God sending People He made and loves to the lake of fire.

[shrume]

Is this the shroom I used to know?

One and the same, Chucky. There's been quite a few people migrate here after bible-discussion.com shut down.

 

[Chuckyz2]

Maybe now you understand why people are reacting as they are to your initial post...

I do understand. Jesus talks about that clearly too.

 

[Chuckyz2]

One and the same, Chucky. There's been quite a few people migrate here after bible-discussion.com shut down.

Well hello!

 

[Chuckyz2]

One and the same, Chucky. There's been quite a few people migrate here after bible-discussion.com shut down.

I kinda figured that out already.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

You don't have to reply to them all. It was not my attention to put anyone through that much work. Only to show how many there actually are that clearly state all peoples saved.

Im not upset. I preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ properly. By letting Jesus and the Bible do the talking. Then I show people how they are not able to understand even elementary style writings. Writings that are so simply stated one would have to be blinded by Satan to not be able to see it. They define themselves. People change and ignore them to try and make their theology, which is a horrible one where Satan is the god, and most people go to eternal punishment. My Lord. That is just awful to even think about. Seriously.

Well, you have to take those verses in context and you have to take them with the REST of scripture - NO ONE is saved except by faith in Jesus Christ.

 

[Chuckyz2]

Some anti Universalist posted a threat then deleted it.
They obviously have a hatred for others who don't believe as they do.
And Im not a Universalist. They believe Satan is saved.
Instead of reasoning or at least trying to reason they just hate.
Its a sign they may have the wrong theology. Jesus said to love people.
How much more can one love than to say even those that hate you
are saved and will inherit eternal salvation in paradise.
Like He said on the cross. Forgive them Father, they know not what they do.
And I do love all peoples. As for hate. I have that too. For
Satan, his angels and their bastard kids when the angels mated
with human women and the Nephs were born. I don't have to hate
my brothers and sisters. : )
P..S. Aside from laying down ones life for his friends. : )

 

[Chuckyz2]

Well, you have to take those verses in context and you have to take them with the REST of scripture - NO ONE is saved except by faith in Jesus Christ.

You don't find proper context imagining the whole world means part of the world.
You end up in a theology that is full of contradictions and it gets so bad they think
a loving God casts His own children into eternal suffering. Another huge contradiction.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

And you do the same thing. You take simply stated verses and change them drastically by adding words that fit what you want to believe.

Actually, I didn't change the verses at all - You have to look at those verses within the WHOLE scope of scripture . . . God sent his only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES in him shall not perish but have eternal life . . .

I'm sorry you went to all the trouble to post all of those. I cant go answer them all at once. If you would like to break it down one or two at a time I would be happy to show you how you change scripture I will start with the first one.

You say he will then you say He won't. You 100% stated a contradiction.
And you don't even appear to be aware of it.

1 John 2:2
And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours
only but also for the whole world.

The "not for ours only" is the believers
the "whole world" is believers and non believers combined.
Its a no brainer. Omg. A little child could see it for what it obviously says,
If God actually cast people into hell, those that change the words in scripture would be the first to go.
But He doesn't, so you are safe. : )

Jesus Christ shed his blood for the remission of sins - He is the atonement for our sins - not ours only but for the sins of the world - the atonement is only applicable to those who believe in Jesus Christ. As I haven't changed any words in scripture - I sure do feel safe!

 

[Chuckyz2]

Heb 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour that he
by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

That does say every man, right?

 

[Chuckyz2]

Actually, I didn't change the verses at all - You have to look at those verses within the WHOLE scope of scripture . . . God sent his only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES in him shall not perish but have eternal life . . .

Jesus Christ shed his blood for the remission of sins - He is the atonement for our sins - not ours only but for the sins of the world - the atonement is only applicable to those who believe in Jesus Christ. As I haven't changed any words in scripture - I sure do feel safe!

You should. If you are a human being you saved. Its simply stated over and over and over again.

1 Tim 4:9-11
9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation.
10 For therefore we both labour and suffer
reproach,because we trust in the living God,
who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that
believe.

It does say all men, right?
Let me guess. You don't believe that writer?

 

[peacefulbeliever]

You don't find proper context imagining the whole world means part of the world.
You end up in a theology that is full of contradictions and it gets so bad they think
a loving God casts His own children into eternal suffering. Another huge contradiction.

ALL PEOPLE are NOT God's children . . . . NO contradictions whatsoever . . . NO ONE is a child of God until they are born of the Spirit. The only way to be born of the Spirit is through faith in Jesus Christ. Romans 10:9,10 says if we confess Jesus as Lord and believe God raised him from the dead - we are saved - saved from what? the wrath of God . . . If we believe in Jesus Christ we receive eternal life . . . that is the life Christ died to give . . . but again, ONLY those who believe in him will receive eternal life. . . . there's no other way.

 

[Chuckyz2]

Actually, I didn't change the verses at all - You have to look at those verses within the WHOLE scope of scripture . . . God sent his only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES in him shall not perish but have eternal life . . .

Jesus Christ shed his blood for the remission of sins - He is the atonement for our sins - not ours only but for the sins of the world - the atonement is only applicable to those who believe in Jesus Christ. As I haven't changed any words in scripture - I sure do feel safe!

I forgot verse 11
1 Tim 4:9-11
9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation.
10 For therefore we both labour and suffer
reproach,because we trust in the living God,
who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that
believe.
11 These things command and teach.

Am I a bad Christian for thinking that says every man will be saved?
Or maybe my English skills are faulty and I should go back to skool.

 

[shrume]

Heb 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour that he
by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

That does say every man, right?

Indeed it does.

But the Bible says people need to believe. And before you bring up that eventually everyone will believe, they must do so in this life.

Heb 9:
27) And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

It's true that everyone will bow the knee to Jesus Christ. But for many, it will be too late.

 

[Chuckyz2]

ALL PEOPLE are NOT God's children . . . . NO contradictions whatsoever . . . NO ONE is a child of God until they are born of the Spirit. The only way to be born of the Spirit is through faith in Jesus Christ. Romans 10:9,10 says if we confess Jesus as Lord and believe God raised him from the dead - we are saved - saved from what? the wrath of God . . . If we believe in Jesus Christ we receive eternal life . . . that is the life Christ died to give . . . but again, ONLY those who believe in him will receive eternal life. . . . there's no other way.

I will again repeat:
Yes you must believe. I never questioned that. I have said a few times that it is scripture that every knee shall bow.
That every single human being will praise God. On the last day

 

[Chuckyz2]

Indeed it does.

But the Bible says people need to believe. And before you bring up that eventually everyone will believe, they must do so in this life.

Heb 9:
27) And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

It's true that everyone will bow the knee to Jesus Christ. But for many, it will be too late.

He is actually posting scripture now. Kudos.
If the only requirement is believing and God is longsuffering toward us, why would you assume there is a time limit on it?
But even more interesting are the verses that say all peoples are saved.


1 Tim 2:3-6
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of
God our Savior;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto
the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God
and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in
due time.

Can you see it brother?

 

[shrume]

I will again repeat:
Yes you must believe. I never questioned that. I have said a few times that it is scripture that every knee shall bow.
That every single human being will praise God. On the last day

The Bible does not say that every single human being will praise God. It does say that everyone will bow the knee. They will know the truth, that they should have believed. There's going to be a lot of weeping and gnashing of teeth. Many people will be sad and angry when they get their sentence.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

Heb 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour that he
by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

That does say every man, right?

9) But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
10) For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
11) For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,
It does say every man . . . v10 says "bringing many sons unto glory - hmmm - shouldn't that say "bringing every man unto glory" since "every man" is in verse 9? It says "bringing many sons" and not "every man" because not ALL will believe in Jesus Christ.
Then in verse 11, it specifically says "and they who are sanctified . . . who are the ones sanctified? - the ones who believe in Jesus Christ!!

Sunday School basic verse - For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. . . Whoever believes in him is NOT CONDEMNED but whoever does not believe stands CONDEMNED already because they have not believed in the name of God's only begotten Son.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

You should. If you are a human being you saved. Its simply stated over and over and over again.

1 Tim 4:9-11
9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation.
10 For therefore we both labour and suffer
reproach,because we trust in the living God,
who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that
believe.

It does say all men, right?
Let me guess. You don't believe that writer?

ESPECIALLY OF THOSE THAT BELIEVE . . . . perfect verse!!!!!

 

[shrume]

If the only requirement is believing and God is longsuffering toward us, why would you assume there is a time limit on it?

Because the Bible says there is.

Heb 9:
27) And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

But even more interesting are the verses that say all peoples are saved.


1 Tim 2:3-6
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of
God our Savior;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto
the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God
and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in
due time.

Can you see it brother?

I can see that God wants all men to be saved, and that the ransom Christ paid was for all.

But people have to believe.

 

[Adstar]

I know that a large majority of believers believe that most people get cast on judgment day.
I also know there are a lot more people that don't believe it but keep hush about it because
they know they will be shunned by their church and fellow Christians.
I am also aware that there are a few, and only a few verses in the Bible that can actually
appear to say it. But there are numerous verses that say all peoples are saved.
Why are they never discussed in Christian forums?
Here are some. In case anyone is interested in discussing them.

1. 1 John 4:14
And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son as Savior of
the world. (Can this mean part of the world?)

2. 1 John 2:2
And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours
only but also for the whole world. (Never mind. I think this answered my question)

3. John 4:42
And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Savior of the world.

4. John 6:33
For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.

5. John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

6. John 17:2
As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

7. Heb 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour;that he
by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

8. Heb 2:17
Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

9. 1 Tim 4:9-11
9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation.
10 For therefore we both labour and suffer
reproach,because we trust in the living God,
who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that
believe.
11 These things command and teach. (wow. How can anyone question that?)

10. 1 Tim 2:3-6
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of
God our Savior;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto
the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God
and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in
due time.

Col 1
19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile >all things< unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Col 1
28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

Rom 5
19 For as by one man's disobedience >many< were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall >many< be made righteous.
Rom 8
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
(Animals will be saved also. Thought Id throw that in there. : ) )

Romans 11
30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. (Pretty forth right, no?)

1 Cor 4
5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.

1 Cor 11
3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

1 Cor 15
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

2 Cor 5
14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:
Heb 8

11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
To be Cont: There are many.

Luke 2
9 And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid.
10 And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.
11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Luke 23
34 Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.
(That's kind of a big one if you think about it rationally)

2 Peter 3
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
(Will not Gods Will be done?)

Galatians 3
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall >all< nations be blessed.

Lam 3
31 For the Lord will not cast off for ever:
32 But though he cause grief, yet will he have compassion according to the multitude of his mercies.

Joel 2
28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:

Psalm 22
27 All the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the Lord: and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before thee.
28 For the kingdom is the Lord's: and he is the governor among the nations.

Psalm 65
2 O thou that hearest prayer, unto thee shall all flesh come.
3 Iniquities prevail against me: as for our transgressions, thou shalt purge them away.

Psalm 66
4 All the earth shall worship thee, and shall sing unto thee; they shall sing to thy name. Selah.

Psalm 86
9 All nations whom thou hast made shall come and worship before thee, O Lord; and shall glorify thy name.

Psalm 145
21 My mouth shall speak the praise of the Lord: and let all flesh bless his holy name for ever and ever.

Acts 3
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Gen 12
3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Gen 18
18 Seeing that Abraham shall surely become a great and mighty nation, and all the nations of the earth shall be blessed in him?

Gen 28
14 And thy seed shall be as the dust of the earth, and thou shalt spread abroad to the west, and to the east, and to the north, and to the south: and in thee and in thy seed shall all the families of the earth be blessed.

Titus 2
11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men.
Isaiah 25

8 He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the Lord hath spoken it.

Isaiah 26
9 With my soul have I desired thee in the night; yea, with my spirit within me will I seek thee early: for when thy judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.

Isaiah 40
5 And the glory of the Lord shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.

Isaiah 45
21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the Lord? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
22 Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
23 I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

Isaiah 52
10 The Lord hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.

Isaiah 57
16 For I will not contend for ever, neither will I be always wroth: for the spirit should fail before me, and the souls which I have made.
Revelation 5
13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

This topic is discussed a great deal on Christian websites.. And yes those who are not saved will be cast into the eternal lake of fire where they will be in torment day and night forever and ever..

The Bible declaring that Jesus is the savoir of the world is declaring that Jesus is not just the Redeemer only for Jewish believers.. But that He is the Redeemer of all people who believe and trust in the atonement He secured for them from all races / nations on the earth.. They are NOT stating that Jesus is going to save all human beings..

All the scriptures are inspired to full understanding comes when we accept all the scriptures and use them to interpret the actual situation.. So denying the scriptures that clearly state that humans are going to be cast into the eternal lake of fire is a road to deception..