The Rapture
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No, He said He would appear "immediately after the tribulation of those days" meaning the extreme punishment of Jerusalem of 70 AD. The original question from Mt 24:3 asked when His Presence (parousia) would return?
If you read Acts 17, you will see that it is the wicked Jews in Thessalonica who were persecuting the church there so when Paul says this in 2 Thes 1, he is speaking about those Jews.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, [SUP]7 [/SUP]and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, [SUP]8 [/SUP]in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God.
Now, as Jews, those wicked Jewish religious leaders from Acts 17 would have returned to Jerusalem and would have been stuck there when the city was surrounded by Rome and therefore they perished too. This is how all of this fulfills scripture. You futurists keep trying to make it a multi-thousand year future and global event when it wasn't. It was very targeted.
I am none of these. The Bible teaches us that the great tribulation of Matthew 24 is the tribulation on the Jewish nation from c 70 ad onwards. Compare what Luke says
Luk 21:20
But when ye see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that her desolation is at hand.
Luk 21:21
Then let them that are in Judaea flee unto the mountains; and let them that are in the midst of her depart out; and let not them that are in the country enter therein.
Luk 21:22
For these are days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
Luk 21:23
Woe unto them that are with child and to them that give suck in those days! for there shall be great distress upon the land, and wrath unto this people.
Luk 21:24
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led captive into all the nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
There will of course be tribulation in the end times but it is not the great tribulation of Matth24. which was on the Jews. The Christians of the Middle East are suffering great tribulation (Rev 7) NOW.
Luk 21:20
But when ye see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that her desolation is at hand.
Luk 21:21
Then let them that are in Judaea flee unto the mountains; and let them that are in the midst of her depart out; and let not them that are in the country enter therein.
Luk 21:22
For these are days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
Luk 21:23
Woe unto them that are with child and to them that give suck in those days! for there shall be great distress upon the land, and wrath unto this people.
Luk 21:24
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led captive into all the nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
There will of course be tribulation in the end times but it is not the great tribulation of Matth24. which was on the Jews. The Christians of the Middle East are suffering great tribulation (Rev 7) NOW.
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No, the rapture happened ~ 70 AD right after the resurrection. The rapture was an assembly of living saints.
We are in the millennium now and I'm quite certain Satan is back on the loose deceiving the nations into thinking sin is good and righteousness is bad, just as He was doing throughout time until Rome was destroyed.
We are in the millennium now and I'm quite certain Satan is back on the loose deceiving the nations into thinking sin is good and righteousness is bad, just as He was doing throughout time until Rome was destroyed.
What really bothers me about these guys, is that they purposely ignore, circumvent and distort common sense scriptures and the fact that they can never admit that they are wrong. Most of their apologetics and excuses are the most ridiculous things I've ever heard!
I truly wish that everyone was on the same page regarding the word of God, but scripture does say that "the time is coming (and is here) when people will not put up with sound doctrine. But instead to suit their own desires they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will abandon the truth and turn aside to myths."
I truly wish that everyone was on the same page regarding the word of God, but scripture does say that "the time is coming (and is here) when people will not put up with sound doctrine. But instead to suit their own desires they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will abandon the truth and turn aside to myths."
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They should understand that, the only event that happens after the millennium will be the great white throne judgment. After that is the new heaven, new earth and new Jerusalem. In addition to this, in the letter to the church of Thyatira and to all who overcome, the promise is that those who overcome will rule over the nations with a rod of iron, which would have to be referring to the millennial period.
Let's try this AHW and Popeye, J7 and whoever else. Baby steps.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, “Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
What "wrath to come" was John talking about? Be very specific. Who was getting the wrath and when do they get it?
[SUP]7 [/SUP]But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, “Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
What "wrath to come" was John talking about? Be very specific. Who was getting the wrath and when do they get it?