FLAT EARTH

[posthuman]

to undermine his creation and making it seem insignificant.

insignificant?

the volume of the entire universe according to Babylonian/zetetic cosmology is
~ 1 x 10[SUP]22[/SUP] m[SUP]3[/SUP]
the volume of the entire universe according to observational astronomy is
~ 3 x 10[SUP]80[/SUP] m[SUP]3[/SUP]

in terms of scale, the model of the universe you are espousing is
10,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
times smaller.
that's "more significant" ?? how?

 

[posthuman]

what does David think about "significance" when he considers the universe?

When I consider your heavens, the work of your fingers,
the moon and the stars, which you have set in place,
what is mankind that you are mindful of them,
human beings that you care for them?
(Psalm 8:3-4)
​

you say that the studying the universe should make it bleeding obvious that the whole purpose of all creation is to demonstrate the significance and glory of mankind -- but David looks at the heavens, at the stars and the moon, and is humbled by how insignificant man is: exactly the opposite effect.

which happens to be in keeping with an enormous, expansive cosmos in which mankind is apparently not the focal centerpiece. one by which the greatness of God is glorified and man is humbled, not set on a pedestal or prominently under glass in a display case.

how does Psalm 8:3-4 jive with what you think the obvious lesson of considering the universe should be?
if the message and lesson of creation is the significance of man, look at the surface of earth itself! why is such an huge proportion of it utterly uninhabitable by mankind, if it's all about mankind? you can't live on or under the sea, in the frozen tundra, atop the rocks of the high mountains or in the desert! man can only survive in a very small percentage of the environment without radically changing it or going through all kinds of labor and requiring all kinds of tools to sustain himself. we need fresh water, moderate temperature changes, a constant supply of food, shelter from the weather. before we built machines and tools to help us survive, we clung to narrow stretches of land along waterways, a very small proportion of the earth! how does that teach that purpose of the whole earth is for our good pleasure and habitation??

 

[posthuman]

You've been having these discussions from a position that does not question, rather accepts what you've been told as truth.

so you say.
but i don't see you questioning whether your assumption about me is correct or not. perhaps if you understood what a person who studies math for 35 years actually does and trains himself to do --rigorously question and seek unambiguous definition & proof of absolutely every aspect of everything -- you'd make different assumptions about me.

i happen to be in these threads actually questioning everything these guys repeat from the indoctrination videos they watch without scrutiny on youtube. you want to call that 'a position that does not question'? ok, noted.

One question. How does waves in the ocean travel? In water. Correct? How do sound waves, light travel? There has to be a medium in which they travel.

as i was saying, people who don't really understand things like wave propagation are easily fooled by deceptive arguments involving things like wave propagation.

put an alarm clock in a vacuum jar; you can't hear it because sound - a pressure wave - needs a medium to propagate.
put a flashlight in a vacuum jar; you see it because light - an EM wave - does not need a medium to propagate.

 

[posthuman]

Michelson Morley experiment proves there is aether. It defies common sense to claim otherwise

Michelson & Morley went to a great deal of trouble to try to prove there is an aether, and they instead found that there is not.

did you really not know that? your'e saying that the result of their experiment was exactly the opposite of what it actually is lol. "fake news"

Lorentz came up with some math - length contraction - and supposed that this is why the Michelson/Morley experiment result results in strong evidence that that there is no aether. Lorentz himself, and Poincaré, and later Einstein putting together the work of these former men, determined that length contraction doesn't show there is an aether at all, that it in fact agrees there is not.

but weren't you championing a statement earlier favoring experimental evidence over pure theory? and now you are putting yourself in a position favoring Lorentz's math over M. & M.'s actual experimental results. yet Lorentz himself later realized that his math was incomplete, and that it didn't support an aether either.
and here's the real irony -- if you put yourself on the side of Lorentz in 1895 - before he realized the scope of what came to be called special relativity - then guess what the contraction Lorentz derived and thought may account for no aether being detectable depends on? it depends on a rotating, spherical earth orbiting at speed around a much larger, distant sun. your grounds for rejecting the results of the Michelson Morley experiment & declaring them to be exactly the opposite of what they actually are are wholly dependent on the heliocentric solar system model. it's by the speed of the orbit and the rotation of the earth that Lorentz contraction is calculated - but at the same time you think that speed is zero!

as i was saying.
lack of understanding and of knowledge.
not thinking through the implications of the arguments being made.

 

[posthuman]

put an alarm clock in a vacuum jar; you can't hear it because sound - a pressure wave - needs a medium to propagate.
put a flashlight in a vacuum jar; you see it because light - an EM wave - does not need a medium to propagate.

heck you don't even need a flashlight.
you can see the alarm clock - because guess what - light is passing though the vacuum, reflecting off the clock, and entering your eyes.



if what Karraster said is true, this alarm clock would be invisible. the jar would just be filled with absolute blackness.

obviously, it's not.

Q.E.D.

 

[Karraster]

As I said in my correction post, Post perhaps you missed it, it was Sagnac who proved there was an aether, and MM proved the earth is motionless, they were perplexed, because they expected different results. This information is easily obtainable for those willing to search.

Theorist and thought experiments do not always translate into the real world applications.

 

[Karraster]

heck you don't even need a flashlight.
you can see the alarm clock - because guess what - light is passing though the vacuum, reflecting off the clock, and entering your eyes.

View attachment 176866

if what Karraster said is true, this alarm clock would be invisible. the jar would just be filled with absolute blackness.

obviously, it's not.

Q.E.D.

Perfect example of the smoke and mirrors we've been sold as truth. 100% vacuum in that jar using standard pvc plumbing parts as valves. Yeah, ok Post, you win.

 

[tourist]

Im actually not a physicists. Background is mechanical engineering and DC electronic modular systems.

Im not looking for you to prove it.

I asked you to show me.

I'm interested, you seem like you are involved with the study in some way.

Impressive credentials.

 

[Karraster]

what does David think about "significance" when he considers the universe?

When I consider your heavens, the work of your fingers,
the moon and the stars, which you have set in place,
what is mankind that you are mindful of them,
human beings that you care for them?
(Psalm 8:3-4)
​

you say that the studying the universe should make it bleeding obvious that the whole purpose of all creation is to demonstrate the significance and glory of mankind -- but David looks at the heavens, at the stars and the moon, and is humbled by how insignificant man is: exactly the opposite effect.

which happens to be in keeping with an enormous, expansive cosmos in which mankind is apparently not the focal centerpiece. one by which the greatness of God is glorified and man is humbled, not set on a pedestal or prominently under glass in a display case.

how does Psalm 8:3-4 jive with what you think the obvious lesson of considering the universe should be?
if the message and lesson of creation is the significance of man, look at the surface of earth itself! why is such an huge proportion of it utterly uninhabitable by mankind, if it's all about mankind? you can't live on or under the sea, in the frozen tundra, atop the rocks of the high mountains or in the desert! man can only survive in a very small percentage of the environment without radically changing it or going through all kinds of labor and requiring all kinds of tools to sustain himself. we need fresh water, moderate temperature changes, a constant supply of food, shelter from the weather. before we built machines and tools to help us survive, we clung to narrow stretches of land along waterways, a very small proportion of the earth! how does that teach that purpose of the whole earth is for our good pleasure and habitation??

Is the earth created in the image of God, is the sun or moon? Of course not! Man is created in the image of God, why wouldn't man hold a special place within all of creation? You think that is arrogant?

 

[posthuman]

As I said in my correction post, Post perhaps you missed it, it was Sagnac who proved there was an aether, and MM proved the earth is motionless, they were perplexed, because they expected different results.

they expected to find evidence of an aether, and they didn't. that was the whole purpose of their experiment. other incontrovertible proofs already demonstrated that the earth is rotating relative to the solar solar system long before the close of the 19th century.

Michelson & Morley's experiment in now way whatsoever proved the earth is stationary. in fact, in 1925 Michelson actually built a very large ring interferometer with two other scientists, Gale & Pearson, which produced ((more)) proof of the rotation of the earth. in doing so they demonstrated that the Sagnac effect is a product of length contraction in the direction of the travel of the photons, a relativistic effect which Sagnac did not account for ((Lorentz's equation)) but which perfectly explains the result. that same 'Sagnac effect' result, Michelson Gale & Pearson hypothesized, would be measurable in a large ring interferometer with the rotating earth providing the spin ((Sagnac's experiment is basically M&M's on a spinning table instead of a stationary one)).

Sagnac's experiment does not prove there is an aether. it proves special relativity, and that's demonstrated by ((among many other things)) the results of Michelson, Gale & Pearson's identical result on a stationary base on the surface a rotating planet.

 

[posthuman]

Is the earth created in the image of God, is the sun or moon? Of course not! Man is created in the image of God, why wouldn't man hold a special place within all of creation? You think that is arrogant?

why would David look at the heavens and be struck by the insignificance of mankind if the purpose of the heavens is declaring the superlative significance of mankind?

Psalm 8 makes no sense if the universe is a special display case for humans.

 

[posthuman]

Perfect example of the smoke and mirrors we've been sold as truth. 100% vacuum in that jar using standard pvc plumbing parts as valves. Yeah, ok Post, you win.

oh you like fancy ones?

me too. they're cool.



looks pretty expensive huh?

here's images of the inside of this ultra-high-vacuum chamber ((it's at univ. of Washington)) during some fusion experiments. collimated plasma jets being fired into vacuum.



so how am i seeing this if electromagnetic waves can't propagate across vacuum? in your Babylonian cosmological model, you got vacuum at the top of your glass dome, too, you know - so you're telling me i don't see stars when i look up at the sky. or the sun. or the moon. hmm.

 

[posthuman]

guess what 'our hero' Nikolai Tesla is holding in his hand?






it's a vacuum bulb.
you probably are more familiar with the name for them, "light bulb"
but guess how they work? electricity passes through a filament in an evacuated glass chamber - and somehow an EM wave passes through the vacuum between the filament and the glass shell, and there is light.

light needs a medium to propagate? then there are no such things as light bulbs.

 

[posthuman]

Im actually not a physicists. Background is mechanical engineering and DC electronic modular systems.

suppose i came to you and said buildings should all be made of styrofoam. that i knew something about insulation that 'mainstream media' keeps a secret, because of a conspiracy involving industries and mining operations. turns out that insulation lowers heating costs, but the government wants to keep us all subjected to them so they make buildings out of steel. steel is a very poor insulator - which no one ever teaches you, you have to find out from someone on youtube who is willing to speak the truth even though people will call him crazy. styrofoam is a great heat insulator, plus it's way cheaper than steel. there's a huge government, media and industry conspiracy trying to keep this information from people and build expensive housing and expensive heating and air conditioning, so they can create a culture of complacency and dependence and mind control us. probably so we won't find out about the lizard people, but w/e. it's mostly about money and power.

what would you - a person who actually knows about mechanical engineering - say?
that i didn't really know what i was talking about, right? that there were a lot of other factors that come into play in structural engineering and one characteristic of a material alone doesn't determine its suitability for some use?

so maybe i tell you everything you learned about statics & materials science was misinformation and brainwashing, because i found the same couple of paragraphs copy-pasted on a whole lot of websites, and i saw an awful lot of youtube videos made by people who said they did their research, so you must be wrong about all your objections?

that's kinda what it's like to be post, reading flat earth threads.

 

[posthuman]

that's kinda what it's like to be post, reading flat earth threads.

so post would rather talk about the observer effect.

or wave/particle duality. Karraster's almost taken us there, actually, which is cool.

 

[Ugly]

 

[Paisley_buddie]

Why on earth are you lot debating the psy-op known as flat earth when we are so close to the new world order being implimented. Seriously wake up

 

[Ugly]

Why on earth are you lot debating the psy-op known as flat earth when we are so close to the new world order being implimented. Seriously wake up

I think the debate, no matter the world situation, is a silly one. But why are you so concerned with how others use their time?
Why do you assume everyone views things how you do?
Or why assume that people need to alter every single conversation they have to what you think is right, even if they do believe how you do?
The new world order was "on the brink" when I was a teen 20 years ago. So many things are "any time now". Should Christians live in constant fear of this or trust that God is in control no matter what happens?

 

[Paisley_buddie]

I think the debate, no matter the world situation, is a silly one. But why are you so concerned with how others use their time?
Why do you assume everyone views things how you do?
Or why assume that people need to alter every single conversation they have to what you think is right, even if they do believe how you do?
The new world order was "on the brink" when I was a teen 20 years ago. So many things are "any time now". Should Christians live in constant fear of this or trust that God is in control no matter what happens?

because of the flat earth debate it takes away focus to the new world order (this is bad) the beast system is like 1 to 20 years away (just depends on world events) from being implimented and focus should be going to the lost souls of the world.

There isn't any impending danger to having a flat/round earth but there is a danger to those who arent aware of the NWO agenda who will fall hook line and sinker if they arent warned.

 

[MichaelOwen]

I think the debate, no matter the world situation, is a silly one. But why are you so concerned with how others use their time?
Why do you assume everyone views things how you do?
Or why assume that people need to alter every single conversation they have to what you think is right, even if they do believe how you do?
The new world order was "on the brink" when I was a teen 20 years ago. So many things are "any time now". Should Christians live in constant fear of this or trust that God is in control no matter what happens?

God does not want us, his children, to live in fear whatsoever. Christ clearly said, Take no thought for tomorrow, let tomorrow take care of itself, meaning we live in the here and now. It's kind of sad to see Christian men and women falling for this deception of the flat Earth theory. Worst part is, they go right to the scriptures to literally take it out of context. But that's their prerogative, not mine.

I'm a saved soldier for Jesus Christ, and my EYES (Spiritually and physically) are open to this world, and I know there is evil taking place, there is deception going on, but I can tell you, this is NOT one of those deceptions. We ALL see the sun rises and the sun sets, and witness the stars move through out the night sky, and observe other planets that are worlds with spherical shapes. Why would our Lord make all other planets round and Earth flat?

Science does not hide God, but it only proves our Creator is real.