:14, “Afterward יהושע found him in the Set-apart Place, and said to him, “See, you have been made well. Sin no more, so that no worse matter befalls you.”

John 8:11, “And she said, “No one, Master.” And יהושע said to her, “Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more.”

1 John 4:19, “We love Him because He first loved us.”

John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”

I am not perfect but when I think of His mercy it makes me want to live for Him...

Psalm 130:5, “I looked to יהוה, My being has looked, And for His word I have waited. My being looks to יהוה More than those watching for morning, watching for morning. O Yisra’yl, wait for יהוה; For with יהוה there is loving-commitment. And with Him is much redemption.”

Psalm 68:19, "Blessed be יהוה, Day by day He bears our burden, The Strength of our salvation! Selah."

BECAUSE we love him we STRIVE to be obedient but fail all the time..that's where grace n mercy n forgiveness come in..God doesn't NEED our love..He wants us to FREELY give it..God doesn't NEED us to keep the laws and commands because He knows there's NO WAY we can do that APART from Him..He WANTS us to FREELY be obedient...

See..OT was keeping God's commands out of obligation..the NT is keeping them out of Love..there's a difference

 

[Shamah]

Mixing law and grace by teaching salvation by “grace plus law, faith plus works” is neither keeping (guarding, observing, watching over) the commands of God or the faith of Jesus (which is descriptive of believers). I’m not surprised that you underlined “their works follow them,” which BTW does not imply salvation by works.

you say it implies.

but you wont answer those 2 questions? just tell me im wrong...

1. what does satan fight against?

and

2. what the saints do?

Revelation 12:17, “And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to fight with the remnant of her seed, those guarding the commands of יהוה and possessing the witness of יהושע Messiah."

1. what does satan fight against? answer: " those guarding the commands of יהוה and possessing the witness of יהושע Messiah"

Isayah 8:20, "To the Law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them."

Revelation 14:12-13, “Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the Commands of יהוה and the Belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice out of the heaven saying to me, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Master from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, in order that they rest from their labors, and their works follow with them.”

2. what the saints do? answer: "Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the Commands of יהוה and the Belief of יהושע"

 

[Jewel5712]

These are wonderful!!!

I think He does indeed put them on our heart, however this does not mean we dont study His word, it is reason to more, if it;s in the heart one would love to read and meditate on it!

John 4:24, "Yah is Spirit, and those who worship Him need to worship in spirit and truth.”

Isaiah 59:21, “As for Me, this is My covenant with them,” said יהוה: “My Spirit that is upon you, and My Words that I have put in your mouth, shall not be withdrawn from your mouth, nor from the mouth of your descendants, nor from the mouth of your descendants’ descendants,” said יהוה, “from this time and forever.”

Mat 4:4, “But He answering, said, “It has been written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of יהוה.” (Deut 8:3)

'bread" literally for life and sustanance and "Bread" (God) also being spiritual life and sustanance (Adam didn't have life until God spoke and breathed life into Him)

 

[Jewel5712]

Ok guys...carry on..time for this girl to go to bed .play NICE

 

[Shamah]

BECAUSE we love him we STRIVE to be obedient but fail all the time..

I would not say we fail all the time. I think if we are truly following Him while we might slip and land flat on our face a LOT, I think more and more as we follow Him we will do His will...

John 8:12, “Therefore יהושע spoke to them again, saying, “I am the light of the world. He who follows Me shall by no means walk in darkness, but possess the light of life.”

John 14:23-24, “יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”

Psalm 119:11, “I have treasured up Your word in my heart, That I might not sin against You.”

1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us."

1 John 2:1-2, "My little children, I write these things to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father: Yahshua Messiah, the Righteous; and He is the sacrifice of atonement for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."

that's where grace n mercy n forgiveness come in..God doesn't NEED our love..He wants us to FREELY give it..God doesn't NEED us to keep the laws and commands because He knows there's NO WAY we can do that APART from Him..He WANTS us to FREELY be obedient...

I agree with this probably 100%

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

See..OT was keeping God's commands out of obligation..the NT is keeping them out of Love..there's a difference

I think it was love in the "OT" times also:

Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”

John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”

 

[SufferingSoul]

It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!

English Standard Version
he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

Berean Study Bible
He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of new birth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

Berean Literal Bible
He saved us, not by works in righteousness that we did, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,

New American Standard Bible
He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

King James Bible
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Is it possible, then, that since He does the choosing, there are those who He does not choose -- those to whom He does not extend his mercy?

 

[SufferingSoul]

Ok guys...carry on..time for this girl to go to bed .play NICE

Sleep well -- in Jesus

 

[SufferingSoul]

What a load of garbage... You clearly need to go seek the truth..

So, in essence, He has already chosen those He will save, and the rest be damned.

 

[Shamah]

Is it possible, then, that since He does the choosing, there are those who He does not choose -- those to whom He does not extend his mercy?

So, in essence, He has already chosen those He will save, and the rest be damned.

Acts 17:30-31, “In the past YHWH winked at such ignorance, but now He commands all men everywhere to repent! For He has appointed a day in which He will judge the world in righteousness, by a Man whom He has ordained; and He has given evidence to everyone by raising Him from the dead.”

Acts 10:34-35, “And opening his mouth, Kĕpha said, “Truly I see that Yah shows no partiality, but in every nation, he who fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him.”

John 8:34-36, “יהושע answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone doing sin is a servant of sin. And the servant does not stay in the house forever – a son stays forever. If, then, the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.”

Psalm 119:133, “Establish my footsteps by Your word, And let no wickedness have rule over me.”

Psalm 19:9, “The fear of יהוה is clean, standing forever; The right-rulings of יהוה are true, They are righteous altogether.”

 

[Shamah]

Jeremiah 9:23-26, “Thus said יהוה, “Let not the wise boast in his wisdom, let not the mighty boast in his might, nor let the rich boast in his riches, but let him who boasts boast of this, that he understands and knows Me, that I am יהוה, doing loving-commitment, judgment, and righteousness in the earth. For in these I delight,” declares יהוה, “See, the days are coming,” declares יהוה, “when I shall punish all circumcised with the uncircumcised; Mitsrayim, and Yehuḏah, and Eḏom, and the children of Ammon, and Mo’aḇ, and all those trimmed on the edges, who dwell in the wilderness. For all the nations are uncircumcised, and all the house of Yisra’ĕl are uncircumcised in heart!”

Psalms 25:14-18, “The secret of יהוה is with those who fear Him, And He makes His covenant known to them. My eyes are ever toward יהוה, For He brings my feet out of the net. Turn Your face to me, and show me favor, For I am lonely and afflicted. The distresses of my heart have enlarged; Oh, bring me out of my distresses! Look on my affliction and my toil, And forgive all my sins.”

 

[Seohce]

New International Version 1984 Mark 7:6-13 He replied, “Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: “‘These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.’ You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men.” And he said to them: “You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions! For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.’ But you say that if a man says to his father or mother: ‘Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is Corban’ (that is, a gift devoted to God), then you no longer let him do anything for his father or mother. Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.”

 

[Seohce]

New International Version 1984 Isaiah 5:20-24 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter. Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes and clever in their own sight. Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine and champions at mixing drinks, who acquit the guilty for a bribe, but deny justice to the innocent. Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the Lord Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel.

 

[Seohce]

WHAT A SHAME. NOTICE AND WATCH THESE OSAS PASTORS AND CHURCH LEADERS WHO CLAIM AND DECLARE THAT “FAITH ALONE” SAVES AND IT IS “NOT BY WÒRKS” OF RIGHTEOUSNESS AND OBEDIENCE, WHILE ON THE OTHER HAND COLLECTS TITHES FROM THEIR MEMBERS SAYING THAT IF THEY WOULD NOT GIVE TITHES, THEY ARE ROBBING GOD.

19 Their destiny is destruction, their god is their stomach, and their glory is in their shame.

..THAT TITHE-GIVING IS A TEST OF FAITH AND THAT GOD WILL BLESS THEM ABUNDANTLY BECAUSE WHAT THEY GIVE WILL COME BACK TO THEM IN GOOD MEASURE AND RUNNING OVER.(luke 6:38)

THAT’S HOW THESE VIPERS IN THEIR GREED AND HYPOCRISY DECEIVE THEIR PREYS(UNKNOWING VICTIMS)

THEY THINK THEY CAN BRIBE GOD.

33 Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God!
How unsearchable his judgments,
and his paths beyond tracing out!
34 “Who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has been his counselor?”
35 “Who has ever given to God,
that God should repay them?”
36 For from him and through him and for him are all things.
To him be the glory forever! Amen.

THESE VIPERS WILL STILL BE SAVED ACCORDING TO THE OSAS DOCTRINE…

...WHICH IS CONTRARY TO WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES.

11 But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or GREEDY, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people.

9 Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men 10 nor thieves nor the GREEDY nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

5 For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or GREEDY person—such a person is an idolater—has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. 6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient. 7 Therefore do not be partners with them.

MAN GOT SEPARATED FROM GOD BECAUSE OF THE SIN OF DISOBEDIENCE WHEN MAN WAS DECEIVED BY THE SERPENT WHO SAID THAT “...Ye shall not surely die.”(genesis 3:4)

DÈCEIVERS OF THIS AGE SAYS THE SAME THING;

“YE SHALL NOT SURELY DIE (PERIßH / BE CONDEMNED). ONCE YOU'RE SAVED, YOU ARE ALWAYS ßAVED. JUST HAVE FAITH VOID OF WORKS (OF RIGHTEOUSNESS / ÒBEDIENCE) AND YOU WILL POSSESS ETERNAL LIFE THE MOMENT YOU BELIEVE

DO NOT BE DECEIVED!!!

OSAS AND FAS ARE FALSE MAN MADE DOCTRINES!!!

3 What if some were unfaithful? Will their unfaithfulness nullify God’s faithfulness?4 Not at all! Let God be true, and every human being a liar. As it is written:

“So that you may be proved right when you speak
and prevail when you judge.”

 

[Rosemaryx]

1st John Chapter 1.....and Hebrews 1.....Jesus is the express image of the Father and our fellowship is with the SON.......Immanuel <--God with us......when we fellowship with JESUS we are fellowshipping with the FATHER is my point...

Hi Dcon...And yes when we fellowship with Jesus , the Holy Spirit of God is leading us , it is all by God's grace , praise the LORD and thank You Jesus...xox...

 

[mailmandan]

you say it implies.

but you wont answer those 2 questions? just tell me im wrong...

1. what does satan fight against?

and

2. what the saints do?

Revelation 12:17, “And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to fight with the remnant of her seed, those guarding the commands of יהוה and possessing the witness of יהושע Messiah."

1. what does satan fight against? answer: " those guarding the commands of יהוה and possessing the witness of יהושע Messiah"

Isayah 8:20, "To the Law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them."

Revelation 14:12-13, “Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the Commands of יהוה and the Belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice out of the heaven saying to me, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Master from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, in order that they rest from their labors, and their works follow with them.”

2. what the saints do? answer: "Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the Commands of יהוה and the Belief of יהושע"

Why would I need to answer those 2 questions when the answers to those 2 questions in Revelation 12:17 are obvious? Revelation 12:17 - So the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went off to make war with the rest of her children, -- answer to question #1 - the saints; who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus -- answer to question #2.

To "keep (guard, observe, watch over) the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus" (which is descriptive of believers/saints) is not talking about justification by the law/salvation by works. So once again, mixing law and grace by teaching salvation by “grace plus law, faith plus works” is neither keeping (guarding, observing, watching over) the commandments of God or holding to the testimony of Jesus.

 

[rstrats]

Jewel5712,
re: "He WANTS us to FREELY be obedient..."

The trick of course is figuring out what is to be obeyed.

 

[Jewel5712]

WHAT A SHAME. NOTICE AND WATCH THESE OSAS PASTORS AND CHURCH LEADERS WHO CLAIM AND DECLARE THAT “FAITH ALONE” SAVES AND IT IS “NOT BY WÒRKS” OF RIGHTEOUSNESS AND OBEDIENCE, WHILE ON THE OTHER HAND COLLECTS TITHES FROM THEIR MEMBERS SAYING THAT IF THEY WOULD NOT GIVE TITHES, THEY ARE ROBBING GOD.

19 Their destiny is destruction, their god is their stomach, and their glory is in their shame.

..THAT TITHE-GIVING IS A TEST OF FAITH AND THAT GOD WILL BLESS THEM ABUNDANTLY BECAUSE WHAT THEY GIVE WILL COME BACK TO THEM IN GOOD MEASURE AND RUNNING OVER.(luke 6:38)

THAT’S HOW THESE VIPERS IN THEIR GREED AND HYPOCRISY DECEIVE THEIR PREYS(UNKNOWING VICTIMS)

THEY THINK THEY CAN BRIBE GOD.

33 Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God!
How unsearchable his judgments,
and his paths beyond tracing out!
34 “Who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has been his counselor?”
35 “Who has ever given to God,
that God should repay them?”
36 For from him and through him and for him are all things.
To him be the glory forever! Amen.

THESE VIPERS WILL STILL BE SAVED ACCORDING TO THE OSAS DOCTRINE…

...WHICH IS CONTRARY TO WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES.

11 But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or GREEDY, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people.

9 Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men 10 nor thieves nor the GREEDY nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

5 For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or GREEDY person—such a person is an idolater—has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. 6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient. 7 Therefore do not be partners with them.

MAN GOT SEPARATED FROM GOD BECAUSE OF THE SIN OF DISOBEDIENCE WHEN MAN WAS DECEIVED BY THE SERPENT WHO SAID THAT “...Ye shall not surely die.”(genesis 3:4)

DÈCEIVERS OF THIS AGE SAYS THE SAME THING;

“YE SHALL NOT SURELY DIE (PERIßH / BE CONDEMNED). ONCE YOU'RE SAVED, YOU ARE ALWAYS ßAVED. JUST HAVE FAITH VOID OF WORKS (OF RIGHTEOUSNESS / ÒBEDIENCE) AND YOU WILL POSSESS ETERNAL LIFE THE MOMENT YOU BELIEVE

DO NOT BE DECEIVED!!!

OSAS AND FAS ARE FALSE MAN MADE DOCTRINES!!!

3 What if some were unfaithful? Will their unfaithfulness nullify God’s faithfulness?4 Not at all! Let God be true, and every human being a liar. As it is written:

“So that you may be proved right when you speak
and prevail when you judge.”

Faith/belief equals salvation equals works...not the other way around

Ephesians 2:8-9 New International Version (NIV)
8 For it is by grace you have been saved,through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.

 

[Jewel5712]

Is it possible, then, that since He does the choosing, there are those who He does not choose -- those to whom He does not extend his mercy?

Are you talking about pre destination? MAN has a choice to accept/reject God...after Jesus death..salvation was open to BOTH Jew n Gentile..God already KNOWS who will choose Him

Peter 3:9 New International Version (NIV)
9 The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise,as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance (salvation)

 

[Jewel5712]

So, in essence, He has already chosen those He will save, and the rest be damned.

No..see

2 Peter 3:9

 

[Seohce]

1 chronicles 28
9 “And you, my son Solomon, acknowledge the God of your father, and serve him with wholehearted devotion and with a willing mind, for the Lord searches every heart and understands every desire and every thought. If you seek him, he will be found by you; but IF YOU FORSAKE HIM, HE WILL REJECT YOU FOREVER.

17 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” 20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. DO NOT BE ARROGANT, BUT TREMBLE. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, HE WILL NOT SPARE YOU EITHER.

22 Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, PROVIDED THAT YOU CONTINUE in his kindness. Otherwise, YOU ALSO WILL BE CUT OFF.