The Rapture

[J7]

So then we see the 12 tribes as Jewels in a crown, (check Rev 12)

16 And the Lord their God shall save them in that day as the flock of his people: for they shall be as the stones of a crown, lifted up as an ensign upon his land.

 

[J7]

We see the Church pitted against The Greeks, i.e Hellenistic Judaism, (see Romans 1-2)

and raised up thy sons, O Zion, against thy sons, O Greece, and made thee as the sword of a mighty man.

 

[J7]

In Zechariah 11 I understand it to mean this:

When Christ came all Israel was unified. The Northern Tribes who had been expelled from Israel in 731BC were reunited with Judah, as per the two sticks of Judah and Ephraim. This reunited the Kingship, Judah/David, with the birthright, Ephraim. (Zech 9:12 12 Turn you to the strong hold, ye prisoners of hope: even to day do I declare that I will render double unto thee

The prisoners of hope were the Northern Tribes, who God in Hosea had promised one day to remarry. The double blessing is the birthright - see Genesis 49

 

[J7]

The Old Covenant was an ugly covenant for ugly people, the New Covenant is a beautiful covenant for beautiful people.

Isaiah 52

7
How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!

 

[KJV1611]

In Zechariah 11 I understand it to mean this:

When Christ came all Israel was unified. The Northern Tribes who had been expelled from Israel in 731BC were reunited with Judah, as per the two sticks of Judah and Ephraim. This reunited the Kingship, Judah/David, with the birthright, Ephraim. (Zech 9:12 12 Turn you to the strong hold, ye prisoners of hope: even to day do I declare that I will render double unto thee

The prisoners of hope were the Northern Tribes, who God in Hosea had promised one day to remarry. The double blessing is the birthright - see Genesis 49

So Zechariah 11 wasn't the end of the old covenant for Israel or Judah?

 

[J7]

Judah and Jerusalem were being punished for the sins of the fathers. Daniel 9:16

16 O Lord, according to all thy righteousness, I beseech thee, let thine anger and thy fury be turned away from thy city Jerusalem, thy holy mountain: because for our sins, and for the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and thy people are become a reproach to all that are about us.

Matthew 23

35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

Under the New Covenant, the sons are not punished for the sins of the father, so it stands to reason that the New Covenant only truly came into existence after the punishment of Judah, AD67-73.

27 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man, and with the seed of beast.
28 And it shall come to pass, that like as I have watched over them, to pluck up, and to break down, and to throw down, and to destroy, and to afflict; so will I watch over them, to build, and to plant, saith the Lord.
29 In those days they shall say no more, The fathers have eaten a sour grape, and the children's teeth are set on edge.
30 But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.

 

[J7]

Paul never actually said that the Law was dead, he said it was alive, but we are dead to it.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death

 

[J7]

But what Zechariah 11 is saying is that the New Covenant was for all Israel.

Those who rejected it, the Beauty, were broken off.

So the apostate Jews were broken off from the reunited Whole House of Israel, aka the Church, and from the New Covenant, and cast in the fire

 

[KJV1611]

Paul never actually said that the Law was dead, he said it was alive, but we are dead to it.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death

I agree the law was and is valid.

 

[J7]

The OC is Leah, and the NC is Rachel

 

[KJV1611]

Isaiah 26:19 KJV
[19] Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

What is the futurist view of this verse?

 

[heartofdavid]

Who is the Bride?

Ruth,in the book of Ruth,she is the gentile bride.
She married boaz(Jesus)
She has a Jewish mother in law Naomi from a previous marriage (brought into the Jewish family,but a gentile from Moab)

Vivid typology here.

 

[tourist]

Ruth,in the book of Ruth,she is the gentile bride.
She married boaz(Jesus)
She has a Jewish mother in law Naomi from a previous marriage (brought into the Jewish family,but a gentile from Moab)

Vivid typology here.

I hardly think that Ruth married Jesus in disguise.

 

[PlainWord]

No. WRONG. Sorry PW, it has to be said. You are misreading Paul

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

I haven't met a futurist yet with an ounce of spiritual insight. You all keep thinking, body, body, body. God is the God of the living, not the dead. Until you figure out that it is the soul that is clothed with the body (first the physical, then the spiritual), you will continue in your error. The physical decayed, dead, returned-to-dust, flesh and blood body doesn't put on the new body. The soul puts on the new body.

Christ had the only physical body that did not face corruption. He was the lone exception.

 

[Bogadile]

1 Corinthians 15:42-44 (YLT)
[SUP]1Co 15:42 [/SUP] So also is the rising again of the dead: it is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption;
[SUP]43 [/SUP] it is sown in dishonour, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power;
[SUP]44 [/SUP] it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body; there is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body;


1 Corinthians 15:51 (NASB)
[SUP]1Co 15:51 [/SUP] Behold, I tell you a mystery; we will not all sleep,
but we will all be changed,


1 Corinthians 15:53 (NASB)
[SUP]1Co 15:53 [/SUP] For this perishable must put on the imperishable,
and this mortal must put on immortality.

How much more plain can it get? There must be something wrong if one cannot see this. Our bodies will be raised into immortality, imperishable and glorified bodies.

 

[Bogadile]

I haven't met a futurist yet with an ounce of spiritual insight. You all keep thinking, body, body, body.

Gnostics tend to think, spirit spirit spirit, so that argument is a deadend street.

 

[valiant]

Ruth,in the book of Ruth,she is the gentile bride.
She married boaz(Jesus)
She has a Jewish mother in law Naomi from a previous marriage (brought into the Jewish family,but a gentile from Moab)

Vivid typology here.

For those who vainly try to use typology as meaningful. You can prove anything from typology.

 

[Snoozy]

if u who are reading this are thinking about whats da right view. ask yourself this question: whos got all da answers? whos got countless verses they cant explain? people who believed israel would return to the land in 1800 were considered nuts but look now here is israel back in the land. u will never go wrong by just believing the bible, even if it seems unbelievable.

 

[J7]

Absolute unmitigated tosh. I have been vehemently historicist for innumerable posts, as it is my long time conviction, so to call me a futurist which doctrine I loathe Utterly is a strange thing. Either you pay zero attention which would be worrying, or you are being perverse.

regards your new funky doctrine. Thomas pressed Jesus's wounds. Simples.

I haven't met a futurist yet with an ounce of spiritual insight. You all keep thinking, body, body, body. God is the God of the living, not the dead. Until you figure out that it is the soul that is clothed with the body (first the physical, then the spiritual), you will continue in your error. The physical decayed, dead, returned-to-dust, flesh and blood body doesn't put on the new body. The soul puts on the new body.

Christ had the only physical body that did not face corruption. He was the lone exception.

 

[KJV1611]

if u who are reading this are thinking about whats da right view. ask yourself this question: whos got all da answers? whos got countless verses they cant explain? people who believed israel would return to the land in 1800 were considered nuts but look now here is israel back in the land. u will never go wrong by just believing the bible, even if it seems unbelievable.

Do you think the verses below are future?

Isaiah 27:10-11 KJV
[10] Yet the defenced city shall be desolate, and the habitation forsaken, and left like a wilderness: there shall the calf feed, and there shall he lie down, and consume the branches thereof.

[11] When the boughs thereof are withered, they shall be broken off: the women come, and set them on fire: for it is a people of no understanding: therefore he that made them will not have mercy on them, and he that formed them will shew them no favour.