Not By Works

[UnderGrace]

Haven't lost any sleep over the answer.

Well maybe you should...it is important to know.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

PLEASE BE NICE AND POST THE SCRIPTURE THAT DOES NOT EXIST.

Thanks.

I did, John 3, and John 6

John 3 Whoever believes in me has eternal life (ffaith no works)

John 6, Whoever believes in me (no works mentioned or required)will never hunger or thirst, Never die, Live forever, HAS eternal life and will be raised on the last day.

Oh and for good measure Jesus made it clear when the people asked God what work they could do to do the works of God.

"it is the work of God we believe (have faith) in the one he sent"

 

[NoNameMcgee]

 

[Seohce]

What are the commandments of God in the New Covenant? What is the faith of Jesus - that He has redeemed us from the law. That He depended on His Father and now we too depend on Jesus Himself for all things. That all the Law , prophets and Psalms speak of Him.

Galatians 4:4-6 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] But when the fullness of the time came, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the Law,

[SUP]5 [/SUP] so that He might redeem those who were under the Law, that we might receive the adoption as sons.

[SUP]6 [/SUP] Because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, "Abba! Father!"

Here is an excellent article addressing "Just what are the commandments of Jesus?"

( Hint: it has nothing to do with following the Sabbath day as in the Old Testament way which was a "shadow" of things to come - but it has everything to do with the true Sabbath rest which is found in Christ Himself )

I like to use this site from time to time as it gives a grace-based view of the finished work of Christ. it also has a place at the bottom where people can ask questions. I have found I have learned much from that area too.

John 14:15 – The Commands of Jesus

If God loves us unconditionally, how do we account for those scriptures that link His love with our obedience, like this one:

“If you love me, you will keep my commandments.” (Jn 14:15)

A legalist reads this backwards: “You will keep my commandments if you love me.”

In other words, we must prove our love for God by doing what He commands.

Commandment-keeping is our duty, a condition we must meet if we are to enjoy His love.

But someone who is walking in grace reads it just as Jesus said it. He understands that keeping His commands is a by-product of love.

Paul explains this in Romans 8:3-4, but let me give you an everyday example inspired by something I read.

"Here in New Zealand we have a big problem with domestic violence. Consequently, there are many laws governing the responsibilities of fathers. Break any of these laws and you might go to jail or have your kids taken away.

It’s a serious business. But to be honest, I couldn’t tell you what these laws are. I’ve never read them. Yet I can confidently declare that I am keeping every one of these laws.

How do I know? Because I love my kids. I don’t keep the laws to show the authorities that I love my kids and I don’t relate to my children on the basis of these laws. I relate to them on the basis of love and keeping the laws of the land flows naturally from that love relationship.

I know the laws serve a good purpose, but they weren’t written for me. They were written for fathers who don’t love their kids."

Similarly, the laws found in the Bible were not written for those who love Jesus (1 Tim 1:9). Contrary to what the legalist may tell you, keeping the laws to earn what He freely offers is a surefire sign that you don’t know the love of God.

A legalist reads the words of Jesus above and sees a threat. Do the commandments or else! But love makes no threats. Jesus is returning for a bride and it won’t be a shotgun wedding.

What are the commands of Jesus?

The next time someone tells you that you must keep the commands of Jesus to prove your love, ask them, “what are the commands of Jesus?”

They will probably respond with the greatest commandment which is, “love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind and soul” (Mt 22:38). This is fine, I guess.

But if you insert that command into the phrase above it becomes, “If you love me, you will love me with all your heart, mind and soul,” which is kind of redundant.

If you read John 14:15 in context, you will see that on this occasion Jesus is referring to two specific commands. Here’s the first:

“A new command I give you: Love one another….” (Jn 13:34)

And here’s the second:

“Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God; trust also in me… Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves” (Jn 14:1,11)

How can we be certain that these are His commandments? Because John – who was there when Jesus spoke these words – says so in one of his letters:

“And this is His command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as He commanded us.” (1 Jn 3:23)

What does it mean to keep His commands?

Lest we dilute His commandments to accommodate our experience, Jesus outlines His expectations of obedience for both. Here’s what He expects from the first:

“As I have loved you, so you must love one another.” (Jn 13:34)

How did Jesus love us? By laying down His life for us (Jn 15:3). That’s a high standard of love! Indeed, there is no greater love. And what are His expectations regarding the second commandment:

“I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these…” (Jn 14:12)

Believe in Jesus and you will do the works of Jesus. Put it altogether and Jesus is saying this:

“If you love me, you will love one another as I have loved you and your faith in me will lead to miracles like I have been doing and greater miracles still.”

If you’ve been in any church for at least five years, you will know that Jesus’ first commandment is pretty much humanly impossible to keep, while the second commandment is definitely impossible.

So the next time someone tries to lay a heavy burden on you by telling you that you must keep Jesus’ commandments to earn God’s love, just ask them how many people they’ve raised from the dead!

When they look puzzled, tell them that Jesus commanded us to believe in Him and He said that those who did would do the same works He did and greater works besides!

Now that we begin to understand what Jesus wasn’t saying – He wasn’t saying that we need to keep His commandments to prove our love – we’re ready to dig deeper into what He was saying.

That’s the subject of the next post. You won’t want to miss it. When you see what Jesus was promising His disciples and you, it’s going to blow you away!

Maybe you’ve been intimidated by John 14:15 and the other new covenant laws. If so, prepare to be set free. When you get a hold of the words of Jesus you’re going to be so pumped that you’ll want to frame them and hang them on your wall. Stay tuned!

Unquote:

Here is the link if anyone wants to look at the questions or to see the next post as he mentioned at the end of the article.

https://escapetoreality.org/2011/06/03/john-14v15/

A total lie and blasphemy. You seem to have unmasked the real wolf in you. It's brighter than your blue sky. A true Christian need not be informed or warned of this kind of deception and blasphemy. I don't even need to refute or disprove this kind of rejection and dishonor to God.

These statements clearly prove that they teach disobedience and rebellion to God who commanded us to OBEY & TO SUBMIT.

Luke 6:45 The good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For out of the overflow of his heart his mouth speaks.

 

[UnderGrace]

I ate fish, chicken, cheese and so many other yummy things!!

I love pasta, don't get me wrong but it is not worth my health.

You were in Italy and didn't have pasta?

WHAT DID YOU EAT !!!!!!!!!!

JK

 

[eternally-gratefull]

LOL

Can't you even control your iPad??
That's what you get for buying an Apple.

Mine cost $99.
It doesn't auto-correct!

It is a work ipad. I would never buy Apple.. I own a google phone, But do not use it to talk here, (minutes) and would rather type on my microsoft computer..

 

[blue_ladybug]

The word "believe" does NOT mean "obey". I could believe in little green aliens, but I wouldn't obey them.. LOL


FTR, I don't believe in aliens..

 

[FranC]

I agree. Both of you do it to each other. The one who can see it is blessed because they didn't see it with blind human eyes. The one who sees it and confesses it is the one walking in the light and giving an honest assessment of themselves.

Walking in the light doesn't mean being perfect. Walking in the light means seeing clearly and giving a truthful assessment of things. From that little bit of honesty we ask for what we need, He makes the necessary changes to bring about our renewal, and then we are ready to bear more of the beams of love. We didn't make ourselves able to bear more of them because we can try for decades to obey because we know we should and find years later that we were stupidly spinning our wheels (been there.)

Fran is not without some honesty too because she answered Rosemary and said: yes, I wish we could act this way toward each other, ME INCLUDED.

Stones just took you another part of the way from that hunger for righteousness fran earlier expressed when she said, neither of us is acting right.

Going by my own experience, the problem for me is usually a lack of love. But we have to see it first and admit it, confess it. Because a man who thinks he doesn't need help is not going to do the very simple work of ASKING anyone for what he lacks. He will say, I am rich and in need of nothing instead of admitting his poverty of spirit and pleading for what he has need of.

You are not blessed because you ARE poor in spirit. You are blessed because you can SEE and ADMIT that you are, because that blessing of seeing the truth IS a blessing from God.

Stones, it is such freedom to walk this way, in the light, instead of in defense of ourself as if we are not just like our fellow in poverty. A man said, you never know what a burden your "reputation" is until you have the freedom of having no reputation to protect.

We won't have any victory until we ask for what we see we lack. All will just go on in the same manner. It's the one who sees and admits their poverty and weakness who will go away justified. And since that one was true and honest with a little, he will be given more.

I'm very encouraged and edified by your example of honesty here Stones. And by frans earlier lament and hunger for righteousness. You are both in poverty/lack of spirit - we all are - but His strength is made perfect in our weakness, so we should glory in our weakness like baby birds in a nest crying out for what they need and cannot supply for themselves.

It is strange to go from defense of self to glorying in our weakness but once we begin to see the riches and wealth of spirit He is willing to give us freely if we will walk in the light of truth about ourselves, we won't want to go back or shrink from the light of truth ever again! Who would have ever thought that the way to strength is through glorying in our weakness and poverty?? It's not the way the world works!

Paul was onto a great discovery when he said, therefore I will glory in my weakness! He had found the way up was by going down!

Hi SG

I read the above and I agee with it.

I do need to say this, which will explain why I'm here:

Some persons her are expousing some very Dangerous ideas.

I've taught our faith so I feel a little responsible when I read incorrect doctrine.

NOW,,, you make ask how I know that I AM RIGHT and the Others are wrong.

If a person could say that all we need is faith and we're to do nothing else for God, it seems to me that it's easy to know that they're making incorrect statements. All one needs to do is read their bible. IT speaks the truth !!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I know this PHart.
Believe and Obey come from the same source word.

Just because I don't like going to the Greek, doesn't mean I know nothing about.

THIS IS WHY NO ONE HERE WILL EVERY EXPLAIN WHAT BELIEVE MEANS....

Although they'll go to the Greek for any other word that they think will be of help to them ...
Even if NOTHING comes of it because the translators did a pretty good job.

really? Can you prove this?

 

[LoveGodForever]

Maybe you are?

The Gospel is the "good news" of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16). If you do not know and BELIEVE the true Gospel (Romans 1:16) then you do not believe God's Word. [/SIZE]

These scriptures you quoted are a very important part of the Gospel (Good News) but friend it does not end there. What was Jesus preaching after His Baptism by John? The "Gospel" my friend was being preached before the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus (go see; Mark 1:15; 8:35; Matt4:23; Matt 9:35; 11:5; 24:14; Luke 4:18; 7:22; 20:11). The Good New (Gospel) is Jesus and Jesus is the Word of God. It is the Word of God that is the Gospel that we are to live by every word of it not just some we like to cheery pick because it suits us . (Matt 4:4; John 1-1-4; John 3:16).

 

[FranC]

It is a work ipad. I would never buy Apple.. I own a google phone, But do not use it to talk here, (minutes) and would rather type on my microsoft computer..

Yeah. Give me a nice big keyboard every time. I type over 75 words a minute. Sometimes my keyboard can't keep up with me.

Your post before just made me laugh and laugh.
My granddaughter has an iPad and it auto-corrects and it makes me crazy!

I have to type on that thing AND make sure it writes what I tell it to--- like it has a mind of its own.

Oh, dontcha love technology?

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I ate fish, chicken, cheese and so many other yummy things!!

I love pasta, don't get me wrong but it is not worth my health.

Is antipasto salad Italian or greek? Wait, it's...Italian. It's yummy!! A little meat, salami and olives and salad, cheese. I'm salivating! If I lived in Italy, I'd eat it every day!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Do the no-workers for have a problem with English?

WHEN did PHart EVER say that our works are getting us saved?

We ALL maintain that FAITH saves.

Seems easy. Maybe people hear what they want to hear and not what is being said...

1. If faith saves, Works should not be required because the bible says ALL who have faith work.
2. If faith saves, And the bible says ALL who have faith, will do works. Then salvation could never be lost. Because faith is always active
3. If he really believed that, he would not be agreeing with you about works maintaining salvation, and would not be fighting against people who teach faith saves, and works are a result of faith. He would be standing with us.

You all can deny you teach works 1000 times, It will not convince anyone who reads what you post with an open mind (it may convince people who agree with you, but that's about it.

 

[FranC]

Well maybe you should...it is important to know.

NO it's NOT.

Why is it important????

 

[NoNameMcgee]

believe

accept (something) as true; feel sure of the truth of



◄ 4100. pisteuó ►
Strong's Concordance
pisteuó: to believe, entrust
Original Word: πιστεύω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: pisteuó
Phonetic Spelling: (pist-yoo'-o)
Short Definition: I believe, have faith in
Definition: I believe, have faith in, trust in; pass: I am entrusted with.

 

[FranC]

1. If faith saves, Works should not be required because the bible says ALL who have faith work.
2. If faith saves, And the bible says ALL who have faith, will do works. Then salvation could never be lost. Because faith is always active
3. If he really believed that, he would not be agreeing with you about works maintaining salvation, and would not be fighting against people who teach faith saves, and works are a result of faith. He would be standing with us.

You all can deny you teach works 1000 times, It will not convince anyone who reads what you post with an open mind (it may convince people who agree with you, but that's about it.

EG

Get off that ipad.

Read back what you wrote above....
Get off the wine...

I can't even reply to it !!!

JK (i think)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Who do you follow?

THE FIRST LIE IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN

Gen 3:1,

Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?


Gen 3:2-3,
And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.


Gen 3:4,
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

Gen 3:5,
God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Key points from scripture:


· The original deceiver the devil (v1)
· Eve told the serpent that God commanded them not to touch or eat the fruit lest they die (v 2-3)
· The serpent lied to Eve saying that you will not surely die if you don’t do what God asks. You will be like God knowing good and evil (v 4-5).

Putting it all together:

The fall of mankind was from the original lie (John 8:44; 1John 3:8). When God commanded mankind to follow him lest they die. The Devil’’s original lie was that you can break God’s Law and not die. The teachings of many false religions today is the same as the original lie. If God asks us to do something and you do not do it…. “Ye shall not surely die” (Gen 3:4). But God's Word says we will die if we break God's Law (Rom 6:23). Who do we follow God or man?


God bless you all

Thats why we need grace because all have sinned, continue to sin, and are sinning and fall short.(remember it takes just one sin)

so are you teaching law or grace?

 

[UnderGrace]

Yes and please tell me how we are to live by every word of it?

These scriptures you quoted are a very important part of the Gospel (Good News) but friend it does not end there. What was Jesus preaching after His Baptism by John? The "Gospel" my friend was being preached before the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus (go see; Mark 1:15; 8:35; Matt4:23; Matt 9:35; 11:5; 24:14; Luke 4:18; 7:22; 20:11). The Good New (Gospel) is Jesus and Jesus is the Word of God. It is the Word of God that is the Gospel that we are to live by every word of it not just some we like to cheery pick because it suits us . (Matt 4:4; John 1-1-4; John 3:16).

 

[FranC]

Is antipasto salad Italian or greek? Wait, it's...Italian. It's yummy!! A little meat, salami and olives and salad, cheese. I'm salivating! If I lived in Italy, I'd eat it every day!

Something like this is also Greek. They put that Greek cheese in the salad.
It's really good.

I'm trying to lose 10 pounds.
Leave me alone!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yeah. Give me a nice big keyboard every time. I type over 75 words a minute. Sometimes my keyboard can't keep up with me.

Your post before just made me laugh and laugh.
My granddaughter has an iPad and it auto-corrects and it makes me crazy!

I have to type on that thing AND make sure it writes what I tell it to--- like it has a mind of its own.

Oh, dontcha love technology?

what is sad is when I write a service report and then weeks later read it, and I can;t tell what I said because it auto corrected..

I wonder what customers think?