I forgot to be baptized

[Grace777x70]

Water baptism is NOT where people are regenerated ( born-again) and receive "remission of sins" as is falsely taught by some religions.

Here we see the NT pattern with Peter. We hear, we believe, we are sealed with the Holy Spirit where we are baptized into the body of Christ..then we get water baptized as a representation of what happened when we believed in Christ.

But the regeneration and receiving the remission of sins comes first.

Acts 10:43-48 (NASB)
[SUP]43 [/SUP] "Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins."

[SUP]44 [/SUP] While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message.

[SUP]45 [/SUP] All the circumcised believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also.

[SUP]46 [/SUP] For they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God. Then Peter answered,

[SUP]47 [/SUP] "Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?"

[SUP]48 [/SUP] And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days.

Paul shows the process as well in Ephesians.

Ephesians 1:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

 

[Grace777x70]

If water baptism is needed in order obtain the remission of sins and to have regeneration happen as is falsely taught by some.

Here is a question to ask yourself.

When did the disciples get water baptized after Christ died on the cross and then was resurrected?

They would still need to have been water baptized after Christ's death and resurrection before they could be regenerated and to receive the remission of sins according to the water regeneration theory.

Even if they were water baptized by John - this still doesn't negate the need to be water baptized AFTER Christ rose from the dead as the "water baptism regenerationists believe" - in order to have remission of sins and to be regenerated.

John's baptism was different from Christ's baptism that He gives to the believers.

When Peter said to the whole group of Jews in Acts 2:38...repent and be baptized.....there must have been many of them there that were already baptized by John because it seems that only the Pharisees/Sadducees and scribes didn't get water baptized by John. So, that throws a whole other wrench into the mix here.

There are so many holes in this false teaching about needing to be water baptized in order to receive remission of sins and the regeneration for the Holy Spirit.

This completely violates all the clear, multiple scriptures to believe on Christ to be saved. Look at Acts 10:43-48 - clearly they were saved first and had already received the Holy Spirit - which is being born-again by the Spirit and being baptized into the body of Christ...then they were water baptized.

 

[mailmandan]

You keep missing my point. It's not the medication that heals but the action of taking the correct medication that heals. Period.

My point is that the medication (the correct medication) was taken orally, yet it's the medication that heals and not the water you drink to help wash it down. Period. Your point is moot.

Faith is only as good as the obedience of the faithful.

Faith is only as good as the OBJECT that we place it in. Faith in Jesus as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation saves. Faith in "water and works" for salvation cannot save.

Unfortunately, there are many sincere (but sincerely wrong) people who have faith but have not obeyed to the point of the pledge of a good conscience (1st Peter 3:21) missing out of the power of Jesus's death, burial and resurrection. Such people may believe but because of those in the "believe only" sects stand at the door of Jesus and wait, fearful that knocking will label them as a "belief plus works" salvationist.

Unfortunately, there are many sincere (but sincerely wrong) people who have mere "mental assent" belief in Christ, which falls short of saving faith (belief, trust, reliance) in Christ alone for salvation. Instead, their trust and reliance is in "water and works" for salvation. Such people have not obeyed the gospel by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 10:16). Instead, they believe a "watered down" gospel of works salvation. They confuse the pledge of a good conscience with the washing of dirt from the flesh, missing out on the power of Jesus's death, burial and resurrection. Mere mental assent belief in Christ joined with trust and reliance in "water and works" is NOT saving faith in Christ. *GENUINE BELIEVERS TRUST EXCLUSIVELY IN CHRIST FOR SALVATION.*

This is what I find detestable. Doctrine that puts a stumbling block before those believers wanting to obey the simply commands of God.

Believers do not put stumbling blocks before other believers wanting to get water baptized (for the right reason). Baptism put it in it's proper place, subsequent to saving faith in Christ as all works must be! Baptism is for believers, and believers are already saved, for the Bible says we are saved by grace through faith, not rites or religious works, or good works. This does not remove water baptism and other good works/acts of obedience from the Christian life, it just puts them in their proper place, subsequent to regeneration and salvation.

Telling them to ignore what is clearly commanded for salvation and labeling anyone who disagrees a "works based Judaizer". To the point of even calling acts of confessing, repentance and baptism as "works".

Like it or not, you teach a "works based" false gospel. Water baptism is a work of righteousness (Matthew 3:13-15) which follows saving faith in Christ (Acts 10:43-47) and we are not saved by works of righteousness.. (Titus 3:5). Repentance is a change of mind which precedes saving faith in Christ and is not a work for salvation that follows saving faith in Christ. Confession is an expression of faith, not a work for salvation and confessing with our mouth that Jesus is Lord and believing in our heart that God raised Him from the dead are not two separate steps to salvation, but are chronologically together (Romans 10:8-10).

*Your false gospel is the result of bad semantics and flawed hermeneutics.

 

[Grace777x70]

Some people see the word "baptized" and all they can think about is water.

Being baptized has been used as a representation in scripture and obviously it speaks of what happened to believers in Christ when they believed.

Acts 10:43-48 clearly shows that people get water baptized after receiving the Holy Spirit when they were baptized into the body of Christ when they believed after hearing the gospel of the grace of Christ. Eph. 1:13 shows this truth too.

Here is an example of baptize being used in relation to Moses as a representative of something else besides water.

1 Corinthians 10:2 (NASB)
[SUP] [/SUP] and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea;

In their religion of "no one is regenerated or receives the remission of sins" until they get water baptized. This means that if someone dies before they get water baptized - they have no regeneration nor have received the remission of sins - which means they go to hell.

This doctrine is so anti-Christ and anti-the gospel that I can hardly believe any Christian could even think it. We are saved by grace through faith in Christ's work...period!

 

[DJ2]

Nobody said that water baptism was not important or not commanded.
The issue at hand is what is its role or place in Christianity.

Mark 16:16 does not teach that water baptism is essential for salvation. It teaches that the discriminator between saved and not saved is belief or faith.

Furthermore, there is NO place in Scripture that even tangentially warns those who are not baptized that they are not saved never mind a blunt statement to this effect.
There are plenty of Scriptures dealing with faith and belief or lack of faith and belief with respect to salvation.

Baptism "teaches that the discriminator between saved and not saved is belief or faith".

That's what baptism teaches?

Can you explain this? I doubt you can.

 

[tribesman]

Baptized as a child by the greek orthodox church, I was told I ran across the table and jumped into the baptismal font. I was 2 years old and said "I want to be baptized"

Weird

Anyway, many seasons later when I was grown up the Mormons bewitched me with their spirit of false love. I was baptized with them, but after many years of biblical study I left them.

So what do I do now, what is the right church to get involved with. Most churches have gone into new age monstrosity. I've been to most churches in my area but they are so dilapidated.

Your baptism in the greek orthodox church is all fine. You are already baptized.

 

[hornetguy]

This doctrine is so anti-Christ and anti-the gospel that I can hardly believe any Christian could even think it. We are saved by grace through faith in Christ's work...period!

So, brother, do you think that if a person accepts Jesus as their savior, then does a "mic drop" and walks away, refusing to be baptized, they are saved? Even after the things that Jesus, and Peter, and others specifically told us to do?

If that is the case, then why be baptized at all? If it really doesn't matter, then why even do it at all?

And, then, if it really doesn't matter at all, then why did all believers do it, up until the time of the reformation, when man decided it wasn't really necessary?

In our search and study of scripture, we always try to get back as close as possible to the originals, because there has been less time elapsed where man can corrupt what was written...

Same thing with this.. Baptism was understood to be essential for centuries... then it somehow became UN-essential?

 

[graceNpeace]

So, brother, do you think that if a person accepts Jesus as their savior, then does a "mic drop" and walks away, refusing to be baptized, they are saved? Even after the things that Jesus, and Peter, and others specifically told us to do?

If that is the case, then why be baptized at all? If it really doesn't matter, then why even do it at all?

And, then, if it really doesn't matter at all, then why did all believers do it, up until the time of the reformation, when man decided it wasn't really necessary?

In our search and study of scripture, we always try to get back as close as possible to the originals, because there has been less time elapsed where man can corrupt what was written...

Same thing with this.. Baptism was understood to be essential for centuries... then it somehow became UN-essential?

Un-essential for what?
Who is claiming that water baptism is an optional extra?

What is being said is that water baptism does not save one - faith in Jesus Christ saves!

I am STRONGLY in favour of water baptism, but never for a moment should that be mistaken as a "requirement" for salvation.
Water baptism is CONSEQUENT to salvation not a requirement for salvation.

 

[graceNpeace]

Baptism "teaches that the discriminator between saved and not saved is belief or faith".

That's what baptism teaches?

Can you explain this? I doubt you can.

I don't disagree with this statement but it does not follow that just because the saved are water baptized that it means that water baptism is salvation.
This is just called putting the cart before the horse!

Furthermore, I am not ignorant of the beliefs of the Church of Christ, and also do not try to imply that there is "secret" knowledge involved in this.

 

[preacher4truth]

Faith regeneration? Nope.

Baptismal regeneration? Nope.

Spirit regeneration. Yep.

 

[DJ2]

I don't disagree with this statement but it does not follow that just because the saved are water baptized that it means that water baptism is salvation.
This is just called putting the cart before the horse!

Furthermore, I am not ignorant of the beliefs of the Church of Christ, and also do not try to imply that there is "secret" knowledge involved in this.

Where are you going with this post?? Now you are pulling the "Church of Christ" out of thin air. Can't you simply stick with what is written in the post? What do you mean by "secret knowledge"?

You are beginning to drift, stay focused.

 

[graceNpeace]

Where are you going with this post?? Now you are pulling the "Church of Christ" out of thin air. Can't you simply stick with what is written in the post? What do you mean by "secret knowledge"?

You are beginning to drift, stay focused.

Nothing wrong with my focus:
Water baptism does not save, and never has saved anyone!
Faith in Jesus Christ, on the other hand...

 

[Grace777x70]

So, brother, do you think that if a person accepts Jesus as their savior, then does a "mic drop" and walks away, refusing to be baptized, they are saved? Even after the things that Jesus, and Peter, and others specifically told us to do?

If that is the case, then why be baptized at all? If it really doesn't matter, then why even do it at all?

And, then, if it really doesn't matter at all, then why did all believers do it, up until the time of the reformation, when man decided it wasn't really necessary?

In our search and study of scripture, we always try to get back as close as possible to the originals, because there has been less time elapsed where man can corrupt what was written...

Same thing with this.. Baptism was understood to be essential for centuries... then it somehow became UN-essential?

You forgot the brown part in my quote and if someone doesn't get water baptized - they will not go to hell. It is a representation of an inward reality that occurred when we believed the message of Christ just like what happened in Acts 10 and Paul says the same thing in Eph. 1:13

I love water baptisms as I have said many times before and every Christian should do it but it is not for determining our eternal destination. Christ Himself is the Savior.

In their religion of "no one is regenerated or receives the remission of sins" until they get water baptized. This means that if someone dies before they get water baptized - they have no regeneration nor have received the remission of sins - which means they go to hell.

This doctrine is so anti-Christ and anti-the gospel that I can hardly believe any Christian could even think it. We are saved by grace through faith in Christ's work...period!

 

[fredoheaven]

Please note your sentence below:

"We have to note that those who already believed were already saved and by obedience were immediately baptized."

If Jesus knew that those who "already believed were already saved", why would He add the "and baptized will be saved" to Mark 16:16?

This simple question is being ignored.

The omission of a phrase, term or word does not equal a statement of mission. What you are attempting to do is invalidate what Jesus did say by noting by what He did not say. This is flawed reasoning. No one is required to present the negative to every positive they say or write.

When Jesus said "but whoever does not believe will be condemned.", He is not negating His earlier 8 words.

I have very well noted my sentence. Your simple question was not ignored of course, you only don’t want scriptures to teach you. Yep just hold for a moment and let me check your error my friend. The Bible says “and is baptized” not that what you are now claiming which is “and baptized…” which is literally incorrect! So something that happens before one is baptized. What was happened? They who believed the gospel are saved then immediately got baptized. So Jesus is correct! Not yours. They are explained by the Lord himself in many numerous accounts you wouldn’t dare hear or understand.

Let see the 2 clause if water holds your theology.

1. I did not invalidate what Jesus said. Those who got saved by believing the preaching of the gospel were immediately baptized. But to say, Jesus commanded them to “believe and baptized” to be saved as you claimed is not just true. Baptism was never a part of the gospel! The commission as recorded in the book of Mark is about “Going and Preaching” for what? Jesus said it is the gospel must be preached to every creature. The scripture of truth does not conform to your view. Jesus did not say the way you now phrased it. Certainly, Mark 16:16 is not a “statement of mission”; it is information.

2. Of course, Jesus is not negating his 8 earlier words. Should you only correctly decipher what He meant then I am sure there is no conflict to the overall teaching of Christ and his Apostles about salvation. Mark 16:16 maybe followed in this simple perspective. The passage literally says who will be damned, but…

IF I am SAVED then I am not DAMNED.
IF I am not DAMNED, then I am SAVED.
SO IF I BELIEVE NOT SHALL I BE DAMNED? YES…the scripture is clear John 3:18
AND THAT IF I BELIEVE SHALL I BE SAVED? YES…the scripture is clear Romans 1:16
NOW, IF I BELIEVE AND IS BAPTIZED SHALL I BE DAMNED? NO, Jesus said it!
BUT WHAT IF I BELIEVE AND NOT BAPTIZED SHALL I BE DAMNED? NO. We have so many Bible verses of waterless salvation.
BUT THEN AGAIN, IF I DO NOT BELIEVE BUT I AM WATER BAPTIZED SHALL I BE DAMNED? YES, water baptism has nothing to do in obtaining salvation. Ephesisans 1:13
THEREFORE, IF I BELIEVE AND EVEN WITHOUT WATER BAPTISM, I WILL NOT BE DAMNED AND I AM SAVED.

Ephesians 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

 

[Rainrider]

Baptized as a child by the greek orthodox church, I was told I ran across the table and jumped into the baptismal font. I was 2 years old and said "I want to be baptized"

Weird

Anyway, many seasons later when I was grown up the Mormons bewitched me with their spirit of false love. I was baptized with them, but after many years of biblical study I left them.

So what do I do now, what is the right church to get involved with. Most churches have gone into new age monstrosity. I've been to most churches in my area but they are so dilapidated.

You do understand that a church is not the building, it is the people. The idea of being baptized in a river is fine by any standard's. Was not Yeshua baptized in a river, many in the first century were. I do understand that some churchs do have a long list of actions you must under go, and test one must pass. Things were not always like that.
As a minister, I would say the act does not save a person. It is a way to say to the world you are giving yourself over to Yeshua. True salvation comes only by faith, followed by obedience. If a man dies on the side of the road, he gives his life to Yeshua beforehand, and is not baptized, is his salvation assured? Yes it is. Is Baptism being obedient? Yes it is.
Yet as I pointed out to one pastor, it does not, and should never, be seen as a test, or testament of allegiance to a church.
We don't follow that idea, and if a person come i off the street, asked to baptized, we do so. If they never return, that's fine. After all, they were showing their love of Yeshua, not the church.

 

[hornetguy]

I love water baptisms as I have said many times before and every Christian should do it but it is not for determining our eternal destination. Christ Himself is the Savior.

Yes, I know you do... we agree on what a great thing it is... where we differ is where we place the importance of it. I believe it is essential. Everyone that accepts Jesus' gift of salvation should be baptized... right then.

I also understand that there sometimes are circumstances that absolutely prohibit immediate baptism.. such as being in the middle of a firefight in war, being literally on your deathbed, etc.... ad nauseum... I believe in cases like that, we depend on our loving Father God to know our hearts and do what is loving and just.

But, to trivialize it to the point of "if you want to, fine, if you don't want to, that's ok, too...." is wrong. It is an essential part of a person's acceptance of the gift of salvation.... just as circumcision was an essential part of the acceptance of becoming Jewish and joining in the old covenant of Abraham and Moses.

Again, the act of baptizing does not "save" someone (IMO in my current understanding) .... salvation is a gift, it's free. We cannot earn it... but accepting the gift, and joining the new covenant requires our obedience to be baptized. It's important. Jesus said so.

 

[Grace777x70]

Yes, I know you do... we agree on what a great thing it is... where we differ is where we place the importance of it. I believe it is essential. Everyone that accepts Jesus' gift of salvation should be baptized... right then.

I also understand that there sometimes are circumstances that absolutely prohibit immediate baptism.. such as being in the middle of a firefight in war, being literally on your deathbed, etc.... ad nauseum... I believe in cases like that, we depend on our loving Father God to know our hearts and do what is loving and just.

But, to trivialize it to the point of "if you want to, fine, if you don't want to, that's ok, too...." is wrong. It is an essential part of a person's acceptance of the gift of salvation.... just as circumcision was an essential part of the acceptance of becoming Jewish and joining in the old covenant of Abraham and Moses.

Again, the act of baptizing does not "save" someone (IMO in my current understanding) .... salvation is a gift, it's free. We cannot earn it... but accepting the gift, and joining the new covenant requires our obedience to be baptized. It's important. Jesus said so.

I agree with you - "to trivialize it to the point of "if you want to, fine, if you don't want to, that's ok, too...." is wrong.

It is a great blessing that the Lord has given to bring to our remembrance of Him and His work. It has a role in the aspect of helping to "cleanse our conscience" too as Peter talked about. We can use water baptism to remind us that we too have died with Him and been raised to newness with Him.

Communion is in the same boat too. We get to have communion to "remember Him".

 

[DJ2]

Greetings brothers and sisters,

Those who hide their sins won't succeed but those who confess and give them up will receive mercy. Proverbs 28:13 CEB

It is quite clear from this verse that not hiding our sins is what makes us a success. It is the hiding of sin that limits our ability to prosper and receive mercy in this world and the next. God wants us to be open about the sin in our lives, it is this openness that grants us mercy.

Openness plus nothing = mercy.

To those who will look at the "and give them up" and insist that this is also commanded are just misguided.

If we are to "give them up" it would have been mentioned in the earlier clause. This omission proves that it is the "openness alone" that grants us both success and mercy. We are under no mandate to "give up" our sins. Anyone who suggest otherwise is a openness plus Judaizer.

Your Most Reverend Pastor,

Dr. Iokuok of the 1st Church of Openness



Same reasoning, different verse.

 

[hornetguy]

Un-essential for what?
Who is claiming that water baptism is an optional extra?

I haven't done a head count, but it seems that about 2/3 of the folks on here believe that.

Do a search on baptism... someone will start a thread about "I was saved, but was sprinkled" or, "I accepted Jesus 30 years ago and was never baptized... am I ok?"

Most of the answers say "Sure! You're just fine, baptism is only a symbol, baptism is only a shadow, baptism is just to show others you are saved, water baptism isn't what the scripture is talking about, if you were sprinkled as a baby, you're just fine"

Would those answers not sound to you like "no big deal, it doesn't really matter anyway" if you were the questioner?

 

[graceNpeace]

I haven't done a head count, but it seems that about 2/3 of the folks on here believe that.

Do a search on baptism... someone will start a thread about "I was saved, but was sprinkled" or, "I accepted Jesus 30 years ago and was never baptized... am I ok?"

Most of the answers say "Sure! You're just fine, baptism is only a symbol, baptism is only a shadow, baptism is just to show others you are saved, water baptism isn't what the scripture is talking about, if you were sprinkled as a baby, you're just fine"

Would those answers not sound to you like "no big deal, it doesn't really matter anyway" if you were the questioner?

Well surely you should be arguing with those folks about the importance of water baptism...

Muddying the waters in this thread where someone is pushing a false doctrine of baptismal regeneration is not a good way to address your concerns.