YOKE OF BONDAGE

[notuptome]

Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 ¶ And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

I'll take the Spirit of adoption. Even Abraham did not call God Father. Moses did not call God Father, nor David or any of the patriarchs of the faith. We by adoption are children of God and call Him who created all things Father.

Christ took off my yoke of bondage and gave me the Spirit.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Wall]

Since the old covenant has been made obsolete, does this leave us with no moral direction?

Obsolete???? Im supposing you dont read the Ole KJB. Waxing old is a far cry from obsolete. Ya gotta get a real bible.

 

[mailmandan]

MATTHEW 19 [16] And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? [17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. [18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, [19] Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The translated word for commandments in Matthew 19 is “entole”. As you can very very clearly see, its the 10 commandments being spoken of.

Did Jesus say "10 commandments" or mention all 10 commandments? Jesus mentioned, “You shall not murder,’ You shall not commit adultery, ‘You shall not steal, ‘You shall not bear false witness,’ 19 ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” References for the moral aspect of 9 of the 10 commandments are reiterated in the New Testament under the New Covenant (including the 5 mentioned above), yet the command to keep the Sabbath day is not mentioned.

John makes a clear distinction between "nomas" and "entole," as I already explained in post #10. “For the law (“nomos”) was given through Moses; but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.” (John 1:17). “Did not Moses given you the law, (“nomos”) yet none of you keeps the law? (“nomos”). Why do you seek to kill Me?” (John 7:19). Misguided teachers of the law (including SDA's, Hebrew Roots etc..) interpret the New Testament through the lens of the Old Covenant law. Every time a law keeper sees the word "commandment" he is trained to think of the 10 commandments, but that is not the case.

"He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant — not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills...the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone...the ministry that condemns" (2 Corinthians 3:6-9).

The law on our heart and mind is the love of the Spirit, not the law of the letter. This is why Paul tells us that the new covenant is a covenant of the Spirit, and not of the letter.

Now in regards to Matthew 19:16-19, (which tickles the ears of works-salvationists) the rich young man confidently and (self righteously) declared that he has kept the commandments from his youth up and qualified for heaven under those terms. Yet Jesus knew the man's wealth had become his idolatrous god, which kept him from believing in Jesus (John 3:18).

The rich young man missed the point that Jesus was making, failed to place his faith in Jesus for salvation, and continued instead to trust in his riches (vs. 21-23). His face fell and he went away sad because he could not part from his great wealth, not even in exchange for eternal life.

*If keeping the commandments is the basis by which we receive eternal life, then why isn't this remark the pattern for all discussions concerning eternal life? Paul would have said to the jailer who asked, "what must I do to be saved?" by replying in Acts 16:31, "keep the commandments," yet that's not what Paul said.

Jesus knows the hearts of all men and responds to each individual a little differently because He knows where their need is. He didn't respond to the woman at the well, or to Nicodemus or to the rich young ruler the same way, yet the consistent pattern in scripture is salvation by grace through faith, not works (Ephesians 2:8,9).

 

[mailmandan]

Obsolete???? Im supposing you dont read the Ole KJB. Waxing old is a far cry from obsolete. Ya gotta get a real bible.

Yes, OBSOLETE. It sounds like you are having a difficult time transitioning from the old covenant into the New Covenant.

KJV Lexicon
palaioo pal-ah-yo'-o: to make (passively, become) worn out, or declare obsolete -- decay, make (wax) old.

http://biblehub.com/lexicon/hebrews/8-13.htm

 

[7seasrekeyed]

BOTH the 10 commandments and circumcision were givin as “covenants”

and when a woman's husband dies, she is free to marry another. parable sound about right or hard to understand?

did Jesus die for nothing? why did He die if we are still bound by the covenant made at Mt Sinai ?

God did not make the covenant of circumcision with the Gentiles. He made a new covenant in which someone, Jesus died

there are no more sacrifices and no more covenants

Jesus said 'It is finished' but some folks just gotta keep trying to put themselves back into the OT

 

[Studyman]

="mailmandan, post: 3651299, member: 193497"]

Did Jesus say "10 commandments" or mention all 10 commandments? Jesus mentioned, “You shall not murder,’ You shall not commit adultery, ‘You shall not steal, ‘You shall not bear false witness,’ 19 ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” References for the moral aspect of 9 of the 10 commandments are reiterated in the New Testament under the New Covenant (including the 5 mentioned above), yet the command to keep the Sabbath day is not mentioned.

Your preaching that Jesus doesn't mention God's Sabbath that was made for man is not accurate. He didn't say it was lawful to reject His Sabbath that He created for man, or "ANY" Commandment of God for that matter, but that it was Lawful to do good on His Sabbath, He sanctified and made Holy as the Word which became Flesh.

As this same Word He also said.

Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

And again;

Is. 56
2 Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
3 Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: (Jews?) I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

So your preaching that the Word which became Flesh didn't mention His Sabbath is not Biblically accurate.

So while you accuse and condemn those who have chosen to "Walk" in the works God ordained beforehand that we should walk in them, it turns out that you are the one that is preaching things about the God of the Bible that is not true.

*If keeping the commandments is the basis by which we receive eternal life, then why isn't this remark the pattern for all discussions concerning eternal life? Paul would have said to the jailer who asked, "what must I do to be saved?" by replying in Acts 16:31, "keep the commandments," yet that's not what Paul said.

No, that's what Jesus said over and over and over and over, both as the Word, and as the Word which became Flesh. Will you deny this truth?

Matt. 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

Paul is just saying to "Believe on Him"

Acts 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

Paul didn't say to reject Christ's Words, He said to "Believe on them". Was He not the Word which became Flesh"? So isn't Paul telling the man to "Believe the Word's of the Word which became Flesh? That would also mean the Law and Prophets, Yes? Did Jesus, besides telling us to do good on His Sabbath, say anything about the Law and Prophets?

Matt. 5:
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Is Paul telling this man to reject these Word's of the Christ, or "believe on them"?

And what did Paul say about the Law and Prophets? Did he "Believe" the Word's of the Christ in respect to them?

Acts 24:14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Is Isaiah part of the Law and Prophets? Did Jesus ever quote or use Isaiah in His Gospel?

Jesus knows the hearts of all men and responds to each individual a little differently because He knows where their need is. He didn't respond to the woman at the well, or to Nicodemus or to the rich young ruler the same way, yet the consistent pattern in scripture is salvation by grace through faith, not works (Ephesians 2:8,9).

Eph. 2:
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that (Grace) not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of (mans) works, lest any man should boast.

Man had nothing to do with the creation of God's Salvation Plan. God's plan to create mortals and grant them immortality is 100% the gift of God. All we need to do is "believe" on Him.

10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Paul is still in perfect union with the Christ and His instructions.

Where are these "good Works" found that God ordained beforehand? The Law and Prophets of course.

The Jailer in Acts, What Words of the Lord did Paul tell him about?

Was it; "IF you keep my commandments you are My Disciples?

Was it; "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

How do you get from Paul's instruction to "Believe on Him" to your preaching of "yet the command to keep the Sabbath day is not mentioned" ?

Your religion, like the Mainstream religion of Christ's Time, just doesn't line up with all the Scriptures Dan. Shall someone not point these things out to you?

 

[Studyman]

Yes, OBSOLETE. It sounds like you are having a difficult time transitioning from the old covenant into the New Covenant.

KJV Lexicon
palaioo pal-ah-yo'-o: to make (passively, become) worn out, or declare obsolete -- decay, make (wax) old.

http://biblehub.com/lexicon/hebrews/8-13.htm

You seem to misunderstand what the New Covenant is. You preach it is the Old Testament. But let's actually post what the Creator of the New Covenant tells us it is and listen to Him.

Jer. 31:
33" But this shall be the covenant "that I will make with the house of Israel;

Ok here we are, this is where the creator of the Covenant tells us what the New Covenant is. This is the Word which Became Flesh describing His New Covenant.


After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

So if, after those days, the Word which Became Flesh will Himself, place His Laws on our hearts, how do the people receive His Laws at this time, and before "those days"? By the Levitical Priesthood, yes?

Heb. 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

So the Word which became Flesh is telling us about a time when we will no longer need to rely on "Priests" to administer God's Laws.

Is there any indication of God's Commandments changing? Is there any indication of the definition of sin changing?

The only "Law" that changed was the "law" that said only a Levite could partake of the Priesthood. (See Hebrews 7)

Shall I "believe on Him"?

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

So in addition to how God's Laws are administered, He also says He will forgive their sins. So the question again is how were sin's forgiven in this time? How were men cleansed before "Those Days"? Also by the Levitical Priesthood, Yes?

Levite Priests were given sacrificial, Ceremonial "Deeds or Works" which were to be performed specifically by the Levite Priests for the justification and remission of sins (Sin is defined by God to mean transgression of God's Commandments).

So "after those days", We will no longer have to rely on the Levitical Priesthood and their "works of the Law" for remission of sins, The Word which became Flesh will forgive our sins Himself.

Once more, no indication that the definition of sin has changed, only the manner is which God's Laws are administered, and the manner in which our transgressions are forgiven.

It seems religious man has "ADDED" to the Christ's definition of his New Covenant. Aren't we told specifically not to do this?

 

[Wall]

According to John, the number one commandment {entolae} of Jesus to the Apostles was not Sabbath-worship, but for them to love one another:

Thing is mailmandan the bible also tells us HOW we are to “to love one another”.

1JOHN 5 [2] By this WE KNOW THAT WE LOVE THE CHILDREN OF GOD, when we love God, and keep his commandments. [3] For THIS IS THE LOVE OF GOD, THAT WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS: and his commandments are not grievous.

To love the children of God, we are to keep the commandments

2JOHN1 [5] And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that WE LOVE ONE ANOTHER.[6] And THIS IS LOVE, THAT WE WALK AFTER HIS COMMANDMENTS. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Love one another. Keep the commandments

JAMES 2 [8] If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOUR AS THYSELF, ye do well: [9] But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.[10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.[11] For he that said, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, said also, DO NOT KILL. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

ROMANS 13 [8] Owe no man any thing, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.[9] For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.[10] Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

I decided to show the scripture of James 2 and Romans 13 which explain to us how we are to show our love for one another because im sure the next thing i hear is that it is not the 10 commandments being mentioned. But as you can see in these scriptures, adultry killing, stealing, bearing false witness, covetness are mentioned. And i suppose i will hear you say that since the “keeping of the sabbath” is not mentioned or “thou shalt have no other gods before me" is not mentioned these commandments can be ignored.

 

[Wall]

Yes, OBSOLETE. It sounds like you are having a difficult time transitioning from the old covenant into the New Covenant.

KJV Lexicon
palaioo pal-ah-yo'-o: to make (passively, become) worn out, or declare obsolete -- decay, make (wax) old.

http://biblehub.com/lexicon/hebrews/8-13.htm

Whats a lexicon? I guess anyone can write a book and the many will take hold

Greek Strong's Number: 1095
Greek Word: γηράσκω
Transliteration: gēraskō
Phonetic Pronunciation:

ghay-ras'-ko
Root: from <G1094>
Cross Reference:
Part of Speech: v
Vine's Words: Aged, Old
Usage Notes:

English Words used in KJV:

be old 1
wax old 1
[Total Count: 2]

from <G1094> (geras); to be senescent :- be (wax) old.

Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

 

[mailmandan]

="mailmandan, post: 3651299, member: 193497"]

Your preaching that Jesus doesn't mention God's Sabbath that was made for man is not accurate. He didn't say it was lawful to reject His Sabbath that He created for man, or "ANY" Commandment of God for that matter, but that it was Lawful to do good on His Sabbath, He sanctified and made Holy as the Word which became Flesh.

Sabbatarians (especially SDA's) often misinterpret this verse to say that the Sabbath was made for all mankind, but the text doesn't say that. It doesn't say, it says, "the Sabbath was made for man". When the Scripture is meant to be inclusive of all mankind it is clear. See Matthew 28:19; John 3:16; Acts 2:17; I Timothy 2:4; Titus 2:11. These verses clearly indicate that when God offers something to all mankind He clearly offers it to all.

The Sabbath was not for to all the nations. It was given only to the nation of Israel. Look at Deuteronomy 5:1-15 which gives the commandments to Israel, who are under the old covenant. The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive. (see verses 2-3). Also see (Exodus 16:23, 29; 31:12-18; 35:1-3; Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3, 32; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13; Amos 8:5; Nehemiah 10:31).

As this same Word He also said.

Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

And again;

Is. 56
2 Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
3 Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: (Jews?) I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

Written to Israel under the old covenant, not to the Church, under the new covenant. You still have not made the transition into the new covenant and are stuck under the law.

So your preaching that the Word which became Flesh didn't mention His Sabbath is not Biblically accurate.

Why is it that nowhere in the New Testament is failure to keep the Sabbath day condemned as sin? Why is the fourth commandment itself not repeated even ONCE for believers to keep in the New Testament? If the Sabbath keeping is so important for a disciple of Christ, why was it not mentioned in His sermon on the Mount or in ANY of His teachings? Why didn't Jesus command Sabbath keeping to the Church? Why didn't any of the Apostles command Sabbath keeping? Why didn't the Jerusalem counsel command Sabbath keeping or condemn Sabbath breaking? (Acts 15) hmm..

So while you accuse and condemn those who have chosen to "Walk" in the works God ordained beforehand that we should walk in them, it turns out that you are the one that is preaching things about the God of the Bible that is not true.

I don't condemn those who walk in the good works that God has ordained beforehand that we should walk in them (Ephesians 2:10). Why do you pervert the gospel by teaching salvation by "grace plus law, faith plus works" and condemn those who disagree with your perverted gospel?

No, that's what Jesus said over and over and over and over, both as the Word, and as the Word which became Flesh. Will you deny this truth?

I properly harmonize Scripture with Scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. You obviously do not and continue to mix law and grace.

Matt. 19:17

And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

As I already previously explained, the rich young man confidently and (self righteously) declared that he has kept the commandments from his youth up and qualified for heaven under those terms. *Sound familiar?

Yet Jesus knew the man's wealth had become his idolatrous god, which kept him from believing in Jesus (John 3:18). The rich young man missed the point that Jesus was making, failed to place his faith in Jesus for salvation, and continued instead to trust in his riches (vs. 21-23). His face fell and he went away sad because he could not part from his great wealth, not even in exchange for eternal life.

END OF PART 1

 

[mailmandan]

PART 2

Paul is just saying to "Believe on Him"

Acts 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

Paul didn't say to reject Christ's Words, He said to "Believe on them". Was He not the Word which became Flesh"? So isn't Paul telling the man to "Believe the Word's of the Word which became Flesh? That would also mean the Law and Prophets, Yes? Did Jesus, besides telling us to do good on His Sabbath, say anything about the Law and Prophets?

Good example of how you distort God's word and teach salvation by "grace plus law, faith plus works." Paul simply said, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.. We do this by trusting exclusively in Jesus Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation. Yet you trust in the law of works. Paul did not "add" do good on the Sabbath and you will be saved in Acts 16:31 or perfectly obey the 10 commandments in Acts 16:31 and you will be saved. The keeping the Sabbath day was for the JEWS. You redefine what it means to BELIEVE just as Roman Catholics do as well.

Exodus 35:1 - Then Moses assembled all the congregation of the sons of Israel, and said to them, “These are the things that the LORD has commanded you to do: 2. For six days work may be done, but on the seventh day you shall have a holy day, a sabbath of complete rest to the LORD; whoever does any work on it shall be put to death. 3. You shall not kindle a fire in any of your dwellings on the sabbath day.” Did you get that? OF THE SONS OF ISRAEL, God said to them.

Matt. 5:
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Is Paul telling this man to reject these Word's of the Christ, or "believe on them"?

And what did Paul say about the Law and Prophets? Did he "Believe" the Word's of the Christ in respect to them?

The law was to stand, as surely as heaven and earth stood, until all the things that had been written in them concerning Christ should be fulfilled; and since he fulfilled all the things that had been written in these documents concerning himself, as surely as heaven and earth are standing; the law of Moses passed away. In later years, Paul, writing to the Ephesians; testified to this very fact: "Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances." (Ephesians 2:15.)

While the law was standing, it was easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one jot or one tittle of it to fail (Luke 16:16); but since the law was fulfilled, it would be easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one jot or one tittle of the law to become authoritative again. Seventh Day Adventists, along with other misguided teachers of the law will rise up and say, if there is no law, we may kill, steal, commit adultery, etc." In this they miss the point. "In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away." (Heb. 8:13.) It is another case of the old "Articles of Confederation" of the original thirteen States being superseded by the Constitution of the United States; it is a case of Zion formulating ideals rather than Sinai issuing cold precepts; it is a case of the "law of Christ'' taking the place of the "law of Moses."

You continue to twist the scriptures in order to teach your perverted gospel of salvation by "grace plus law, faith plus works." To "believe in Him" does not mean to mix the old and new covenant and teach salvation by works.

Acts 24:14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

To believe all things which are written in the law and the prophets does not mean twist all things which are written in the law and in the prophets and teach salvation by works.

Is Isaiah part of the Law and Prophets? Did Jesus ever quote or use Isaiah in His Gospel?

Jesus quoted from the Old Testament, especially when reasoning with the Jews, yet that does not mean that we are under the law still in the old covenant. You are determined to intermingle the old and new covenants, which gets you in trouble every time!

Eph. 2:
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that (Grace) not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of (mans) works, lest any man should boast.

Man had nothing to do with the creation of God's Salvation Plan. God's plan to create mortals and grant them immortality is 100% the gift of God. All we need to do is "believe" on Him.

You re-define "believe" on Him and turn it into salvation by works. So do Roman Catholics and other works-salvationists.

10

For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

We are saved FOR good works and NOT BY good works (Ephesians 2:8-10). You need to get that through your head.

Paul is still in perfect union with the Christ and His instructions.

Where are these "good Works" found that God ordained beforehand? The Law and Prophets of course.

The Jailer in Acts, What Words of the Lord did Paul tell him about?

Was it; "IF you keep my commandments you are My Disciples?

Paul is in perfect union with Christ and His instructions to "believe unto salvation" (John 3:15,16,18; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 13:39; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 10:4 etc..). No supplements needed.

To keep (guard, observe, watch over, keep intact) His commandments is the demonstrative evidence that we are His disciples. We are not saved based on the merits of keeping His commandments, as you would suppose, even though that may tickles your ears, and to "keep" His commandments does not mean sinless, perfect obedience to the 10 commandments either, but works salvation tickles the ears and feeds the pride of works-salvationists. I've noticed that the discussions you gravitate to the most have to do with the law/10 commandments/sabbath etc.. These types of discussions are your obsession which demonstrates what you are truly trusting in for salvation and it's NOT CHRIST ALONE.

Was it; "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

How do you get from Paul's instruction to "Believe on Him" to your preaching of "yet the command to keep the Sabbath day is not mentioned" ?

You turn "Believe on Him" into believe on the law for salvation. Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel (Exodus 16:23, 29; 31:12-18; 35:1-3; Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3, 32; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13; Amos 8:5; Nehemiah 10:31) that is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant. (Colossians 2:16-17). When will you finally figure that out?

Your religion, like the Mainstream religion of Christ's Time, just doesn't line up with all the Scriptures Dan. Shall someone not point these things out to you?

That statement is the epitome of irony. Your religion is motivated by PRIDE and is a mixture of law and grace that doesn't line up with all the Scriptures and is a perversion of the gospel (Galatians 1:6-9).

 

[mailmandan]

You seem to misunderstand what the New Covenant is. You preach it is the Old Testament. But let's actually post what the Creator of the New Covenant tells us it is and listen to Him.

Jer. 31:
33" But this shall be the covenant "that I will make with the house of Israel;

Ok here we are, this is where the creator of the Covenant tells us what the New Covenant is. This is the Word which Became Flesh describing His New Covenant.

After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

So if, after those days, the Word which Became Flesh will Himself, place His Laws on our hearts, how do the people receive His Laws at this time, and before "those days"? By the Levitical Priesthood, yes?

Heb. 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

So the Word which became Flesh is telling us about a time when we will no longer need to rely on "Priests" to administer God's Laws.

Is there any indication of God's Commandments changing? Is there any indication of the definition of sin changing?

The only "Law" that changed was the "law" that said only a Levite could partake of the Priesthood. (See Hebrews 7)

Shall I "believe on Him"?

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

So in addition to how God's Laws are administered, He also says He will forgive their sins. So the question again is how were sin's forgiven in this time? How were men cleansed before "Those Days"? Also by the Levitical Priesthood, Yes?

Levite Priests were given sacrificial, Ceremonial "Deeds or Works" which were to be performed specifically by the Levite Priests for the justification and remission of sins (Sin is defined by God to mean transgression of God's Commandments).

So "after those days", We will no longer have to rely on the Levitical Priesthood and their "works of the Law" for remission of sins, The Word which became Flesh will forgive our sins Himself.

Once more, no indication that the definition of sin has changed, only the manner is which God's Laws are administered, and the manner in which our transgressions are forgiven.

It seems religious man has "ADDED" to the Christ's definition of his New Covenant. Aren't we told specifically not to do this?

Of course the word that really jumps out at you in Jeremiah 31:33 is LAW, then you mix old testament law under the old covenant in with the new covenant. Even though you don't claim to be SDA, your doctrine is very similar, so this article below may help you:

http://www.exadventist.com/Home/Covenants/Cross/tabid/446/Default.aspx

 

[Jewel5712]

Of course the word that really jumps out at you in Jeremiah 31:33 is LAW, then you mix old testament law under the old covenant in with the new covenant. Even though you don't claim to be SDA, your doctrine is very similar, so this article below may help you:

http://www.exadventist.com/Home/Covenants/Cross/tabid/446/Default.aspx

Im sorry..whats SDA?

 

[mailmandan]

Whats a lexicon? I guess anyone can write a book and the many will take hold

Greek Strong's Number: 1095
Greek Word: γηράσκω
Transliteration: gēraskō
Phonetic Pronunciation:

ghay-ras'-ko
Root: from <G1094>
Cross Reference:
Part of Speech: v
Vine's Words: Aged, Old
Usage Notes:

English Words used in KJV:

be old 1
wax old 1
[Total Count: 2]

from <G1094> (geras); to be senescent :- be (wax) old.

Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

Your bias is getting you nowhere.

KJV Lexicon
εν preposition
en en: in, at, (up-)on, by, etc.
τω definite article - dative singular masculine
ho ho: the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom) -- the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.
λεγειν verb - present active infinitive
lego leg'-o: ask, bid, boast, call, describe, give out, name, put forth, say(-ing, on), shew, speak, tell, utter.
καινην adjective - accusative singular feminine
kainos kahee-nos': new (especially in freshness) -- new.
πεπαλαιωκεν verb - perfect active indicative - third person singular
palaioo pal-ah-yo'-o: to make (passively, become) worn out, or declare obsolete -- decay, make (wax) old.
την definite article - accusative singular feminine
ho ho: the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom) -- the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.
πρωτην adjective - accusative singular feminine
protos pro'-tos: foremost (in time, place, order or importance) -- before, beginning, best, chief(-est), first (of all), former.
το definite article - nominative singular neuter
ho ho: the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom) -- the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.
δε conjunction
de deh: but, and, etc. -- also, and, but, moreover, now (often unexpressed in English).
παλαιουμενον verb - present passive participle - nominative singular neuter
palaioo pal-ah-yo'-o: to make (passively, become) worn out, or declare obsolete -- decay, make (wax) old.
και conjunction
kai kahee: and, also, even, so then, too, etc.; often used in connection (or composition) with other particles or small words
γηρασκον verb - present active participle - nominative singular neuter
gerasko ghay-ras'-ko: to be senescent -- be (wax) old.
εγγυς adverb
eggus eng-goos': near (literally or figuratively, of place or time) -- from , at hand, near, nigh (at hand, unto), ready.
αφανισμου noun - genitive singular masculine
aphanismos af-an-is-mos': disappearance, i.e. (figuratively) abrogation -- vanish away.

Parallel Verses
New American Standard Bible
When He said, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear.

King James Bible
In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
By saying, a new covenant, He has declared that the first is old. And what is old and aging is about to disappear.

International Standard Version
In speaking of a "new" covenant, he has made the first one obsolete, and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

NET Bible
When he speaks of a new covenant, he makes the first obsolete. Now what is growing obsolete and aging is about to disappear.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
In that he said, “New”, he has made the first old, and that which is outdated and old is near destruction.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
God made this new promise and showed that the first promise was outdated. What is outdated and aging will soon disappear.

King James 2000 Bible
In that he says, A new covenant, he has made the first old. Now that which decays and grows old is ready to vanish away.

OBSOLETE IS CERTAINLY ACCEPTABLE.

 

[mailmandan]

Im sorry..whats SDA?

Seventh Day Adventist. Brother Anderson was a member of the SDA Church for 33 years. He was taught the SDA Church was the "remnant church" and was the one church entrusted with the "truth" for the last days. When he began studying the Bible instead of Ellen White's books, he made the shocking discovery that SDA truth is different from Biblical truth. You can read about what they teach below.

http://www.nonsda.org

Be sure to read this article - http://www.nonsda.org/study8.shtml

 

[Jewel5712]

Seventh Day Adventist. Brother Anderson was a member of the SDA Church for 33 years. He was taught the SDA Church was the "remnant church" and was the one church entrusted with the "truth" for the last days. When he began studying the Bible instead of Ellen White's books, he made the shocking discovery that SDA truth is different from Biblical truth. You can read about what they teach below.

http://www.nonsda.org

Be sure to read this article - http://www.nonsda.org/study8.shtml

Ahhhh..thanks

 

[Dino246]

Whats a lexicon? I guess anyone can write a book and the many will take hold

Greek Strong's Number: 1095
Greek Word: γηράσκω
Transliteration: gēraskō
Phonetic Pronunciation:

ghay-ras'-ko
Root: from <G1094>
Cross Reference:
Part of Speech: v
Vine's Words: Aged, Old
Usage Notes:

English Words used in KJV:

be old 1
wax old 1
[Total Count: 2]

from <G1094> (geras); to be senescent :- be (wax) old.

Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

Stong's is a dictionary of how words were used in the KJV. It is not useful as a general lexicon. As to your comment, Strong did exactly that. Why do you take hold of his book?

 

[Dino246]

Your bias is getting you nowhere.

KJV Lexicon
εν preposition
en en: in, at, (up-)on, by, etc.
τω definite article - dative singular masculine
ho ho: the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom) -- the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.
λεγειν verb - present active infinitive
lego leg'-o: ask, bid, boast, call, describe, give out, name, put forth, say(-ing, on), shew, speak, tell, utter.
καινην adjective - accusative singular feminine
kainos kahee-nos': new (especially in freshness) -- new.
πεπαλαιωκεν verb - perfect active indicative - third person singular
palaioo pal-ah-yo'-o: to make (passively, become) worn out, or declare obsolete -- decay, make (wax) old.
την definite article - accusative singular feminine
ho ho: the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom) -- the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.
πρωτην adjective - accusative singular feminine
protos pro'-tos: foremost (in time, place, order or importance) -- before, beginning, best, chief(-est), first (of all), former.
το definite article - nominative singular neuter
ho ho: the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom) -- the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.
δε conjunction
de deh: but, and, etc. -- also, and, but, moreover, now (often unexpressed in English).
παλαιουμενον verb - present passive participle - nominative singular neuter
palaioo pal-ah-yo'-o: to make (passively, become) worn out, or declare obsolete -- decay, make (wax) old.
και conjunction
kai kahee: and, also, even, so then, too, etc.; often used in connection (or composition) with other particles or small words
γηρασκον verb - present active participle - nominative singular neuter
gerasko ghay-ras'-ko: to be senescent -- be (wax) old.
εγγυς adverb
eggus eng-goos': near (literally or figuratively, of place or time) -- from , at hand, near, nigh (at hand, unto), ready.
αφανισμου noun - genitive singular masculine
aphanismos af-an-is-mos': disappearance, i.e. (figuratively) abrogation -- vanish away.

Parallel Verses
New American Standard Bible
When He said, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear.

King James Bible
In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
By saying, a new covenant, He has declared that the first is old. And what is old and aging is about to disappear.

International Standard Version
In speaking of a "new" covenant, he has made the first one obsolete, and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

NET Bible
When he speaks of a new covenant, he makes the first obsolete. Now what is growing obsolete and aging is about to disappear.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
In that he said, “New”, he has made the first old, and that which is outdated and old is near destruction.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
God made this new promise and showed that the first promise was outdated. What is outdated and aging will soon disappear.

King James 2000 Bible
In that he says, A new covenant, he has made the first old. Now that which decays and grows old is ready to vanish away.

OBSOLETE IS CERTAINLY ACCEPTABLE.

Agreed. The writer of Hebrews concurs in 7:12: "For when the priesthood is changed, of necessity there takes place a change of law also" and 7:18 "The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless".

 

[Wall]

You turn "Believe on Him" into believe on the law for salvation. Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel

Yup. It was givin to Isreal

EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

We {gentiles}were once STRANGERS from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for ALL PEOPLE.

Even them (us gentile STRANGERS mentioned in Ephes.2) will He bring to His holy mountain, if we should take hold of His sabbath covenant. Jesus will bring us to the 1000yr period of rest

EXODUS 31 [16] Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the SABBATH, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL COVENANT.

The above scripture points to one of those covenants spoken of in Ephes.2

ROMANS 1 [30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, [31] without understanding, COVENANTBREAKERS, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: [32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

And you can see who Paul lumps in with the covenantbreakers. Not good company

 

[posthuman]

EXODUS 31 [16] Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the SABBATH, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL COVENANT.

Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
(Hebrews 8:9)​

the days when He took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt are known as "the Exodus"