Speaking in tongues

[Waggles]

The Day of Pentecost when the first 120 disciples all spoke forth in tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance
is the first example of the gift of interpretation.
They spoke in tongues and heard this as interpretation into their respective languages.
Note the significance of the number 17 also.

 

[shrume]

The Day of Pentecost when the first 120 disciples all spoke forth in tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance
is the first example of the gift of interpretation.
They spoke in tongues and heard this as interpretation into their respective languages.
Note the significance of the number 17 also.

No it isn't.

The manifestation of interpretation of tongues is when the person who speaks in tongues gives the interpretation. There was no manifestation of interpretation on the day of Pentecost. The languages the apostles were speaking were the actual languages of other people present.

 

[NotImportant]

I'll tell you in what to rejoice.
Rejoice not in all these gifts!
Rejoice that your name is written in the book of the Living !!!
Rejoice that you are acknowledged by the Living True God of Israel!

It's One Spirit giving all gifts as He sees pleasing.

 

[NotImportant]

And do not be bothered by God haters and people that mock His Power, the One giving things not seen nor heard of before.
They seeing do not see and hearing do not understand, speaking out of their own mind and hearts never waiting upon the Lord.

 

[shrume]

I'll tell you in what to rejoice.
Rejoice not in all these gifts!
Rejoice that your name is written in the book of the Living !!!
Rejoice that you are acknowledged by the Living True God of Israel!

It's One Spirit giving all gifts as He sees pleasing.

Yep. Salvation is the principle thing. Without salvation, everything is futility.

 

[DJ2]

Discussions such as this are amazing.

Unless the person claiming to speak in "tongues" can show a reason to believe their utterances are more then simple babble, there is little reason to invoke scripture into the debate. IOW, prove a supernatural event even happened before debating if the event is of God.

 

[notuptome]

Discussions such as this are amazing.

Unless the person claiming to speak in "tongues" can show a reason to believe their utterances are more then simple babble, there is little reason to invoke scripture into the debate. IOW, prove a supernatural event even happened before debating if the event is of God.

Cafeteria Christians. Pick and choose what you will believe and discard what you do not choose to believe.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[shrume]

Discussions such as this are amazing.

Unless the person claiming to speak in "tongues" can show a reason to believe their utterances are more then simple babble, there is little reason to invoke scripture into the debate. IOW, prove a supernatural event even happened before debating if the event is of God.

How are you going to prove if someone's tongue is legit or not? There are many human languages that are "dead". Also, tongues can be languages of angels. How are you going to prove that?

 

[shrume]

Cafeteria Christians. Pick and choose what you will believe and discard what you do not choose to believe.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Roger chooses not to believe this:

1 Cor 14:
5) I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Or rather, he explains it away by claiming that tongues and prophesy ceased.

Poof! Off the hook.

 

[DJ2]

Cafeteria Christians. Pick and choose what you will believe and discard what you do not choose to believe.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Agreed. A quite common mode of thinking from people who should be lovers of truth.

 

[Nehemiah6]

If you took half a minute to check out the context, you would see that I was CLEARLY responding to another contributor, and the context of that conversation was about instances of tongue-speaking AFTER Acts 2.

Do you really believe that the gift of tongues after Acts 2 was any different? There is absolutely no reason or evidence to believe that. Indeed Paul makes it clear in 1 Cor 14 that tongues are a sign for unbelieving Jews, just as they were a sign on the day of Pentecost that God was behind the Gospel.

 

[notuptome]

Roger chooses not to believe this:

1 Cor 14:
5) I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Or rather, he explains it away by claiming that tongues and prophesy ceased.

Poof! Off the hook.

Perhaps it is better said that I choose to believe truth over others efforts to make what they believe conform to scripture.

Too many proofs in scripture to accept that those who claim to speak in biblical tongues actually do.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Nehemiah6]

1 Cor 14:
5) I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

What is Paul saying here in modern parlance?

"Christians, I would be delighted if you all spoke in tongues (which is really not feasible, since not all will speak in tongues, as I have already told you).

However, if you all prophesied, it would be FAR BETTER. In fact the one who prophesies would be deemed 'greater' (since the gift of prophesy is greater than the gift of tongues).

At the same time, if you do speak in tongues in the assembly, please make sure that you interpret what you have said. Since that is the only way that all the gathered Christians will benefit".

 

[shrume]

What is Paul saying here in modern parlance?

"Christians, I would be delighted if you all spoke in tongues (which is really not feasible, since not all will speak in tongues, as I have already told you).

Actually, he is saying "Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. " And elsewhere, he says:
Eph 6:
18) Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

However, if you all prophesied, it would be FAR BETTER. In fact the one who prophesies would be deemed 'greater' (since the gift of prophesy is greater than the gift of tongues).

There is no such thing as "the gift of prophesy" or the "gift of tongues". Both are manifestations of the gift of the Holy Spirit. And the manifestation of prophesy is "better" "except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying. "

Read the whole verse, Nehemiah...

At the same time, if you do speak in tongues in the assembly, please make sure that you interpret what you have said. Since that is the only way that all the gathered Christians will benefit".

Right!

 

[Nehemiah6]

Actually, he is saying "Now I want you all to speak in tongues...

He cannot possibly be saying that, since Paul already said: Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? Which means "all DO NOT speak with tongues".

There is no such thing as "the gift of prophesy" or the "gift of tongues".

Well the Bible refutes that quite easily, since manifestations = gifts.

Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant...

Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit...

To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

 

[Waggles]

The manifestation of interpretation of tongues is when the person who speaks in tongues gives the interpretation. There was no manifestation of interpretation on the day of Pentecost. The languages the apostles were speaking were the actual languages of other people present.

Wrong
they spoke in tongues - 120 people all at the same time
Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them
speak in his own language. Acts 2:6
This is the miraculous gift of interpretation and again right from the beginning a sign of what was to come -
diversities of tongues, interpretations, prophecies.

 

[Waggles]

Cafeteria Christians. Pick and choose what you will believe and discard what you do not choose to believe.

Well that is the kettle calling the pot black.

 

[shrume]

Perhaps it is better said that I choose to believe truth over others efforts to make what they believe conform to scripture.

Too many proofs in scripture to accept that those who claim to speak in biblical tongues actually do.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Can you name one? Just one...

 

[shrume]

He cannot possibly be saying that, since Paul already said: Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? Which means "all DO NOT speak with tongues".

While it's true that not all do speak in tongues, that does not change the meaning of verse 5: "Now I want you all to speak in tongues".

And remember, the overall context is in meetings. In meetings, not everyone does prophesy, speak in tongues and interpret, etc.

Well the Bible refutes that quite easily, since manifestations = gifts.

That's not true. Check any dictionary.

Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant...

Note that the word "gifts" is in italics. It was added. The word is "pneumatikos", and it means spiritual things, or spiritual matters.

Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit...

That's right, there are diversities of gifts. But what does verse 7 say?

1 Cor 12:
7) But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

There are diversities of gifts, differences of administrations, diversities of operations, but the manifestation of the spirit is given to EVERY man (Christian).

To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

Again, the overall context is meetings. Different people do different things. If each person could operate only one manifestation, then Paul contradicts himself in 1 Cor 14, where he says the person who speaks in tongues is to be the one to interpret. And he is also to covet to prophesy.

 

[shrume]

Wrong
they spoke in tongues - 120 people all at the same time

I believe it was 12. The gift of the HS was initially given to the 12 apostles. But it's not worth forming a new denomination over...

I do agree they were all speaking in tongues at the same time.

Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them
speak in his own language. Acts 2:6
This is the miraculous gift of interpretation and again right from the beginning a sign of what was to come -
diversities of tongues, interpretations, prophecies.

Please read 1 Cor 14. It says that when a person speaks in tongues in public, he is to interpret. The others present on the day of Pentecost understanding the languages the apostles were speaking is not the manifestation of interpretation of tongues. Interpretation of tongues is when a Christian speaks in tongues, then speaks the interpretation. That did not happen on the day of Pentecost.