Assembling

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Sabbath or not, I won't attend a church that does not do and accomplish what it's supposed to in a meeting of the saints and is instead preoccupied with a hobby horse doctrine, a single ministry to the exclusion of all others, a particular gift, a set way of conducting it's service, or which shuts down all participation by the congregation. Not going there. I've spent way too many wasted hours trying to endure them in the name of love and cooperation and peace while I starve to death. Not doing it anymore. Period.

One of my big issues has been 1 hour/week Christianity followed by the lord's supper at Golden Corral. What is the most deserted place in the world?

Church at noon on Sundays.

 

[Latour]

Sabbath or not, I won't attend a church that does not do and accomplish what it's supposed to in a meeting of the saints and is instead preoccupied with a hobby horse doctrine, a single ministry to the exclusion of all others, a particular gift, a set way of conducting it's service, or which shuts down all participation by the congregation. Not going there. I've spent way too many wasted hours trying to endure them in the name of love and cooperation and peace while I starve to death. Not doing it anymore. Period.

A most excellent post. The people who have escaped the religious system are scattered far and wide. But more and more people are coming out of Babylon.

 

[Noose]

He abolished the law in his body. I am not sure how exactly it is not about past...

Αὐτὸς γάρ ἐστιν ἡ εἰρήνη ἡμῶν, ὁ ποιήσας τὰ ἀμφότερα ἓν καὶ τὸ μεσότοιχον τοῦ φραγμοῦ λύσας, τὴν ἔχθραν, ἐν τῇ σαρκὶ αὐτοῦ τὸν νόμον τῶν ἐντολῶν ἐν δόγμασιν καταργήσας

As for example ESV translates:

"For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances"

This is what Daniel saw/prophesied:

Dan 9:24“Seventy ‘sevens’c are decreed for your people and your holy city to finishd transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place.e

All these is fulfillment of the law but to what 'time length'? until 70*7s are completed- so it is a long period until everything is accomplished, not 33AD only.

 

[Latour]

One of my big issues has been 1 hour/week Christianity followed by the lord's supper at Golden Corral. What is the most deserted place in the world?

Church at noon on Sundays.

But you accept this as church. The enemy of our souls is clever. He puts a sign on a building that has the word "church" written on it. And most people "naively" think that they are going to "church".

I guess we are conditioned by signs. But Jesus says that an evil and adulterous generation seek after "signs" (and wonders)

 

[Ralph-]

A most excellent post. The people who have escaped the religious system are scattered far and wide. But more and more people are coming out of Babylon.

For a long time I had a vision of a grass roots movement of churches springing up that would operate more in the order of an open, but controlled, Bible study/discussion. Toss in some praise and worship and some prayer and, walla, you're 'having church'--church that works. I know there are those of us who long for that.

 

[trofimus]

This is what Daniel saw/prophesied:

Dan 9:24“Seventy ‘sevens’c are decreed for your people and your holy city to finishd transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place.e

All these is fulfillment of the law but to what 'time length'? until 70*7s are completed- so it is a long period until everything is accomplished, not 33AD only.

490 years. But not from 0 AD.

 

[Latour]

For a long time I had a vision of a grass roots movement of churches springing up that would operate more in the order of an open, but controlled, Bible study/discussion. Toss in some praise and worship and some prayer and, walla, you're 'having church'--church that works. I know there are those of us who long for that.

We have been meeting in homes for the last 28 years. But we really only understood what Ekklesia is around 20 years ago or so. God visited us and caused us to experience a revival of sorts...people coming from all over the world...with no advertising. Just the Spirit speaking to people.

 

[Noose]

So, when you sin like stealing or murdering or commiting adultery, Jesus did not die for these sins?

Is this what you are saying? If he died for all sins, no commandment of the Law is a witness against us.

You misunderstand sin, stealing or murdering or committing adultery are manifestations of sin on the flesh (works) or tongue (word). Yes they are often being referred to as sin but sin is a spirit (mind). Payment for the works of the flesh is bodily death but payment for the spirit of sin is eternal death because the spirit is eternal.

Adam and Eve sinned and the sin manifested in the flesh when they disobeyed. Each paid for the manifestation of sin through their flesh; Eve through laboring during child birth and Adam through sweating when tilling the land for food, but the overall payment for unseen sin was death.

Jesus comes so that we can have eternal life because the spirit that is in Him is not death but eternal life- that's why He overcame death.

The law is of the flesh yet the underlying basis for all the law is spiritual LOVE. When Jesus comes, He doesn't abolish the law which is of the flesh but makes it perfect by exposing the spiritual part of it.

'You were told do not commit adultery but i tell you do not lust after a woman'. It goes deeper than the fleshly works.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

But you accept this as church. The enemy of our souls is clever. He puts a sign on a building that has the word "church" written on it. And most people "naively" think that they are going to "church".

I guess we are conditioned by signs. But Jesus says that an evil and adulterous generation seek after "signs" (and wonders)

I guess you take yourself a little too seriously. I used the word church to be grammatically correct. Context makes it clear what I was referring to.

 

[Latour]

I guess you take yourself a little too seriously. I used the word church to be grammatically correct. Context makes it clear what I was referring to.

Should we always take signs to mean something truthful? I mean there is a devil prowling around deceiving the whole world and all. The way people accept things is as if there was no knowledge of evil being in the world.

 

[Noose]

490 years. But not from 0 AD.

The 490 years was to accomplish:

to finishd transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place

So we are not yet there by far.

 

[trofimus]

The 490 years was to accomplish:

to finishd transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place

So we are not yet there by far.

It was not 490 from 0 AD. In 33AD it was accomplished, but the beginning of the time scale was 490 years before.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

The 490 years was to accomplish:

to finishd transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place

So we are not yet there by far.

All of that has been accomplished. The 490 years ended 3.5 years after Christ's death.

 

[Noose]

It was not 490 from 0 AD. In 33AD it was accomplished, but the beginning of the time scale was 490 years before.

All of that has been accomplished. The 490 years ended 3.5 years after Christ's death.

Dan 9: 27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’h In the middle of the ‘seven’i he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the templej he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.

The end of the 70*7s only comes when antichrist is defeated.
I know more on this and in case you want learn, let me know.

 

[trofimus]

Dan 9: 27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’h In the middle of the ‘seven’i he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the templej he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.

The end of the 70*7s only comes when antichrist is defeated.
I know more on this and in case you want learn, let me know.

Dan 9:27 is about Christ, not about antichrist.

Your translation clearly believes its about antichrist, thats why it translates it in that way.

 

[NayborBear]

Acts tells us the church at Jerusalem met daily.
The churches Paul taught evidently met on a regular basis.
We are taught in Hebrews that we are not to forsake assembling.

One poster on this forum stated he had not been to church (assembled) for seven years.
How many others on this forum fail to assemble on a regular basis?
How many will admit it?
How do you justify your failure?

I for one assemble as often as possible.

I agree with the "assembling" Paul was speaking of. But did not those early churches "assemble" in various "locations?" And not always in the same house, where 1 grenade will get you all? Making "easy pickin's" for an enemy? Not knowing how "perfect" (mature) believer you are, nor how "Biblically Literate" you are, Riddle me this? Save for Jesus' coming, teaching, being crucified, and resurrected from the dead? What HAS changed from the days of Elijah, when he cried out to God, that "ALL your Priests are DEAD!" "And NOW, they're COMING for ME!"

One answer, would be "APOSTASY!" The book of Jude attests to this! (and) THAT, was 2,000 YEARS ago! How much MORE rampant, not to mention "subtle" has this apostasy become, SINCE then! As satan realizes just how SHORT his time remaining IS? It is HARD to NOT notice the SPEED the "falling away", and "drifting" churches of stone, have taken. Reflecting each ones relative, and unfortunate, permanent locations, within each ones geographic location. WHEREVER that particular location may be!

Where ARE the Shepherds, coming forth from (so called) Higher Institutions of learning? Blind! And, in a "ditch!" Waiting with baited breath, to lead more in! Meaning, "Love", is the GREATEST of the fruit of the Spirit! But, what is "love" WITHOUT the "rest" of the fruit of the Spirit? It's BLIND! That's what it is! Quantity, is what these churches of stone are so want in pursuing. But, what do you get with 3,000 stoney grounded believers? You got "GOD In A Box!" That's what you got! Decieveing themselves and everyone around them. Perpetuating there "wholly saved" message, of "Just BELIEVE!" "You don't HAVE to "understand", the Word of God!" "We're going to "fly away!"

If this is what you wish? What can I say? It's NOT for me though!

It's like trying to explain to a "socially progressive liberal", that....well?...here! A "picture" speaks a thousand words!

 

[Noose]

Dan 9:27 is about Christ, not about antichrist.

Your translation clearly believes its about antichrist, thats why it translates it in that way.

Dan 9: 26 After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.g The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. 27He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’h In the middle of the ‘seven’i he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the templej he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.

It's not about translations but understanding. From the second part of verse 26 all the way to the end is about antichrist. The one that puts and end to sacrifice and offering is always the antichrist, not Christ.

Dan 11:30..Then he will turn back and rage against the holy covenant and do damage. So he will return and show favor to those who forsake the holy covenant. 31His forces will rise up and desecrate the temple fortress. They will abolish the daily sacrifice and set up the abomination of desolation. 32With flattery he will corrupt those who violate the covenant, but the people who know their God will firmly resist him.

Dan 8: 11 It magnified itself, even to the Prince of the host; it removed His daily sacrifice and overthrew the place of His sanctuary. 12And on account of rebellion, the host and the daily sacrifice were given over to the horn, and it flung truth to the ground and prospered in whatever it did.

It is not the topic of discussion but i know what i'm talking about.

 

[trofimus]

Dan 9: 26 After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.g The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. 27He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’h In the middle of the ‘seven’i he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the templej he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.

It's not about translations but understanding. From the second part of verse 26 all the way to the end is about antichrist. The one that puts and end to sacrifice and offering is always the antichrist, not Christ.

Dan 11:30..Then he will turn back and rage against the holy covenant and do damage. So he will return and show favor to those who forsake the holy covenant. 31His forces will rise up and desecrate the temple fortress. They will abolish the daily sacrifice and set up the abomination of desolation. 32With flattery he will corrupt those who violate the covenant, but the people who know their God will firmly resist him.

Dan 8: 11 It magnified itself, even to the Prince of the host; it removed His daily sacrifice and overthrew the place of His sanctuary. 12And on account of rebellion, the host and the daily sacrifice were given over to the horn, and it flung truth to the ground and prospered in whatever it did.

It is not the topic of discussion but i know what i'm talking about.

After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. - crucifixion of Christ

The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. - Titus or Christ

And [in] one week [he] shall establish the covenant with many - Christ and the new covenant, from 30-37 AD

and in the midst of the week my sacrifice and drink-offering shall be taken away - the Old Covenant was set aside

and on the temple shall be the abomination of desolations until the end of time - 70AD (Titus) till the end of the world.

 

[Noose]

After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. - crucifixion of Christ

The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. - Titus or Christ

And [in] one week [he] shall establish the covenant with many - Christ and the new covenant, from 30-37 AD

and in the midst of the week my sacrifice and drink-offering shall be taken away - the Old Covenant was set aside

and on the temple shall be the abomination of desolations until the end of time - 70AD (Titus) till the end of the world.

Definitely wrong.

to finishd transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place

Not even close. It's not about Titus or any human- it's about antichrist, he is the one that takes away the daily sacrifice, not Christ:

Dan 11:30..Then he will turn back and rage against the holy covenant and do damage. So he will return and show favor to those who forsake the holy covenant. 31His forces will rise up and desecrate the temple fortress. They will abolish the daily sacrifice and set up the abomination of desolation. 32With flattery he will corrupt those who violate the covenant, but the people who know their God will firmly resist him.

Dan 8: 11 It magnified itself, even to the Prince of the host; it removed His daily sacrifice and overthrew the place of His sanctuary. 12And on account of rebellion, the host and the daily sacrifice were given over to the horn, and it flung truth to the ground and prospered in whatever it did.

 

[trofimus]

it's about antichrist, he is the one that takes away the daily sacrifice, not Christ:

There is no daily sacrifice for 2000 years already. And it was not any future antichrist who made it stop.

It was Christ - theologically and Titus - by force.