Did you all know that there are three heavens

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7seasrekeyed said:
did you read about or hear where they have launched a probe to go closer to the sun than anything before?...launched a couple of days ago now I think

but who cares about science, right? o_O lol!
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Lol..i actuallly dont have tv or computer but i love hearing bout how science discovers things bout the Bible that no one thpught was real etc..intruiges me..btw..i really didnt like science other than genetics..no hands on biology..loved!
 
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trofimus said:
I do not understand what you mean by this question. What is a relation between some teaching based on truth and free giving of this teaching?
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Fair enough, you should though but unless the gospel of Christ was received with understanding, then the parable of the sower would not have produced any fruit.

So for brevity would I be mistaken if I was to say that your faith is that the seed is received by believing?

It is obvious your answer is going to be yes. Then do you believe the following:

When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side. Matt 13:19
 
Zmouth said:
Fair enough, you should though but unless the gospel of Christ was received with understanding, then the parable of the sower would not have produced any fruit.

So for brevity would I be mistaken if I was to say that your faith is that the seed is received by believing?

It is obvious your answer is going to be yes. Then do you believe the following:

When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side. Matt 13:19
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And your point is...?
 
mailmandan said:
My wife grew up in the RLDS church (similar to LDS) and was falsely taught that the third Heaven was divided into 3 separate compartments - 1. Celestial 2. Terrestrial 3. Telestial

In the so called "Inspired" version of the bible, Joseph Smith "added" the word "telestial" to support his false doctrine.

1 Corinthians 15:40 (IV) - Also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial, and bodies "telestial;" but the glory of the celestial, one; and the terrestrial, another; and the "telestial," another.

The Word of God actually says (NKJV) - There are also celestial bodies and terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
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mailmandan said:
My wife grew up in the RLDS church (similar to LDS) and was falsely taught that the third Heaven was divided into 3 separate compartments - 1. Celestial 2. Terrestrial 3. Telestial

In the so called "Inspired" version of the bible, Joseph Smith "added" the word "telestial" to support his false doctrine.

1 Corinthians 15:40 (IV) - Also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial, and bodies "telestial;" but the glory of the celestial, one; and the terrestrial, another; and the "telestial," another.

The Word of God actually says (NKJV) - There are also celestial bodies and terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
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This is what MattforJessus said, and explained it very well.
Satan was kicked out of the third heaven, but has access to the second and first heaven, which he is the prince of the power of the air, and the sky above us is considered heaven.

The third heaven is considered where God dwells, but He actually dwells everywhere, for He is an omnipresent Spirit, and there is no such thing as space because God fills all space.

God is as much here on earth as He is in the third heaven.

Some people think that the war in heaven between Michael and his angels and Satan and his angels in Revelation 12 already occurred, and is the war when Satan was kicked out of the third heaven, but it is not true, but is a future war when Satan and his angels are cast to earth, and Satan deceives all people that do not love God to follow the beast kingdom, which the earth becomes their holding cell.
 
7seasrekeyed said:
ok Einstein

better wear your asbestos suit when you go out


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If the moon is so far out in space, where is the firmament?
 
pjharrison said:
If the moon is so far out in space, where is the firmament?
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Genesis is writen from a human perspective. Humans see moon and sun in the sky, therefore God placed them there for measurement of time (on Earth).

Its not a technical description of the universe. The sun, moon etc are not in the sky technically, only optically.
 
trofimus said:
Genesis is writen from a human perspective. Humans see moon and sun in the sky, therefore God placed them there for measurement of time (on Earth).

Its not a technical description of the universe. The sun, moon etc are not in the sky technically, only optically.
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So where is the firmament or do you not believe the bible when God says he put a firmament above the sky.
 
pjharrison said:
So where is the firmament or do you not believe the bible when God says he put a firmament above the sky.
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Firmanent in the ancient world view is the sky. Its where clouds are, where birds fly and where stars, sun and moon are visible.

Technically, in our current language, its just atmosphere.
 
trofimus said:
Firmanent is the sky.
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No. Genesis 1:6-8 6And God said, "Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water." 7So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. 8God called the vault "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning-the second day
Definition of vault - a roof in the form of an arch or a series of arches, typical of churches and other large, formal buildings.
 
pjharrison said:
So where is the firmament or do you not believe the bible when God says he put a firmament above the sky.
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The firmament in Genesis 1:6-8 is the cloud that thee LORD covered the earth with like a garment.

A cloud body of gaseous matter. Atmosphere.

4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
Job 38:4-6

When I made the cloud the garment thereof, and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it, Job 38:9

So what light did your God see when he saw the light?

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Gen 1:3-4
 
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pjharrison said:
No. Genesis 1:6-8 6And God said, "Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water." 7So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. 8God called the vault "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning-the second day
Definition of vault - a roof in the form of an arch or a series of arches, typical of churches and other large, formal buildings.
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The "water above" are clouds.
 
Zmouth said:
The firmament in Genesis 1:6-8 is the cloud that thee LORD covered the earth with like a garment.

A cloud body of gaseous matter. Atmosphere.

4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
Job 38:4-6

When I made the cloud the garment thereof, and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it, Job 38:9

So what light did your God see when he saw the light?

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Gen 1:3-4
Genesis 1:6-8 6And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were( under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament): and it was so. 8And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day
You said- A cloud body of gaseous matter. Atmosphere. That's not a the firmament
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trofimus said:
The "water above" are clouds.
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Genesis 1:6-8 6And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were(under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament): and it was so. 8And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day
 
pjharrison said:
Genesis 1:6-8 6And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were(under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament): and it was so. 8And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day
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Yes, water cycle.
 
pjharrison said:
under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament) The firmament is in the middle of the waters.
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Ancient people did not have a language to describe atmosphere. They did not understand nature laws that something can "float" above. They used "firmanent" (something that holds waters above) to describe it.

We today know that its not "solid", but based on various pressures, tempeatures etc. Its a complex system.

Do not read Genesis like written today. It was not.
 
trofimus said:
Ancient people did not have a language to describe atmosphere. They did not understand nature laws that something can "float" above. They used "firmanent" (something that holds waters above) to describe it.

We today know that its not "solid", but based on various pressures, tempeatures etc. Its a complex system.

Do not read Genesis like written today. It was not.
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If you discredit one part of the bible, then you must discredit it all.
 
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