Not By Works
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this person wants to put you under law. He rejects grace, run far away from him.. before he takes you down the wide gate path with him.
The above statement is what we call judgementalism, driven by a desire to
root out a problem they believe is in the body of Christ.
As with all vigilantis, they cannot face the truth of Jesus's words, only their
selected highlights.
It is too hard for believers to walk in purity, holiness and righteousness, that is
putting a burden on them of guilt, rather than declaring the truth, sin destroys
life and the heart and faith.
But in their mind they have created sin a day, work rest and play, you are saved
come what may.
Jesus calls us to be like Him. Not through our own works but through repentance,
confession and faith which leads to cleansing, purification and love.
It would appear they count such things as impossible and thereby evil. But this
means they have no faith in the cleansing ability of the cross, and the depth of
true repentance. But listen to believers who have come to faith. They know their
repentance is real and it is a walk into glory.
So the antagonism just astounds me, when it is all about walking in Jesus's ways.
I suggest they find it impossible to follow Jesus, which should be a real cause for
concern, not to change the meaning of scripture and there by condemn themselves.
The above statement is what we call judgementalism, driven by a desire to
root out a problem they believe is in the body of Christ.
As with all vigilantis, they cannot face the truth of Jesus's words, only their
selected highlights.
It is too hard for believers to walk in purity, holiness and righteousness, that is
putting a burden on them of guilt, rather than declaring the truth, sin destroys
life and the heart and faith.
But in their mind they have created sin a day, work rest and play, you are saved
come what may.
Jesus calls us to be like Him. Not through our own works but through repentance,
confession and faith which leads to cleansing, purification and love.
It would appear they count such things as impossible and thereby evil. But this
means they have no faith in the cleansing ability of the cross, and the depth of
true repentance. But listen to believers who have come to faith. They know their
repentance is real and it is a walk into glory.
So the antagonism just astounds me, when it is all about walking in Jesus's ways.
I suggest they find it impossible to follow Jesus, which should be a real cause for
concern, not to change the meaning of scripture and there by condemn themselves.
What convicts me about peoples positions?
They want so hard to believe believers are either one or the other types.
The problem is only God truly knows who are His and who are not, and commands
us not to search either out, rather walk with Him.
Sin should be confronted and displayed, but everything else covered in grace, love
and understanding.
So I could easily say, I believe in being saved by faith alone, which I do, except I
also accept people do appear to lose their faith. Why is it that this observation is
the cause of accusing others of unbelief unless the actual conversation is about
walking in love and purity, which they find themselves incapable of doing for 24hrs.
And we are talking people who have been in the church all their lives. Pretty sad
testimony of failure and lack of reconciliation with their own hearts. And these failures
to realise spiritual maturity want to slander anyone who actually walks in maturity and
faith, purity and holiness. Why? Because they are so so so so cynical and corrupt people
can only be corrupt or liars.
To the pure, all things are pure, but to those who are corrupted and do not believe, nothing is pure. In fact, both their minds and consciences are corrupted.
Titus 1:15
It is this that drives them, to try and convict anyone by harassment they are right.
The problem is they are just people living in unbelief, ignoring God and the beauty of
His law and precepts, and want to spread a condemning belief system.
They want so hard to believe believers are either one or the other types.
The problem is only God truly knows who are His and who are not, and commands
us not to search either out, rather walk with Him.
Sin should be confronted and displayed, but everything else covered in grace, love
and understanding.
So I could easily say, I believe in being saved by faith alone, which I do, except I
also accept people do appear to lose their faith. Why is it that this observation is
the cause of accusing others of unbelief unless the actual conversation is about
walking in love and purity, which they find themselves incapable of doing for 24hrs.
And we are talking people who have been in the church all their lives. Pretty sad
testimony of failure and lack of reconciliation with their own hearts. And these failures
to realise spiritual maturity want to slander anyone who actually walks in maturity and
faith, purity and holiness. Why? Because they are so so so so cynical and corrupt people
can only be corrupt or liars.
To the pure, all things are pure, but to those who are corrupted and do not believe, nothing is pure. In fact, both their minds and consciences are corrupted.
Titus 1:15
It is this that drives them, to try and convict anyone by harassment they are right.
The problem is they are just people living in unbelief, ignoring God and the beauty of
His law and precepts, and want to spread a condemning belief system.
E
Some people judge based on truth. That is actually what scripture calls us to do. Yet some people think they know the motive. And then they have to attack when they are confronted.
1. They call people names (vigilante) (but watch, He will do what he has done the past few years and blame shift, or refuse to acknowledge he has sinned)
2. They lie about what they Believe (Eg not only believes a child of God can walk in holiness, He can be pure and he can be righteous, Just ny by his own power. But by the power of God. He believes he walks with Christ because he is saved. But some people just refuse to acknowledge what others believe. But again he will blame shift and refuse to acknowledge his sin.
3. His issue is he does not understand what sin is, He thinks sin is only an overt act. That people can not sin in their minds, What he is doing is watering down Gods law. Then judging people who refuse to water down Gods law. And take God for what he means. He judges people who hold to a much more stringent law than he does. Then seems to want to insist we aremaking Gods law easier or rejecting it. He proves it every day when he lies about others (thou shalt not bare false witness is a command he does not follow. In fact he breaks it almost every day)
4. he again lies about them saying we reject the cleansing ability of the cross. Yet we teach God cleanses us completely. While he continues to insist he must clean himself up. (Yet again, He will not repent, but blame shift)
5. He ends like he acts astounded that people who believe God will COMPLETE the work God started when he saved a person. And he will never stop. When he himself believes God may not finish the job, and the people he once saved can still end up in hell. (Like the pharisee, He loves to puff his chest. WHile praising God he is not like the sinner)
As usual. He tries to sound smart, but he is blinded to the foolishness in his own thinking
1. They call people names (vigilante) (but watch, He will do what he has done the past few years and blame shift, or refuse to acknowledge he has sinned)
2. They lie about what they Believe (Eg not only believes a child of God can walk in holiness, He can be pure and he can be righteous, Just ny by his own power. But by the power of God. He believes he walks with Christ because he is saved. But some people just refuse to acknowledge what others believe. But again he will blame shift and refuse to acknowledge his sin.
3. His issue is he does not understand what sin is, He thinks sin is only an overt act. That people can not sin in their minds, What he is doing is watering down Gods law. Then judging people who refuse to water down Gods law. And take God for what he means. He judges people who hold to a much more stringent law than he does. Then seems to want to insist we aremaking Gods law easier or rejecting it. He proves it every day when he lies about others (thou shalt not bare false witness is a command he does not follow. In fact he breaks it almost every day)
4. he again lies about them saying we reject the cleansing ability of the cross. Yet we teach God cleanses us completely. While he continues to insist he must clean himself up. (Yet again, He will not repent, but blame shift)
5. He ends like he acts astounded that people who believe God will COMPLETE the work God started when he saved a person. And he will never stop. When he himself believes God may not finish the job, and the people he once saved can still end up in hell. (Like the pharisee, He loves to puff his chest. WHile praising God he is not like the sinner)
As usual. He tries to sound smart, but he is blinded to the foolishness in his own thinking
So who does James say has faith? The hearers of the word or the doers of the word? A hearer is a person that hears the word and rejoices in the word, but then goes couch potatoe and does nothing or very little to further the KOG. A doer of the word is one that rejoices in the word and then goes out and does good works in the name of Jesus Christ and for his glory.
This scripture you missed the most important words. Here they are:
James 2:18 King James Version (KJV)
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
The words you missed are, I will shew thee my faith by my works. It is the doer of good works that really has faith, the hearer only of the word has little or no faith.
So now you give me a scripture about a mustard seed and tell me that if you have a small amount of faith that a mustard seed has you can move mountains. But you miss quoted it again, so here it is:
Matthew 17:20 King James Version (KJV)
20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
Jesus was saying if you have the faith of a grain of mustard seed you could move mountains. A mustard seed has a tremendous amount of faith. Because this litttle tiny seed has to have enormous faith in order to eventually grow into a mighty tree that birds can rest and nest in.
So a small amount of faith cannot move mountains. It takes an enormous amount of faith.
Now how much faith does it take to be saved? It takes an enormous amount of faith in order to be a new man with a new heart, and a doer of the word and sprint to the end, enduring all things along the way by faith. A faith in Jesus's grace that will finally transform you into a great man for Jesus and God.
So the bible is a good place to learn what faith is. But tell me what is more important than faith? It is in the bible, so do not despair.
This scripture you missed the most important words. Here they are:
James 2:18 King James Version (KJV)
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
The words you missed are, I will shew thee my faith by my works. It is the doer of good works that really has faith, the hearer only of the word has little or no faith.
So now you give me a scripture about a mustard seed and tell me that if you have a small amount of faith that a mustard seed has you can move mountains. But you miss quoted it again, so here it is:
Matthew 17:20 King James Version (KJV)
20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
Jesus was saying if you have the faith of a grain of mustard seed you could move mountains. A mustard seed has a tremendous amount of faith. Because this litttle tiny seed has to have enormous faith in order to eventually grow into a mighty tree that birds can rest and nest in.
So a small amount of faith cannot move mountains. It takes an enormous amount of faith.
Now how much faith does it take to be saved? It takes an enormous amount of faith in order to be a new man with a new heart, and a doer of the word and sprint to the end, enduring all things along the way by faith. A faith in Jesus's grace that will finally transform you into a great man for Jesus and God.
So the bible is a good place to learn what faith is. But tell me what is more important than faith? It is in the bible, so do not despair.
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As has been demonstrated here, it is always possible to guess peoples actual positions
but what really matters is Gods will.
And as all believers in Christ, we have sinned in the past, but in faith we will walk
closer to Jesus everyday.
If we stumble we have a reconciliation with the Father through repentance and
confession, and we shall be cleansed of the sin in our lives.
Now to those who do not follow Jesus inventing ideas about others is not a problem,
because they have lost their conscience and dwell in the belief God loves them despite
how far they drift from the Lord. And the Key issue is always how they feel about
Jesus's sermons and commands.
Now if they had any reality, their words would be full of grace and peace, but it is
always this antagonism about obeying Jesus and walking in His ways.
Jesus called people to walk in Gods ways, yet these people are not interested just
in belief, and when they read the law, they just feel bad, which is so odd for those
who have conquered the law of sin and death.
Expect nothing more from such as these, even to our deaths their hatred will burn
like nothing else, even though our calling is to love and grace.
but what really matters is Gods will.
And as all believers in Christ, we have sinned in the past, but in faith we will walk
closer to Jesus everyday.
If we stumble we have a reconciliation with the Father through repentance and
confession, and we shall be cleansed of the sin in our lives.
Now to those who do not follow Jesus inventing ideas about others is not a problem,
because they have lost their conscience and dwell in the belief God loves them despite
how far they drift from the Lord. And the Key issue is always how they feel about
Jesus's sermons and commands.
Now if they had any reality, their words would be full of grace and peace, but it is
always this antagonism about obeying Jesus and walking in His ways.
Jesus called people to walk in Gods ways, yet these people are not interested just
in belief, and when they read the law, they just feel bad, which is so odd for those
who have conquered the law of sin and death.
Expect nothing more from such as these, even to our deaths their hatred will burn
like nothing else, even though our calling is to love and grace.
What is the joke?
Some hate that we can walk in love and purity in Christ, because His ways are more glorious
than one can imagine. There is a veil between those who would aspire to the things of God,
because they see the shadows but cannot grasp why their hearts defy entering in.
Why did the pharisees hate Jesus so? Because they were aware of the difference but did not
understand it, and tried desperately to describe it. Some did come to faith, by resolving the
sin in their hearts and walking in the things of God from the heart. That has always been the
key, to be one with Christ. And the spiritual truth is, only if the Lord has revealed it to you,
will you also see. Praise the Lord, brothers and sisters we are the sheep He has called us to
His Kingdom, Amen.
Some hate that we can walk in love and purity in Christ, because His ways are more glorious
than one can imagine. There is a veil between those who would aspire to the things of God,
because they see the shadows but cannot grasp why their hearts defy entering in.
Why did the pharisees hate Jesus so? Because they were aware of the difference but did not
understand it, and tried desperately to describe it. Some did come to faith, by resolving the
sin in their hearts and walking in the things of God from the heart. That has always been the
key, to be one with Christ. And the spiritual truth is, only if the Lord has revealed it to you,
will you also see. Praise the Lord, brothers and sisters we are the sheep He has called us to
His Kingdom, Amen.
R
And I did not say the article, or Freegrace doctrine itself, says that. I have never said the new grace doctrine TELLS people to live in their old lives and stop believing. What I did say it teaches is if you do live in sin, and even go back to unbelief, you are still saved. It plainly teaches that you can do that and you will still be saved. That is the new grace doctrine in the church today.
Here's what I said that you originally responded to...
You then challenged me with this...
I met your challenge completely with this...and addressed it to you and everyone who liked your post... Names, churches, links, books, in writing.....everything you asked for. I delivered. Now you can see for yourself that I know what I'm talking about. You too, VCO and 'preacher4truth'. Your Calvinistic theology is being quickly abandoned in favor of the new grace doctrine spreading rapidly in the assembly at this time.
For now we see a contradictory mess between the two, Calvinism and Freegrace theology. That's what makes it so hard to nail people down to what they believe in this thread. One post they are arguing Freegrace. In the next they are defending tenants of Calvinism's Perseverance of the Saints. And they don't even realize they're doing that.
Here's what I said that you originally responded to...
You then challenged me with this...
I met your challenge completely with this...and addressed it to you and everyone who liked your post... Names, churches, links, books, in writing.....everything you asked for. I delivered. Now you can see for yourself that I know what I'm talking about. You too, VCO and 'preacher4truth'. Your Calvinistic theology is being quickly abandoned in favor of the new grace doctrine spreading rapidly in the assembly at this time.
For now we see a contradictory mess between the two, Calvinism and Freegrace theology. That's what makes it so hard to nail people down to what they believe in this thread. One post they are arguing Freegrace. In the next they are defending tenants of Calvinism's Perseverance of the Saints. And they don't even realize they're doing that.
R
Well , you have changed your beliefs then, it would seem.
BINGO! That's what I've been saying. If a person is believing, they are by definition NOT REJECTING THE BLOOD OF CHRIST.
I agree completely that it is those who DO NOT BELIEVE that reject the blood of Christ. And them living in sin is the sign of that unbelief. But all is well because Freegrace doctrine is close at hand to tickle the ears of the person living in sin and unbelief telling them they remain saved despite their unbelief and resultant slide into a life of sin.
The second type of soil believer in the Parable of the Sower begs to differ with you. Jesus said he believes for a while but then falls away when trouble comes his way. And nowadays, Freegrace doctrine is there to catch him and assure him that he is still saved despite his falling away into sin and unbelief.
Jesus shows us that it is the 2nd type of soil believer who can become an unbeliever. That is a danger to the new, weak, and not deeply rooted believer. Only people of the fourth type of soil (you know, the kind that gets beat up around here for being holier than thou) have roots that go down deep enough to keep them from falling away and firmly planted in Christ.
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