As An "Older" Single, What Advice Would You Give to Younger Singles?
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Well this is an interesting little story. I’m aware this is a generalization. There are ALWAYS exceptions.
I married at 33. My husband was 37. Because the Lord is faithful, we met at exactly the right time. Meeting beforehand would have been disastrous in my opinion due to both of us having unresolved issues.
It had nothing to do with attraction or fertility.
I married at 33. My husband was 37. Because the Lord is faithful, we met at exactly the right time. Meeting beforehand would have been disastrous in my opinion due to both of us having unresolved issues.
It had nothing to do with attraction or fertility.
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OK so if you are serious - sorry if the trolling comment came across to harshly. I really wasn't sure but my apologies.
I am just a bit surprised that this is the message we would send to a. women under 27 and b. women over 27.
Unless otherwise intended - is this not just saying exactly that women should marry when they still 'look good' according to their male counterparts?
While I understand people want children I think 27 is hardly a cut off point. Women have children well over the age of 27 nowadays. In addition, there are multiple ways to have children as well (eg adoption).
Next to that, being under the age of 27 and looking good really do not have any indication on whether a woman is fertile. While I agree youth (and again, see comment above. Women can have healthy children at the age of 45 or even older nowadays) does play a factor in fertility, this is kinda equivalent to a simple thinking of: young women is fertile therefore we have sex and poof baby appears. There are tons of women struggling with fertility at a young age (for example, people with PCOS) that really are not apparent at all.
Other than the fertility argument I find it a bit archaic and shallow thinking: if a woman under the age of 27 sees this comment she may think her looks are the most important and therefore she needs to marry asap and women over the age of 27.. well no hope for them right? Society has decided they are not young, pretty and fertile enough?
I am just a bit surprised that this is the message we would send to a. women under 27 and b. women over 27.
Unless otherwise intended - is this not just saying exactly that women should marry when they still 'look good' according to their male counterparts?
While I understand people want children I think 27 is hardly a cut off point. Women have children well over the age of 27 nowadays. In addition, there are multiple ways to have children as well (eg adoption).
Next to that, being under the age of 27 and looking good really do not have any indication on whether a woman is fertile. While I agree youth (and again, see comment above. Women can have healthy children at the age of 45 or even older nowadays) does play a factor in fertility, this is kinda equivalent to a simple thinking of: young women is fertile therefore we have sex and poof baby appears. There are tons of women struggling with fertility at a young age (for example, people with PCOS) that really are not apparent at all.
Other than the fertility argument I find it a bit archaic and shallow thinking: if a woman under the age of 27 sees this comment she may think her looks are the most important and therefore she needs to marry asap and women over the age of 27.. well no hope for them right? Society has decided they are not young, pretty and fertile enough?
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Adstar,
I know you've been advocating here for years that all women should marry by age 27 because their value drops off a cliff, but I've never seen you address:
1. The fact that men can be the cause of infertility, too. Should women then demand that men produce proof of fertility as well, and judge the value of a man solely by his viable sperm count? Because after all, you're saying that a woman is only as good as her number of eggs. And now I'm wondering if you nicknamed any past girlfriends, "The Hen House", or "The Egg Carton."
2. Is this what the women in your family were told as well? Do you have a daughter, sister... or even a mother? Was she told that her most valuable years were only before she was 27 and that as soon as she passed that age, she would become direly unattractive to men, including the man (I'm assuming) she was married to?
I'm nearly 20 years over your mandated "get married by this age or give up all hope" age 27 (and then what? Walk the plank and throw ourselves off the ship?)
I'm wondering if I should call and volunteer myself to be hauled off to the glue factory (because after all, I shall now be seen as useless to all men and have no reason to live) or wait for them to track me down themselves.
I know you've been advocating here for years that all women should marry by age 27 because their value drops off a cliff, but I've never seen you address:
1. The fact that men can be the cause of infertility, too. Should women then demand that men produce proof of fertility as well, and judge the value of a man solely by his viable sperm count? Because after all, you're saying that a woman is only as good as her number of eggs. And now I'm wondering if you nicknamed any past girlfriends, "The Hen House", or "The Egg Carton."
2. Is this what the women in your family were told as well? Do you have a daughter, sister... or even a mother? Was she told that her most valuable years were only before she was 27 and that as soon as she passed that age, she would become direly unattractive to men, including the man (I'm assuming) she was married to?
I'm nearly 20 years over your mandated "get married by this age or give up all hope" age 27 (and then what? Walk the plank and throw ourselves off the ship?)
I'm wondering if I should call and volunteer myself to be hauled off to the glue factory (because after all, I shall now be seen as useless to all men and have no reason to live) or wait for them to track me down themselves.
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This reminds me of when I was on Christian Mingle (I was 35 back then--well past your age of having any value, but anyway...) and it was often the case that the men in their 50's were looking for 25-year-olds.
So in one aspect, I can agree that many men are looking for women under the age of 27.
However, when they're 50, 60, and 70 years old, I doubt that these young ladies' fertility is at the forefront of their minds.
So in one aspect, I can agree that many men are looking for women under the age of 27.
However, when they're 50, 60, and 70 years old, I doubt that these young ladies' fertility is at the forefront of their minds.
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The advice i gave was from me and me only.. I do not claim to speak for anyone else but me on this issue.. And yes my advice was directed to woman under 27..
The important word i used was Fertile... not good looking... And i also stressed ""if woman want to attract the best man they can possibility attract"" I never said that a woman past 27 cannot successfully have children or that a woman over 27 cannot attract a husband.. Clearly a number can and do.. My point was to give advice to younger woman that would obtimize their chances of attracting the best man they can as their future husband..
Yes adoption is an option, and a noble one too.. But the average man and the average woman who want to start a family want to have their own children.. I have been talking mostly about average men and woman.. the majority.. Most men and woman are in this group.. As i said in my post there are always the exceptional woman to whom this advice would not apply..
It is a good indication on average ... Most woman who look fertile are fertile and most men will be attracted to fertile woman as candidates to be the mother of their children..
Yes some woman can succeed in having healthy children at the age of 45 they are in the exceptional group.. But we are talking about averages here.. As woman grow older their fertility on average becomes a problem for most of them.. And men know this..
Yes,, but the percentage of woman having problems with fertility is much lower among 25 year old woman then it is with 45 year old woman.. And again men know this..
See you are making the mistake of turning my general advice for young woman who want to become mothers into some absolutist stance.. I am not saying that woman over 27 have no hope.. If you read my posts you will see my message is about what's the better life strategy for young woman to get the best man they can get... It is not saying if you don't do it this way then you're done and dusted and have no chances at all...
And another point.. It is not ""society"" that sets the standards for woman...
When it comes to standards for men and standards for woman there are two different standards..
Standards that are set for men determined by woman..
Standards that are set for woman determined by men..
Men, if they want to be acceptable as marriage material for woman must pass the standards that woman determine is required.. If they fail then they will be rejected by woman and never succeed in becoming dads..
Woman, if they want to be acceptable as marriage material for men must pass the standards that men determine is required.. If they fail then they will be rejected by woman and never succeed in becoming dads..
Woman cannot control what standards men have for them and Men cannot control what standards woman have for them.. That's a simple fact of life..
The important word i used was Fertile... not good looking... And i also stressed ""if woman want to attract the best man they can possibility attract"" I never said that a woman past 27 cannot successfully have children or that a woman over 27 cannot attract a husband.. Clearly a number can and do.. My point was to give advice to younger woman that would obtimize their chances of attracting the best man they can as their future husband..
Yes adoption is an option, and a noble one too.. But the average man and the average woman who want to start a family want to have their own children.. I have been talking mostly about average men and woman.. the majority.. Most men and woman are in this group.. As i said in my post there are always the exceptional woman to whom this advice would not apply..
It is a good indication on average ... Most woman who look fertile are fertile and most men will be attracted to fertile woman as candidates to be the mother of their children..
Yes some woman can succeed in having healthy children at the age of 45 they are in the exceptional group.. But we are talking about averages here.. As woman grow older their fertility on average becomes a problem for most of them.. And men know this..
Yes,, but the percentage of woman having problems with fertility is much lower among 25 year old woman then it is with 45 year old woman.. And again men know this..
See you are making the mistake of turning my general advice for young woman who want to become mothers into some absolutist stance.. I am not saying that woman over 27 have no hope.. If you read my posts you will see my message is about what's the better life strategy for young woman to get the best man they can get... It is not saying if you don't do it this way then you're done and dusted and have no chances at all...
And another point.. It is not ""society"" that sets the standards for woman...
When it comes to standards for men and standards for woman there are two different standards..
Standards that are set for men determined by woman..
Standards that are set for woman determined by men..
Men, if they want to be acceptable as marriage material for woman must pass the standards that woman determine is required.. If they fail then they will be rejected by woman and never succeed in becoming dads..
Woman, if they want to be acceptable as marriage material for men must pass the standards that men determine is required.. If they fail then they will be rejected by woman and never succeed in becoming dads..
Woman cannot control what standards men have for them and Men cannot control what standards woman have for them.. That's a simple fact of life..
I got remarried at the age of 59, same age as my wife, and I can say for a fact that fertility was not on our minds. Your response to posts are always so sensible and merit considerable thought. I had my one child, a daughter, at the age of 24 and that was sufficient for me. Raising kids requires a tremendous amount of work and resources.
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Not gonna quote your entire post as the edit will become too long.
I think when you say you do not claim to speak for anyone else that is a bit difficult to see - as you keep referring to what the average man or woman wants. I acknowledge you also 'take on' the women's perspective by saying women have better chances of attracting a good men before age 27, but I also do not understand what this is based on.
Anyway. I sure do think what 'society' thinks has a whole lot to do with this, and that women/men can influence what standards are set, as this can be different in different cultures.
Either way - taking your advice to heart I best start searching asap cos my deadline is approaching
I think when you say you do not claim to speak for anyone else that is a bit difficult to see - as you keep referring to what the average man or woman wants. I acknowledge you also 'take on' the women's perspective by saying women have better chances of attracting a good men before age 27, but I also do not understand what this is based on.
Anyway. I sure do think what 'society' thinks has a whole lot to do with this, and that women/men can influence what standards are set, as this can be different in different cultures.
Either way - taking your advice to heart I best start searching asap cos my deadline is approaching
Well i am usually willing to address points that are brought up to me.. This thread was about advice to young people.. So my reply was tailored only to young people.. But as for a mans fertility.. If i was a woman who wanted to become a mother i might just go to the extent of getting my man tested for fertility before marrying him.. But you see i am not a young woman...
But i do know woman have different priorities when selecting a man to be her husband.. Now woman in general and individual woman can set their priories as they deem fit.. But it is a good thing for young woman to know a little bit about the average mans priorities.. But like individual woman likewise individual men may have their own personal priorities that are different from the average man..
I have 6 sisters and no they where not told about this.. I was the 7th sibling so most of my sisters are older then me and i did not come to this conclusion for some time.. But in the case of my 6 sisters 3 of them succeed in having children.. Their first kids where at 19 years old.. 18 years old and 22 years old.. So all my sisters who succeed in becoming mothers attracted their husbands when they where young.. The 3 sisters who failed to have kids, 1 did not want kids and the other two attempted to get married and start in their mid to late 30's..
I have never said ""give up all hope"" Remember my advice was directed towards young woman... Not towards woman over 27.. My advice was directed at helping young woman increase their chances of both becoming mothers and finding the highest quality husband they can get... As for older woman there are always a chance that they can find a husband.. You may find an older men who has already had kids.. You may find an older man who does not want kids but wants to have a wife as a life time companion.. You may find a husband and you might be one of those woman who gets pregnant at 45 and has a healthy baby....
But i do know woman have different priorities when selecting a man to be her husband.. Now woman in general and individual woman can set their priories as they deem fit.. But it is a good thing for young woman to know a little bit about the average mans priorities.. But like individual woman likewise individual men may have their own personal priorities that are different from the average man..
I have 6 sisters and no they where not told about this.. I was the 7th sibling so most of my sisters are older then me and i did not come to this conclusion for some time.. But in the case of my 6 sisters 3 of them succeed in having children.. Their first kids where at 19 years old.. 18 years old and 22 years old.. So all my sisters who succeed in becoming mothers attracted their husbands when they where young.. The 3 sisters who failed to have kids, 1 did not want kids and the other two attempted to get married and start in their mid to late 30's..
I have never said ""give up all hope"" Remember my advice was directed towards young woman... Not towards woman over 27.. My advice was directed at helping young woman increase their chances of both becoming mothers and finding the highest quality husband they can get... As for older woman there are always a chance that they can find a husband.. You may find an older men who has already had kids.. You may find an older man who does not want kids but wants to have a wife as a life time companion.. You may find a husband and you might be one of those woman who gets pregnant at 45 and has a healthy baby....
"Failed to have children"...
Do you see having children as the ultimate goal in life, and anyone who does not has somehow "failed" at life?
Perhaps I am misunderstanding you, but I just don't see how promoting the idea that a woman has to rush to get married by 27 or her looks, fertility, and worth will be gone (and she will be unable to attract a quality man) is in any way, shape, or form, a God-given principle.
May I ask, how many children do you have, and did you marry a woman before she was 27? I know you have written of your opinion on this many times here on CC over the years.
I could be wrong, but if I remember correctly, you are in your 50's? (Feel free to give the right age range if I'm not remembering this right.)
Do you see having children as the ultimate goal in life, and anyone who does not has somehow "failed" at life?
Perhaps I am misunderstanding you, but I just don't see how promoting the idea that a woman has to rush to get married by 27 or her looks, fertility, and worth will be gone (and she will be unable to attract a quality man) is in any way, shape, or form, a God-given principle.
May I ask, how many children do you have, and did you marry a woman before she was 27? I know you have written of your opinion on this many times here on CC over the years.
I could be wrong, but if I remember correctly, you are in your 50's? (Feel free to give the right age range if I'm not remembering this right.)
Yes because this is what i have observed in my life that average men want.. But me saying what i believe is still me just putting forward my belief.. Again i do not claim to be the official spokesman for all mankind..
Simply it is based on what the average man wants out of a marriage.. Children.. to be a dad.. and the best chance a man has to become a dad is if he marries a fertile woman.. So the more fertile a woman appears to be to a man the more he will rate her highly as a potential marriage prospect...
It was never a dead line... It was advice given so that young woman can achieve the optimal outcome..
Simply it is based on what the average man wants out of a marriage.. Children.. to be a dad.. and the best chance a man has to become a dad is if he marries a fertile woman.. So the more fertile a woman appears to be to a man the more he will rate her highly as a potential marriage prospect...
Either way - taking your advice to heart I best start searching asap cos my deadline is approaching
Well i failed to have children. So yes i think you are misunderstanding me.. I don't think it is absolutely necessary to succeed in becoming a dad.. It would have been nice to have become a dad i sometimes wonder and think i could have been a good dad.. But to me it is not necessary.. Paul was never married and never became a dad.. But his life was of worth no matter..
I don't see getting married at 27 a rush at all... And again i am not saying a woman over 27 has no worth,, you seem to be injecting that into my message.. And i think to give good advice to young woman is a Godly thing to do.. Now young woman can decide for themselves if what i am saying is wise or stupid.. But at lest if they read this thread they can get a perspective they may never get elsewhere and consider it at lest..
I am 52 years old.. And i do not have any Children.. But that's really irrelevant to this threads focus.. Which is on young people and advice for them.. It's not about old guys like me
I don't see getting married at 27 a rush at all... And again i am not saying a woman over 27 has no worth,, you seem to be injecting that into my message.. And i think to give good advice to young woman is a Godly thing to do.. Now young woman can decide for themselves if what i am saying is wise or stupid.. But at lest if they read this thread they can get a perspective they may never get elsewhere and consider it at lest..
I am 52 years old.. And i do not have any Children.. But that's really irrelevant to this threads focus.. Which is on young people and advice for them.. It's not about old guys like me
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Well i failed to have children. So yes i think you are misunderstanding me.. I don't think it is absolutely necessary to succeed in becoming a dad.. It would have been nice to have become a dad i sometimes wonder and think i could have been a good dad.. But to me it is not necessary.. Paul was never married and never became a dad.. But his life was of worth no matter..
I don't see getting married at 27 a rush at all... And again i am not saying a woman over 27 has no worth,, you seem to be injecting that into my message.. And i think to give good advice to young woman is a Godly thing to do.. Now young woman can decide for themselves if what i am saying is wise or stupid.. But at lest if they read this thread they can get a perspective they may never get elsewhere and consider it at lest..
I am 52 years old.. And i do not have any Children.. But that's really irrelevant to this threads focus.. Which is on young people and advice for them.. It's not about old guys like me
I don't see getting married at 27 a rush at all... And again i am not saying a woman over 27 has no worth,, you seem to be injecting that into my message.. And i think to give good advice to young woman is a Godly thing to do.. Now young woman can decide for themselves if what i am saying is wise or stupid.. But at lest if they read this thread they can get a perspective they may never get elsewhere and consider it at lest..
I am 52 years old.. And i do not have any Children.. But that's really irrelevant to this threads focus.. Which is on young people and advice for them.. It's not about old guys like me
But regarding the fact that one can have a quality life, whether or not they have children... Ah, at last, this is something we can agree on.
I could be misinterpreting, but it seems that maybe there was a point in your life in which you would have liked to have had a family. I'm truly sorry if you feel that the desires of your heart were not met
and I hope that God has blessed you in other areas of your life and has given you peace and contentment. Thank you for answering my questions honestly and openly.
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