GOD'S SABBATH AND THE REAL TRUTH OF COL 2:14-17 WHO DO WE BELIEVE GOD or MAN?

[beta]

I do not understand why people still argue about clean and unclean meat. Acts 11v9 clearly states ''what God has cleansed call not thou unclean'.
However....some are not yet prepared to accept this.... so to THEM some meat is still unclean and sin to eat. But it is not a point of argument for GOD has already decided !!!

 

[lightbearer]

You're teaching is so old covenant.

The new covenant command is to always cease from works of the flesh. In that way we enter into his rest, of which the weekly sabbath is but a shadow.

No; HIS Law; HIS Word; HIS Christ is in our heart, in our minds and in our mouths. This the rest which enter into. And He that enters into this rest; the GOSPEL ceases from their own works as GOD did from HIS. As recorded in Genesis 2, GOD rested from physical work on the Seventh Day so we rest from physical work on the Seventh Day.

"As GOD did from HIS" is a direct comparison. GOD rested from Physical work not Spiritual.

 

[lightbearer]

I do not understand why people still argue about clean and unclean meat. Acts 11v9 clearly states ''what God has cleansed call not thou unclean'.
However....some are not yet prepared to accept this.... so to THEM some meat is still unclean and sin to eat. But it is not a point of argument for GOD has already decided !!!

The text actually reads what God has cleansed call thou not Common. No mention of the unclean anywhere only the common.

 

[beta]

The text actually reads what God has cleansed call thou not Common. No mention of the unclean anywhere only the common.

OK....but in v8 we see that common or unclean imply the same....how do you read ? different ?

 

[lightbearer]

OK....but in v8 we see that common or unclean imply the same....how do you read ? different ?

Yes. Let us look at the text in the Greek.
ὁ G3588 T-NSM
δὲ But G1161 CONJ
Πέτρος Peter G4074 N-NSM
εἶπεν Said, G2036 V-2AAI-3S
Μηδαμῶς In No Wise, G3365 ADV
κύριε Lord; G2962 N-VSM
ὅτι For G3754 CONJ
οὐδέποτε Never G3763 ADV
ἔφαγον Did I Eat G5315 V-2AAI-1S
πᾶν Anything G3956 A-ASN
κοινὸν Common G2839 A-ASN
ἢ Or G2228 PRT
ἀκάθαρτον Unclean. G169 A-ASN
(Act 10:14 TRi)

Let's look at the Greek word ἢ Or G2228 PRT. It is a Disjunctive Particle. By difinition It expresses a choice between two mutually exclusive possibilities. They lack any connection; they are exclusive.

From Strong's entry:
G2228
ἤ
ē
ay
A primary particle of distinction between two connected terms;

Couple that with the post to which you responded. Which brings to our attention that GOD never mentions the unclean only the common.


Keep in mind also that which was shared to Posthuman. All manner of beast were being offered to Peter. That would include those that were considered clean also. He could of chosen to kill and eat any but he chose none.

So what made the clean animals common to Peter?

For one they were all intermingling amongst one another.

I got to go Beta, I am out of time. GOD willing I will talk to you later.

Much LOVE to you and all,
LB

 

[justpassinthrough]

The Command is to rest. The Sabbath is a THE day of Rest. Jesus mentions the Sabbath quite often. No where did He abolish it. He observed it, so we observe it. Because He is the Vine and we are the branches. And it is He that works in us both to will and do HIS good pleasure.

I can agree that the Sabbath was made for man to rest.


I never said Jesus abolished the ten commandments.


What I have said is the law of Moses was abolished and the WAY the Sabbath is observed has changed, in which it is no longer kept the way the children of Israel kept it while under the law of Moses.


IOW, we don't stone people to death for picking up sticks to kindle a fire on the Sabbath.


What I have asked for from the "Sabbath Keepers" is scripture from Jesus or the Apostles that command the Church to gather on the Sabbath to worship Jesus; Making it a sin, not to come together on the Sabbath to worship.

Or as some teach, making it a sin to gather on Sunday or any other day of the week to worship.




JPT

 

[Studyman]

Psalms 145:8-9
The LORD [is] gracious, and full of compassion; slow to anger, and of great mercy.
The LORD [is] good to all: and His tender mercies [are] over all His works.

Thank God for these Word's. But God also inspired other Word's. Should we ignore or reject them?

Psalms145:
17 The LORD is righteous in all his ways, and holy in all his works.
18 The LORD is nigh unto all them that call upon him, to all that call upon him in truth.
19 He will fulfil the desire of them that fear him: he also will hear their cry, and will save them.
20 The LORD preserveth all them that love him: but all the wicked will he destroy.

Ps. 119:
12 Blessed art thou, O LORD: teach me thy statutes.
13 With my lips have I declared all the judgments of thy mouth.
14 I have rejoiced in the way of thy testimonies, as much as in all riches.
15 I will meditate in thy precepts, and have respect unto thy ways.
16 I will delight myself in thy statutes: I will not forget thy word.
172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

 

[gb9]

I can agree that the Sabbath was made for man to rest.


I never said Jesus abolished the ten commandments.


What I have said is the law of Moses was abolished and the WAY the Sabbath is observed has changed, in which it is no longer kept the way the children of Israel kept it while under the law of Moses.


IOW, we don't stone people to death for picking up sticks to kindle a fire on the Sabbath.


What I have asked for from the "Sabbath Keepers" is scripture from Jesus or the Apostles that command the Church to gather on the Sabbath to worship Jesus; Making it a sin, not to come together on the Sabbath to worship.

Or as some teach, making it a sin to gather on Sunday or any other day of the week to worship.




JPT

the reason they have not given you a Scripture for N.T. Sabbath keeping is- there is not one. they just cobble together out of context verses to make a case for something that does not exist.

 

[justpassinthrough]

the reason they have not given you a Scripture for N.T. Sabbath keeping is- there is not one. they just cobble together out of context verses to make a case for something that does not exist.

Of course.


The Sabbath was made for man... to have a day of rest.


The weekly Sabbath points to the rest to come, when Jesus returns and destroys all the enemies of God's kingdom.


We will then enjoy the prophesied rest with our Lord for 1000 years, which is the 7th prophetic Day of rest.





JPT

 

[beta]

Yes. Let us look at the text in the Greek.
ὁ G3588 T-NSM
δὲ But G1161 CONJ
Πέτρος Peter G4074 N-NSM
εἶπεν Said, G2036 V-2AAI-3S
Μηδαμῶς In No Wise, G3365 ADV
κύριε Lord; G2962 N-VSM
ὅτι For G3754 CONJ
οὐδέποτε Never G3763 ADV
ἔφαγον Did I Eat G5315 V-2AAI-1S
πᾶν Anything G3956 A-ASN
κοινὸν Common G2839 A-ASN
ἢ Or G2228 PRT
ἀκάθαρτον Unclean. G169 A-ASN
(Act 10:14 TRi)

Let's look at the Greek word ἢ Or G2228 PRT. It is a Disjunctive Particle. By difinition It expresses a choice between two mutually exclusive possibilities. They lack any connection; they are exclusive.

From Strong's entry:
G2228
ἤ
ē
ay
A primary particle of distinction between two connected terms;

Couple that with the post to which you responded. Which brings to our attention that GOD never mentions the unclean only the common.


Keep in mind also that which was shared to Posthuman. All manner of beast were being offered to Peter. That would include those that were considered clean also. He could of chosen to kill and eat any but he chose none.

So what made the clean animals common to Peter?

For one they were all intermingling amongst one another.

I got to go Beta, I am out of time. GOD willing I will talk to you later.

Much LOVE to you and all,
LB

I think we ought to stick with scripture....PETER himself said 'common OR unclean' which means 'the same' in v8 ....and you can't get more scriptural no matter what the GREEK says....sorry friend, that is just looking at human wisdom.
Don't think I am against OT food-laws, kept them strictly myself for 32 years before Yashua explained the spiritual meaning behind it which was now being introduced in the NT.
As I said, not all have yet reached that stage and still need the teaching of the OT....that is OK FOR THEM until they are ready to move on !

 

[Studyman]

You're teaching is so old covenant.

The new covenant command is to always cease from works of the flesh. In that way we enter into his rest, of which the weekly sabbath is but a shadow.

I do not believe that mainstream Christian preaching that God's Words are "works of the Flesh". I think this is a huge deception perpetrated on those who listen to man and not God for instruction in Righteousness. Also, I believe we should get our knowledge about the New Covenant from the Author of the New Covenant, not from religious men who call God's Word, "works of the Flesh">

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

There is no mention of the definition of sin, including defiling His Sabbath, being altered, re-defined, amended, omitted in any way.

How a person gets from this verse describing the New Covenant, to God's Law is a "Work of the Flesh" we are now to "Cease From" is absurd in my opinion.

And yet, there is an entire religion with thousands of differing sects all who "come in Christ's name, that preach exactly that.

Were we not specifically warned about this very thing?

And I might note that only those religions whose religious traditions include rejecting God's Sabbath are the ones who promote this teaching. Jesus never even suggested such a thing, He actually taught just the opposite.

 

[beta]

I can agree that the Sabbath was made for man to rest.


I never said Jesus abolished the ten commandments.


What I have said is the law of Moses was abolished and the WAY the Sabbath is observed has changed, in which it is no longer kept the way the children of Israel kept it while under the law of Moses.


IOW, we don't stone people to death for picking up sticks to kindle a fire on the Sabbath.


What I have asked for from the "Sabbath Keepers" is scripture from Jesus or the Apostles that command the Church to gather on the Sabbath to worship Jesus; Making it a sin, not to come together on the Sabbath to worship.

Or as some teach, making it a sin to gather on Sunday or any other day of the week to worship.




JPT

Since the SABBATH is included in the 10 Commandments which are spiritual, holy, just and good Rom 7, and NOT abolished Mat 5v17, would it not mean it is still to be observed ?
Sunday is referred to as the first day of the week and therefore a 'working-day. There is no Word from GOD to assemble on THAT day....have you a scripture ? I will give you one to say we are to 'assemble before the Lord on the 7th day sabbath Lev 23v3...AND Lk 4v16 where JESUS/Yashua attended Synagugue/church on the Sabbath day as was His custom....a REGULAR event.

 

[Studyman]

Of course.


The Sabbath was made for man... to have a day of rest.


The weekly Sabbath points to the rest to come, when Jesus returns and destroys all the enemies of God's kingdom.


We will then enjoy the prophesied rest with our Lord for 1000 years, which is the 7th prophetic Day of rest.

JPT

Until then we are to "Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it Holy". And it was created for us as a sign between us and God. And the Word which became Flesh reminded us of it's importance through Isaiah.

Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

God Sabbath is about Loving and Honoring Him. The First and greatest Commandment.

Jesus promised:

23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Many believe in a god who didn't not say these things.

Jer. 6:16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.

The Bible certainly teaches we are to separate ourselves unto God and His Word, not the word of religious man. And there can be no doubt the Bible teaches were are to honor HIS Sabbath.

Man? No, man does not teach this, but the Word of God most certainly does.

 

[justpassinthrough]

ince the SABBATH is included in the 10 Commandments which are spiritual, holy, just and good Rom 7, and NOT abolished Mat 5v17, would it not mean it is still to be observed ?

Observed in the way God originally gave it before the law of Moses was added.

Which is the Sabbath was made for man to rest one day a week.


Is it right for those who work in full time ministry, serving the Church, to work on the Sabbath to has a Church service, to honor a man made command, when the Sabbath was made for man to rest?



JPT

 

[justpassinthrough]

Until then we are to "Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it Holy". And it was created for us as a sign between us and God. And the Word which became Flesh reminded us of it's importance through Isaiah.

Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

God Sabbath is about Loving and Honoring Him. The First and greatest Commandment.

Jesus promised:

23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Many believe in a god who didn't not say these things.

Jer. 6:16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.

The Bible certainly teaches we are to separate ourselves unto God and His Word, not the word of religious man. And there can be no doubt the Bible teaches were are to honor HIS Sabbath.

Man? No, man does not teach this, but the Word of God most certainly does.

How does the New Testament teach us to observe the Sabbath under the New Covenant?


Is it right for those who work in full time ministry, serving the Church, to work on the Sabbath to has a Church service, to honor a man made command, when the Sabbath was made for man to rest?


Can you see how hypocritical it is to declare that the Church is commanded to observe the Sabbath, then turn around and command it;s leaders to work on the Sabbath to have a Church service?



JPT

 

[Studyman]

I do not understand why people still argue about clean and unclean meat. Acts 11v9 clearly states ''what God has cleansed call not thou unclean'.
However....some are not yet prepared to accept this.... so to THEM some meat is still unclean and sin to eat. But it is not a point of argument for GOD has already decided !!!

I know God has cleansed some men, and that eating with unwashed hands wasn't a Law, and didn't defile a man. I also understand that disobedience and rebellion comes from within a man and defiles them. But when did He destroy the difference between what He created for food and what He created for other things? I wish it were so, but I can't find where swine was ever considered clean for food. Not then, not now, and not in the future Isaiah describes.

Did I miss something?

 

[posthuman]

Is it right for those who work in full time ministry, serving the Church, to work on the Sabbath to has a Church service, to honor a man made command, when the Sabbath was made for man to rest?

haven't you read in the Law that the priests on Sabbath duty in the temple desecrate the Sabbath and yet are innocent?
(Matthew 12:5) ​

​

you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
(1 Peter 2:5)​

​

But I tell you, something greater than the temple is here.
(Matthew 12:6) ​

 

[posthuman]

in the Law, the service of the priests in the temple was greater than the sabbath ((re: Matthew 12:5, Numbers 28:9 etc)), that is, it took precedence over ritual cessation of work.
also in the Law, circumcision was greater than the sabbath ((re: John 7:23, Leviticus 12:3, etc)), that is, it took precedence over ritual cessation of work.

the temple in Jerusalem, the duties of the Levite priesthood, the sacrifices of blood and grain, physical circumcision - which of these remain? what does it mean that in the Law they all have precedence over Exodus 20:10, but none of them are here now?

how does this testify of Christ and glorify Him?

 

[posthuman]

I can't find where swine was ever considered clean for food.

Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you;​

even as the green herb have I given you all things.
(Genesis 9:3) ​

 

[posthuman]

All manner of beast were being offered to Peter. That would include those that were considered clean also. He could of chosen to kill and eat any but he chose none.

why does Peter say "not so" three times if what God was telling him to do was pick out clean animals? the passage doesn't seem to make any sense if Peter doesn't have the impression he's being told to kill and eat 'unclean' animals.

((how does this guy receive a direct command from God 3 times in a row and say no?? lol wow, Pete. you not remember that rooster?? "feed my sheep" ring a bell?? he is so like us))

it's not like he wasn't hungry -- Acts 10:10 goes out of its way to specifically include the detail that he was.
why would God make sure to let us know that Peter was hungry while this happened to him? God chose this detail to be significant.