Its His faith that he imputes to us as a free gift. Our new faith that works in us to both will and do His good purpose. .No murmuring on our part.
Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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Its His faith that he imputes to us as a free gift. Our new faith that works in us to both will and do His good purpose. .No murmuring on our part.
Yes it is not automatic but is a finished work of His faith .He will keep working it out till the end just as he propmied he would. .
You don't understand descriptive texts, or proper context. This is why you remain in so much error, and end up having your salvation all up to you.
Romans 8:26ff refute your ideology, every single believer will experience all phases of the salvation given by God. You'll have none of that, insert PHart: it is up to him, not according to what God has already completed in Christ who will lose none of his.
Nice change....my answer was to the question...Am I a Calvinist or universalist not the following changed post.
Originally Posted by beastslayer1970
Is saving faith Jesus' faith or yours?
It's remarkable how several on here attempt to supplant Christ from all who have believed him for their gift of eternal salvation, in attempt to exchange this completed work and place the effort and the final salvation of the soul upon the person instead:
"Is it you or Christ????!!!!! YOU or CHRIST?!?!?!?!?! ANSWER me!!!!!!"
It's ALL Christ.
"Is it you or Christ????!!!!! YOU or CHRIST?!?!?!?!?! ANSWER me!!!!!!"
It's ALL Christ.
P
PHart
Guest
Why do you think I included verses 10 & 14...to set the context for 'sanctified':
'Sanctified' means born again people:
Sanctified born again people who show contempt for the blood of Christ in a willful, unbelieving return to the world will be destroyed, not saved on the Day of Wrath.
Stop taking false comfort in an erroneous 'Once Saved Always Saved' doctrine, church! Keep enduring in your believing to the very end so you can be saved in the very end.
P
PHart
Guest
It is remarkable how many Christians there are in the church, horribly influenced by Calvin, who think God does their believing for them.
He provides the faith for us to do our believing, but it is our responsibility to place our trust in that which God has revealed to us to be true. And last time I checked, trusting in Christ was not a self righteous work of the damnable works gospel.
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100% Christ and why he gets all the glory...end of story.......and embellishment with self = corrupted message with no power
Stop peddling a corrupted I keep myself saved lie....I will stick with eternal security found in Christ.....You can probably google a new street organ for your dance troupe
P
PHart
Guest
Justification/ salvation is given by God through the grace of the forgiveness of sin, apart from any work I do to earn it. I lay hold of, and keep that free gift by believing/trusting in it.
Believing to get the salvation that is all about what God did and not about what I do to earn it is not the damnable works gospel. But if it is, surely there is a passage of scripture explaining how if I have to believe, and continue to believe, to be saved then I'm trying to earn my own salvation. Post it.
P
PHart
Guest
Me too. I will continue to stick to Christ. That's what I've been saying all along.
P
PHart
Guest
If God does our believing for us so that He gets all the glory, why do so many in the church not do it very well? Is God too weak to make us believe perfectly and never have doubts, and too weak to keep some from going back to unbelief as some do? That's not very glorious if it is He who does our believing for us. He's not doing it very well for some people in the church.
Good point. looks like God gets all the blame? Is that why the churches are riddled with sins and false doctrines? I'd say it aint God, its man thats screwing up!
Then again, aint that what some teach? That everything (evil included) is predestined, EVERYTHING? I've heard em say it with my own ears.
It wasnt me! It was God who predestined me to! Ya know that old saying "The devil made me do it"? Well thanks to the theological masterminds now all the sinners can say God made me do it
I admit that I fail on my own I dont wanna blame God for my mistakes and sins
I know not all of em believe that, but I've heard some say it.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
Sanctified means set apart. Not born again.
there is positional sanctification, also known as justification
then their is conditional sanctification, also known as our spiritual walk.
Paul called the Corinthian church babes, Because they still struggles with sin, and they could not teach others, they still needed taught themselves.
They were positionally sanctified (perfect in Christy)
they were not very conditionally sanctified, Their condition was like that of babes which needed much help.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
its amazing how many follow Arminian, who says we can sin outselves out of salvation. And we must continue to work to maintain it.
Then again, Catholicism taught the same.
Then again.
Lets do as God said, not follow MEN, but follow the word.
Your in such a war to defeat calvanism, you are blinded to the truth of the word. Because you can not see it, you see anyone who believed in security as calvin infulenced. And feel it is your duty to judge and condemn them, even though youhave utterly no idea what they really believe.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
You are perfect right here, You are correct, it is apart from anything youdo.
but then you screw it up.
By adding your own power and own work to maintain salvation. So you contradicted your first statement by your second.
Faiht is not something you do, it is something you have. The question is, who is your faith in? God. or self.
if it is God, then there would be no need to doubt, or maintain, because it is not based on what Youy do or do not do. But what he did. And your faith is in him.
If this was true and you had FAITH in this, you would not preach you must maintain salvation by anything you do.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
No, He did what we needed to cause us to trust him, He did the work.
he did not do the believeing for us..
You do not add anything to the works of Christ,but it is being led of the Spirit that causes you to be saved.
Paul said he could have all faith so that he could remove mountains,but if he did not have charity,love in action by the Spirit,then he is nothing.
Paul said if they do not have charity then they erred from the faith,and James said their faith is dead,and John said the love of God does not dwell in them,so do not love in word only,but in deed and in truth.
Charity is greater than faith,and faith works through love,and it is love alone,not faith alone,and everything stems from love.
Paul said charity does not think an evil thought,and does not sin by the Spirit,and is not selfish,and not arrogant,and does not act unseemly,and is kind,and only goes by their needs,and not their wants,and helps others with their needs if possible.
If a person violates what is the definition of charity,love in action,then they are not allowing the Spirit to lead them,and then their faith does not count,for charity is greater than faith.
And there are millions of people that violate charity by them going by their wants,and lusts,above their needs,and like that on a daily basis not wanting to give it up,and many believing that it is alright,and many saying sin does not affect their relationship with God,and holding unto sin.
But then they lack charity,then their faith will lack.
It is not adding unto the works of Christ,it is allowing the Spirit to lead you,which many lack by their lifestyle,and many thinking they are alright,hence the warnings in the Bible to not conduct yourself in that manner.
Charity is greater than faith,and charity is works of love by the Spirit.
They say faith alone,not saved by works,and then you observe their lifestyle and charity is not there like it should be as they cater to the flesh somewhat.
Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
1Co 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
There is no struggling with sin,but people want to sin,and enjoy sin,and will not submit to the Spirit.
It is not adding to the works of Christ,but allowing the Spirit to lead you,and have charity,works of love,like abstaining from sin,and helping the poor and needy,for if not then your faith is dead,which many who claim Christ lack charity,and think they are alright with God,hence the warnings in the Bible to not conduct yourself in that manner of a lack of charity.
Are people going to say that doing the works of the Spirit,and having charity,love in action,and obeying the moral laws,and laws of love,is adding to the works of Christ,and not necessary for salvation,when it is not of the flesh,but of the Spirit.
The Spirit will not twist our arm to live for God,and we still have a choice between good and evil,so it is our responsibility to keep our self right with God by choosing to do what is right,and have charity,and allow the Spirit to lead us.
Paul said he could have all faith so that he could remove mountains,but if he did not have charity,love in action by the Spirit,then he is nothing.
Paul said if they do not have charity then they erred from the faith,and James said their faith is dead,and John said the love of God does not dwell in them,so do not love in word only,but in deed and in truth.
Charity is greater than faith,and faith works through love,and it is love alone,not faith alone,and everything stems from love.
Paul said charity does not think an evil thought,and does not sin by the Spirit,and is not selfish,and not arrogant,and does not act unseemly,and is kind,and only goes by their needs,and not their wants,and helps others with their needs if possible.
If a person violates what is the definition of charity,love in action,then they are not allowing the Spirit to lead them,and then their faith does not count,for charity is greater than faith.
And there are millions of people that violate charity by them going by their wants,and lusts,above their needs,and like that on a daily basis not wanting to give it up,and many believing that it is alright,and many saying sin does not affect their relationship with God,and holding unto sin.
But then they lack charity,then their faith will lack.
It is not adding unto the works of Christ,it is allowing the Spirit to lead you,which many lack by their lifestyle,and many thinking they are alright,hence the warnings in the Bible to not conduct yourself in that manner.
Charity is greater than faith,and charity is works of love by the Spirit.
They say faith alone,not saved by works,and then you observe their lifestyle and charity is not there like it should be as they cater to the flesh somewhat.
Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
1Co 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
There is no struggling with sin,but people want to sin,and enjoy sin,and will not submit to the Spirit.
It is not adding to the works of Christ,but allowing the Spirit to lead you,and have charity,works of love,like abstaining from sin,and helping the poor and needy,for if not then your faith is dead,which many who claim Christ lack charity,and think they are alright with God,hence the warnings in the Bible to not conduct yourself in that manner of a lack of charity.
Are people going to say that doing the works of the Spirit,and having charity,love in action,and obeying the moral laws,and laws of love,is adding to the works of Christ,and not necessary for salvation,when it is not of the flesh,but of the Spirit.
The Spirit will not twist our arm to live for God,and we still have a choice between good and evil,so it is our responsibility to keep our self right with God by choosing to do what is right,and have charity,and allow the Spirit to lead us.