Power to forgive sins on behalf of Christ

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jameen

jameen

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#1
Feb 5, 2018
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Manila
#1
If the Roman Catholic Church explains that the power to forgive sins was inherited from the apostles who were given by Christ to do it and it was passed to its priests up to the Pope and it will be done by Sacrament of Confession

Then the questions are:

How do Bible based groups forgive sins on behalf of Christ like the apostles who were given the power from Christ?

Do some of them believe that their ministers/pastors were given by Christ to forgive sins on his behalf?
 
HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

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#2
Sep 4, 2012
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#2
No man has power to forgive another's sins on GOD's behalf. Peter and the other apostles were given the authority to sanction water baptism into remission of sins.
 
H

Hungry

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#3
Nov 26, 2012
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#3
Where did He give that authority?
 
jameen

jameen

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HeRoseFromTheDead said:
No man has power to forgive another's sins on GOD's behalf. Peter and the other apostles were given the authority to sanction water baptism into remission of sins.
Click to expand...
You forgot this verse brother!

John 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.

It's clear that Jesus gave the apostles the power to forgive sins on his behalf and Jesus is God too.

Where did He give that authority?
Click to expand...
Read the whole John Chapter 20 and you'll know.
 
Deade

Deade

Called of God
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Dec 17, 2017
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#6
Well jameen, we are allowed to assume God will back our words on physical and spiritual healing. The scripture here says they are the same thing.

Luke 5:20-24: "And when he saw their faith, he said, “Man, your sins are forgiven you.” And the scribes and the Pharisees began to question, saying, “Who is this who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins but God alone?” When Jesus perceived their thoughts, he answered them, “Why do you question in your hearts? Which is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven you,’ or to say, ‘Rise and walk’? But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”—he said to the man who was paralyzed—“I say to you, rise, pick up your bed and go home.”"

The same is implied here.
Luke 8:48: "And he said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace.”"

And this looks like it is for believers, today.
John 14:12: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

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D

Depleted

Guest
#7
#7
jameen said:
If the Roman Catholic Church explains that the power to forgive sins was inherited from the apostles who were given by Christ to do it and it was passed to its priests up to the Pope and it will be done by Sacrament of Confession

Then the questions are:

How do Bible based groups forgive sins on behalf of Christ like the apostles who were given the power from Christ?

Do some of them believe that their ministers/pastors were given by Christ to forgive sins on his behalf?
Click to expand...
How do atheists come up with "People die, so there is no God?"

I figure I'd ask you, because you're asking people who aren't Catholics what Catholics think, so why not ask a Christian what atheists think?
 
HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

Senior Member
#8
Sep 4, 2012
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#8
jameen said:
You forgot this verse brother!

John 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.

It's clear that Jesus gave the apostles the power to forgive sins on his behalf and Jesus is God too.
Click to expand...
No I didn't forget it. That's exactly the verse I am referring to. Peter and the apostles were given authority to remit peoples' sins by authorizing water baptism for them.

​Now [when they] heard [this], they were pierced to the heart and said to Peter and the other apostles, “What should we do, men [and] brothers?” And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:37-38

So he ordered [that] they be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay for several days. Acts 10:48​
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#9
Jul 18, 2017
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#9
jameen said:
John 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.

It's clear that Jesus gave the apostles the power to forgive sins on his behalf and Jesus is God too.
Click to expand...
This is true, but must be properly interpreted and understood.

As stated in the King James Bible: Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

1. This authority to "remit" and "retain" sins was given exclusively to the apostles (and only the ten who were there at that time). We do not know if Thomas was later on given this authority, but it is more than likely that he was.

2. This was a part of apostolic authority within the churches in order to make judgments about sins and deal with them under Christ's delegated authority. So it was comparable to making the apostles *judges* (magistrates) within the churches. They will be judges over the twelve tribes of Israel in the Millennium and beyond.

3. This had nothing to do with the forgiveness of sins, which only God can do when sinners come to Him for salvation.

4. We see two examples in Scripture as to how Peter applied this apostolic authority -- Ananias and Sapphira and Simon the Sorcerer. We also see Paul exercising this authority in the church at Corinth.

5. The Roman Catholic notion of giving priests the authority to grant *absolution* is totally unscriptural and false. Once the apostles passed away, this authority was withdraw. and as we can see, it was rarely exercised.
 
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OneFaith

OneFaith

Senior Member
#10
Sep 5, 2016
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#10
jameen said:
If the Roman Catholic Church explains that the power to forgive sins was inherited from the apostles who were given by Christ to do it and it was passed to its priests up to the Pope and it will be done by Sacrament of Confession

Then the questions are:

How do Bible based groups forgive sins on behalf of Christ like the apostles who were given the power from Christ?

Do some of them believe that their ministers/pastors were given by Christ to forgive sins on his behalf?
Click to expand...

Such things died along with the apostles. After Revelation was complete there was no longer need for apostles or prophets, therefore no longer need for miracles to identify they were from God. We no longer need them to tell us what God says because we now have His complete Word to us. “And when completion comes what was incomplete will soon disappear.” (Soon=along with the apostles). The abilities given to the apostles are as gone as they are from the earth.
 
M

MattforJesus

Banned
#11
Apr 15, 2017
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#11
jameen said:
If the Roman Catholic Church explains that the power to forgive sins was inherited from the apostles who were given by Christ to do it and it was passed to its priests up to the Pope and it will be done by Sacrament of Confession

Then the questions are:

How do Bible based groups forgive sins on behalf of Christ like the apostles who were given the power from Christ?

Do some of them believe that their ministers/pastors were given by Christ to forgive sins on his behalf?
Click to expand...
No one can forgive sins but God alone,and Jesus is God manifest in the flesh so He could forgive sins,which the Pharisees that did not believe in Jesus said,who can forgive sins but God alone.

The Bible says there is one God,and one mediator between God and men,the man Christ Jesus,not a priest interceding on our behalf and forgiving us of our sins,and if we sin we have an advocate with the Father,Jesus Christ the righteous.

All sins are to be repented of to God and only He can forgive sins,for we offended Him not a person,although we can forgive people that have offended us,but it is not off their record until they ask God for forgiveness for offending us.

The question is if a person tells a priest their sins,and they believe he intercedes on their behalf,and takes the sins to the Lord,and he forgives them,are the sins truly forgiven because they confessed them to a priest,and not to God.
 
jameen

jameen

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#12
Feb 5, 2018
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#12
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
No I didn't forget it. That's exactly the verse I am referring to. Peter and the apostles were given authority to remit peoples' sins by authorizing water baptism for them.
​Now [when they] heard [this], they were pierced to the heart and said to Peter and the other apostles, “What should we do, men [and] brothers?” And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:37-38

So he ordered [that] they be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay for several days. Acts 10:48​
Click to expand...
What if a Christian after being baptized sins again? will the apostles baptize him again?

No need for apostles to forgive as long that erring Christian admitted his guilt?
 
HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

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Sep 4, 2012
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#13
jameen said:
What if a Christian after being baptized sins again? will the apostles baptize him again?

No need for apostles to forgive as long that erring Christian admitted his guilt?
Click to expand...
He confesses to the high priest. End of story.
 
Dino246

Dino246

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#14
Jun 30, 2015
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#14
OneFaith said:

Such things died along with the apostles. After Revelation was complete there was no longer need for apostles or prophets, therefore no longer need for miracles to identify they were from God. We no longer need them to tell us what God says because we now have His complete Word to us. “And when completion comes what was incomplete will soon disappear.” (Soon=along with the apostles). The abilities given to the apostles are as gone as they are from the earth.
Click to expand...
Perhaps you should quote the whole passage rather than just the part that supports your assertion. Here it is, from 1 Corinthians...

[SUP]8 [/SUP]Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.[SUP]9 [/SUP]For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

Hmmm... no mention of miracles.
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#15
May 17, 2013
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#15
jameen said:
If the Roman Catholic Church explains that the power to forgive sins was inherited from the apostles who were given by Christ to do it and it was passed to its priests up to the Pope and it will be done by Sacrament of Confession

Then the questions are:

How do Bible based groups forgive sins on behalf of Christ like the apostles who were given the power from Christ?

Do some of them believe that their ministers/pastors were given by Christ to forgive sins on his behalf?
Click to expand...
This is a common misinterpretation and application of the passage.

Christ alone forgives sin. Peter's part like ours is to witness for Christ. Those who respond to the gospel as taught by Peter and the apostles by trusting in Christ have their sins forgiven. Those who do not die in their sins and are eternally condemned.

The keys given to Peter are the word of God. We have the word of God written down and call it our bible. It is the gospel that is the power of God unto salvation to all who believe. Not in men but in the word of God is the power to save. Christ revealed through the word of God by the Holy Spirit.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
M

Metternich

Senior Member
#16
Jan 13, 2018
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#16
Nehemiah6 said:
This is true, but must be properly interpreted and understood.

As stated in the King James Bible: Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

1. This authority to "remit" and "retain" sins was given exclusively to the apostles (and only the ten who were there at that time). We do not know if Thomas was later on given this authority, but it is more than likely that he was.

2. This was a part of apostolic authority within the churches in order to make judgments about sins and deal with them under Christ's delegated authority. So it was comparable to making the apostles *judges* (magistrates) within the churches. They will be judges over the twelve tribes of Israel in the Millennium and beyond.

3. This had nothing to do with the forgiveness of sins, which only God can do when sinners come to Him for salvation.

4. We see two examples in Scripture as to how Peter applied this apostolic authority -- Ananias and Sapphira and Simon the Sorcerer. We also see Paul exercising this authority in the church at Corinth.

5. The Roman Catholic notion of giving priests the authority to grant *absolution* is totally unscriptural and false. Once the apostles passed away, this authority was withdraw. and as we can see, it was rarely exercised.
Click to expand...
Was Matthias given the authority. It seems from Acts 1 that deceased apostles were replaced. It is not hard to imagine that as the numbers of Christians grew new men were elevated. I think Timothy was a bishop and Paul gives instruction for the qualifications of bishop. Why is it so hard to believe the authority to forgive sins was not passed on to new bishops.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#17
#17
ColoradoGal said:
John 20:23"If you forgive anyone's sins, their sins are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven."
Click to expand...

well, that would mean that we can forgive sins. can we?

if we can forgive sins, do we need a Savior?

doesn't add up
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#18
#18
The context of John 20:23 is that Jesus was speaking to the disciples (v. 19). He breathed on them to receive the Holy Spirit (v. 22). There is nothing in here about priests having the authority to forgive sins. There is nothing here (or anywhere else in the New Testament) about apostolic succession that says priests have the authority to forgive sins and that it is passed down. The Bible does mention appointing elders (Acts 14:23; Titus 1:5), and that the disciples of Jesus had special authority (Matt. 16:18).

It speaks of the laying on of hands to receive the Holy Spirit (Acts 8:19) as well as ordaining men to the ministry (1 Tim. 4:14; 2 Tim. 1:6; Titus 1:5). At best, the laying on of hands deals with ordination--not apostolic authority being passed down. After all, they were ordaining elders and not apostles; and it was the apostles who were given the authority by Christ to do miracles and write scripture. Nothing is said here about apostolic authority being passed down.


source
 
Deade

Deade

Called of God
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#19
Dino246 said:
Perhaps you should quote the whole passage rather than just the part that supports your assertion. Here it is, from 1 Corinthians...

[SUP]8 [/SUP]Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.[SUP]9 [/SUP]For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

Hmmm... no mention of miracles.
Click to expand...
In verse 10 where that which is perfect, is speaking of when we get to the kingdom of God. Just like Paul's looking through glass darkly. You are quoting from 1 Cor. 13. Verse 12, Paul talks of when this culminates.

boy-thank-you-smiley-emoticon.gif
 
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