Not By Works

[eternally-gratefull]

pick a better bone man, he used 3 or 4 different sins/temptations in his example.

The actual post I responded to only used murder, and asked what the consequence of that one sin would be, Please go back and read

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So good thing we have God's standard applied to us, just as 2 Cor 5:21 says we do, right?

This does not mean we will not sin, you will sin and I will sin l, but it does mean that the standard you talk about has been met. by the blood of Jesus.

Amen, it is not ur righteousness that makes us acceptable to God, it was Jesus righteousness which makes us acceptable.

of course this does not mean we can go out and sin all we want, in fact, what child wants to go out and continue in the sin which they KNOW made them dead to begin with, let alone, who can withstand the chastening of God.

 

[hardsell]

The actual post I responded to only used murder, and asked what the consequence of that one sin would be, Please go back and read

I see what you are syaing and saw the post , my apologies, I missed it on the first round.

 

[hardsell]

of course this does not mean we can go out and sin all we want, in fact, what child wants to go out and continue in the sin which they KNOW made them dead to begin with, let alone, who can withstand the chastening of God.

Totally agree we should not go out and sin all we want. You would be surprised by how many do and then blame God for the trouble they get into.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I see what you are syaing and saw the post , my apologies, I missed it on the first round.

Its all good.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Totally agree we should not go out and sin all we want. You would be surprised by how many do and then blame God for the trouble they get into.

Been a christian for over 40 years. Many churches all over the country, Never seen this before.

If I did, I would question if they were saved at all.. How can you say you have faith in God, and trust him, then prove you do not know him at all.

 

[VCO]

Well skimming through this thread, I see two opposing forces. One side believes faith alone is sufficient for salvation. The other side believes it requires obedience to the law.

The question is, if one is saved by faith, then commits murder, what is the consequences from God?

So far, no one has answered this, and I would like to know.

Now you will have an answer.


First and Foremost, you SAID murder.

That is the act of a PREMEDITATED Act of VIOLENCE to someone else.

THERE IS THE FLAW IN YOUR POSING THE QUESTION THE WAY YOU DID.


John 14:15 (HCSB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] “If you love Me {that equals to SAVATION}, you will keep {SO PREMEDIATATED MURDER IS RULED OUT by the LACK OF LOVE FOR HIM} My commands.

1 John 2:19 (HCSB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] They went out from us, but they did not belong to us; for if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. However, they went out so that it might be made clear that none of them belongs to us.





You did not say that it was an accidental homicide, which would be different. YES, the perpetrator can ask for forgiveness from GOD and receive it, therefore his salvation is secure; HOWEVER he will pay what the Law requires for the crime.

 

[Tommy379]

Thank you for your answers.

I used murder because it's one of the 10 commandments.

Y'alls answers lead me to two more questions.

Does salvation require repentance?

Does repentance mean a simple apology, or does it require turning away from the sin.... to not sin?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Thank you for your answers.

I used murder because it's one of the 10 commandments.

Y'alls answers lead me to two more questions.

Does salvation require repentance?

Does repentance mean a simple apology, or does it require turning away from the sin.... to not sin?

Yes, If one does not repent, they will never have true faith in God, They may believe, but belief never saved anyone.

Repent can not mean turn from sin, a non believer cannot turn from sin, They must be born of God to be given the ABILITY to turn from sin, and the POWER to turn from sin, let alone the DESIRE to turn from sin.

A non believer who repents admits his guilt and falls to their knees in unworthy ness (see the tax collector) a religios person who thinks there have turned from sin, and have repented, but have not actually done so. Will praise God how righteous he is and how thankful he is to not be like the sinner.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

Thank you for your answers.

I used murder because it's one of the 10 commandments.

Y'alls answers lead me to two more questions.

Does salvation require repentance?

Does repentance mean a simple apology, or does it require turning away from the sin.... to not sin?

repentance

3341. metanoia ►
Strong's Concordance
metanoia: change of mind, repentance
Original Word: μετάνοια, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: metanoia
Phonetic Spelling: (met-an'-oy-ah)
Short Definition: repentance, a change of mind
Definition: repentance, a change of mind, change in the inner man.



salvation comes with being a new creature which produces repentance


saying required makes it of ourself
so i would say no

but if i were to examine myself like the bible says

and see the same creature i was before

then would that not mean i was never made new?

 

[BillG]

Amen, it is not ur righteousness that makes us acceptable to God, it was Jesus righteousness which makes us acceptable.

of course this does not mean we can go out and sin all we want, in fact, what child wants to go out and continue in the sin which they KNOW made them dead to begin with, let alone, who can withstand the chastening of God.

And for me this is a big issue.
Is seems many say "Bible says don't do therefore don't do, just stop it"
Those who do so pick out the biggies, murder, rape, the extreme stuff against those of us who say works do no save.
Yet they do that and neglect other things that people struggle with, even then they say the same "Dont do it"

I have read what our precious sister rosemary said above concerning her alcohol issues.
Rosemary I hope you don't me mentioning you, I do so because you are honest and real and you bring a lot to this table.


I have talked on here my issues with gambling addiction that I suffered with.

Those who say don't do have no idea why the do it.
Why did I gamble, no one ever asked me that.
So when I gambled I was waiting for punishment from God.
I started praying "Kill me so then I know where I am going"

In the end I asked God myself. Why do I gamble?
Boy what a revelation and walk. It was hard.

The reason for my gambling was not because I liked it.
The reason was because my severe upbringing and as a result escapism from it, and also a totally false concept of God.
He was a hard taskmaster was gonna beat me just like my mum and step dad.
My mum through me out at 14, fostered by a Christan family only to then be sexually abused by my foster dad.

The point I want to make here is that children of the Father are told don't do otherwise God will beat you like the dog you are.
So that's what the focus is, a hard Father.

Yet the reality is our Father wants to deal with and heal the reasons that lead to the cause.
The chastening of God is the last resort, not the first port of call.

 

[BillG]

Thank you for your answers.

I used murder because it's one of the 10 commandments.

Y'alls answers lead me to two more questions.

Does salvation require repentance?

Does repentance mean a simple apology, or does it require turning away from the sin.... to not sin?

I think salvation does require repentance.

Repentance of the sin of unbelief.

John 16:8-9
8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

So to me when one does that what they are saying at this juncture "I want to be like you and walk like you"
So the sins outside of that have been repented off. Turning away from it

 

[Seohce]

IF WE READ ROMANS 12:9-21, WE CAN SEE HOW LOVE WORKS. AND IF WE READ HEBREWS CHAPTER 11 WE CAN SEE HOW FAITH WORKS.

Q; CAN FAITH WITHOUT WORKS SAVE?

A: NO, BECAUSE FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD (James 2:14-26)

Q: CAN FAITH WITHOUT LOVE SAVE?

A: NO, BECAUSE GOD IS LOVE (1 john 4:8 & 16) AND OUR FAITH SHOULD BE IN GOD.

Q: DOES FAITH ALONE SAVE?

A: NO, THE SCRIPTURES TELLS US THAT WE ARE JUSTIFIED NOT BY FAITH ALONE.(James 2:24) NEITHER IS IT BY WORKS ALONE.(Ephesians 2:8-9) BUT THEY ARE WORKING TOGETHER.(James 2:22)

...A FAITH THAT WORKS IN LOVE.( Galatians 5:6)

1 Corinthians 13:1-13 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and iIF I HAVE A FAITH that can move mountains,BUT HAVE NOT LOVE, I am nothing....
And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But THE GREATEST of these IS LOVE.

.2 John 1:6 And this is love: that WE WALK IN OBEDIENCE TO HIS COMMANDS. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you WALK IN LOVE.

1 John 5:3 This is love for God: TO OBEY HIS COMMANDS. And his commands are not burdensome,

1 John 3:16-18 THIS IS HOW WE KNOW WHAT LOVE IS: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers. If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.

Matthew 19:17 “Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, OBEY THE COMMANDMENTS.”

John 14:15,21-24,31 Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit “If you love me, you will obey what I command. Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him.” Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?” Jesus replied, “If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. He who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me. but the world must learn that I love the Father and that I do exactly what my Father has commanded me. “Come now; let us leave.

Romans 13:10-14 Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLMENT OF THE LAW. And do this, understanding the present time. The hour has come for you to wake up from your slumber, because OUR SALVATION IS NEARER NOW THAN WHEN WE FIRST BELIEVED. The night is nearly over; the day is almost here. So let us put aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light. Let us behave decently, as in the daytime, not in orgies and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and debauchery, not in dissension and jealousy. Rather, clothe yourselves with the Lord Jesus Christ, and do not think about how to gratify the desires of the sinful nature.

Matthew 28:19-20 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and TEACHING THEM TO OBEY EVERYTHING I HAVE COMMANDED YOU. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”


Ecclesiastes 12:13-14 Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: FEAR GOD AND KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS, for this is the whole duty of man. For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every hidden thing, whether it is good or evil.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

I think salvation does require repentance.

Repentance of the sin of unbelief.

John 16:8-9
8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

So to me when one does that what they are saying at this juncture "I want to be like you and walk like you"
So the sins outside of that have been repented off. Turning away from it

ya

id agree with this

 

[eternally-gratefull]

And for me this is a big issue.
Is seems many say "Bible says don't do therefore don't do, just stop it"
Those who do so pick out the biggies, murder, rape, the extreme stuff against those of us who say works do no save.
Yet they do that and neglect other things that people struggle with, even then they say the same "Dont do it"

I have read what our precious sister rosemary said above concerning her alcohol issues.
Rosemary I hope you don't me mentioning you, I do so because you are honest and real and you bring a lot to this table.


I have talked on here my issues with gambling addiction that I suffered with.

Those who say don't do have no idea why the do it.
Why did I gamble, no one ever asked me that.
So when I gambled I was waiting for punishment from God.
I started praying "Kill me so then I know where I am going"

In the end I asked God myself. Why do I gamble?
Boy what a revelation and walk. It was hard.

The reason for my gambling was not because I liked it.
The reason was because my severe upbringing and as a result escapism from it, and also a totally false concept of God.
He was a hard taskmaster was gonna beat me just like my mum and step dad.
My mum through me out at 14, fostered by a Christan family only to then be sexually abused by my foster dad.

The point I want to make here is that children of the Father are told don't do otherwise God will beat you like the dog you are.
So that's what the focus is, a hard Father.

Yet the reality is our Father wants to deal with and heal the reasons that lead to the cause.
The chastening of God is the last resort, not the first port of call.

As paul said, the law did not help us stop sin, It caused sin to Increase. The law or rules is not the answer. Loving God and others, and sacrifice of self. Is.

 

[Seohce]

I agree with you, The issue is that people want to focus on works, and not on faith.

True faith works, there is not a question about it, the only ones questioning it are those focused on works

If a dead faith has no power to save (and it does not have that power!!!!) it’s definitely has no power to work. Now will it.

The issue is that many people even approves and were deceived by the devil's ploy to divide the church through this thread which promotes sin thru disobedience to God's commands.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

ya

id agree with this

I third that!

 

[BillG]

The issue is that many people even approves and were deceived by the devil's ploy to divide the church through this thread which promotes sin thru disobedience to God's commands.

Evening Seoche.

Can you post verbatim anyone on here who promotes sin through disobedience to Gods commands?

 

[Zi]

In the Gospels Jesus, John as well as when Paul spoke they said "repent and turn to God".. folks can't be turned towards 2 things..

If that helps at all idk

Thank you for your answers.

I used murder because it's one of the 10 commandments.

Y'alls answers lead me to two more questions.

Does salvation require repentance?

Does repentance mean a simple apology, or does it require turning away from the sin.... to not sin?

 

[LoveGodForever]

Evening Seoche.

Can you post verbatim anyone on here who promotes sin through disobedience to Gods commands?

Good morning (my time) dear brother BILL and happy New Years.

Is God's 4th commandment one of God's Commandments? (Exodus 20:8-11)

What is the purpose of God's LAW (10 commandments)? (Romans 3:20)

What does James 2:8-12 teach about breaking ANY of God's LAW?

If someone is living a live in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN are they in a saved state before God or an UNSAVED state (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Some interesting questions and scriptures that will help you with your question above.

God bless mate!