The Rapture

[Locutus]

They never were God's chosen people. God's chosen people have always been the children of the promise and NEVER the children of the flesh.

That's debatable - covenantally the nation was a "chosen nation"

Deu 7:6 For you are a holy people to the LORD your God; the LORD your God has chosen you to be a people for His own possession out of all the peoples who are on the face of the earth.

 

[Locutus]

Rubbish, it has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

...........this is where you are going wrong....

I got to wash me Jag before it gets too late.


Don't go away, don't touch that mouse, I'll be right back to sort out these messages

 

[VCO]

PLW taunting VCO:

No, he does not make me mad. Believe me I have been taunted FAR, FAR, WORSE, than Plainword has ever treated me. Yes we reach the level of heated discussion, but I thank him for helping me keep my sword sharp. His mixed up understanding only makes me SAD for him.

 

[VCO]

. . .

. . .

You are just Showing your age. You must have heard the reruns of that old Radio show when you were kid, just like I did.

[video=youtube;iKp7x7mOJ_s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKp7x7mOJ_s[/video]

 

[Locutus]

No need to feel sad for PLO, he ditched dispen-sensationalism for a much better understanding - too bad you can't see the errors in what you are promoting.

 

[Denadii]

I just started to study the rapture and the tribulation few days ago. I came across what every Christian is debating about. I alone believe in the mid tribulation rapture. I just want to get your view on this if you are pre-trib, mid-trib or post-trib rapture believer. THANKS AND GOD BLESS

No matter what you believe, Pre, Mid or Post, I believe you will see the Rapture happen within the year. I know, I know, You cannot know the day nor the hour. But you CAN know the year and the season. Read the signs.

I welcome your answer but keep your hate to yourself.

 

[Ahwatukee]

No matter what you believe, Pre, Mid or Post, I believe you will see the Rapture happen within the year. I know, I know, You cannot know the day nor the hour. But you CAN know the year and the season. Read the signs.

I welcome your answer but keep your hate to yourself.

Well, if Lord gathers the church within the year, and I hope he does, then mid and post trib are right out the window and that because the tribulation hasn't begun yet.

 

[KJV1611]

They are not necessary the dead "saints" - the host of heaven has been in "battle" before - the NASB and NIV translate this as "holy ones":

it was also about these men that Enoch, in the seventh generation from Adam, prophesied, saying, “Behold, the Lord came with many thousands of His holy ones,

You only need to look back in the old testament to see "thousands" of "chariots" with the lord:

2 kings 6:17 Then Elisha prayed and said, “O LORD, I pray, open his eyes that he may see.” And the LORD opened the servant’s eyes and he saw; and behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha.

Read the account around Elisha

So to try use Jude is very debatable.

Yep, it's pointless to debate some one who doesn't believe in the inerrant word of God... if one bible doesn't fit your doctrine just find the one that does.

 

[J7]

The destruction of Jerusalem is indeed of huge importance. I am surprised anyone denies that. Jesus prophesied about it 3 times.

It is also pertinent to understand that it was what modernists call (the) Great Tribulation

Rubbish, it has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

 

[KJV1611]

The destruction of Jerusalem is indeed of huge importance. I am surprised anyone denies that. Jesus prophesied about it 3 times.

It is also pertinent to understand that it was what modernists call (the) Great Tribulation

What was the importance of the destruction of the temple?

 

[J7]

Yes, but it is a staged event, not a continuous one, and it is now wholly awaiting a future fulfilment

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

The Preterist position is somewhat lunatic because neither me nor any other Christian I know of walks through walls

It's not passed J7 but it has started.

 

[J7]

I am still fathoming it.
Will reply in due course

What was the importance of the destruction of the temple?

 

[J7]

Originally Posted by KJV1611
What was the importance of the destruction of the temple?

I will add more to the answer in due course

1) it was the fulfilment of Daniel's 70th week, and in particular marked the midpoint of the week when the sacrificial system was terminated

2) It marked the end of 40 years of grace for apostate Israel, showing that God is a God of Mercy, and that he extends mercy to all, even when Justice demands blood

3) it marked the discontinuation of the Old Covenant

4) it was prophesied by Christ on 3 occasions in his last week before being crucified

 

[J7]

5) it was the great justification of the Church. The Church had battled antiChrist Jerusalem for 40 years. Jerusalem claimed that Jesus was not God. In AD 67-73 God delivered a verdict when much like when Elijah faced off the prophets of Baal, God torched Judah and Jerusalem but saved the Church, thereby giving a divine verdict that would have reverberated around the Roman Empire. The Roman Empire was the channel through which the Church had been seeded

 

[J7]

6) it cut the umbilical cord. The RCC (prophesied in Daniel and Revelation) could never have emerged while the Temple existed

 

[Persuaded]

Well, this has been a real education for me.
I had no idea that there were so many strange beliefs about the gathering of the saints.
It seems to me that most will be shock and disbelief when the end time events begin.

 

[Snoozy]

Yep, it's pointless to debate some one who doesn't believe in the inerrant word of God... if one bible doesn't fit your doctrine just find the one that does.

yeah this is what they do look out. some preachers even switch translations they quote in the middle of dey sermon to fit da doctrine they want. and if no translation fits in english they go back to tha greek and retranslate it while not even speaking greek u drop these bozos off into greece and they cant even get to da closest gyro shop.

 

[PlainWord]

I don't see it as much as given to the Gentiles (I know Jesus stated such) - the promises were to the remnant of Israel, Paul said they were receiving it i.e salvation and the kingdom.

Gentiles were/are grafted in to the true vine Christ. The reason the "church" is predominantly Gentile is because the remnant after 70 AD were a minority and "losing ground" as the nations received the gospel.

So in a sense the kingdom was given to a "nation bearing fruits" consisting at that time of the remnant and Gentiles

The "chosen status" was lost to the spiritual heirs of Abraham, both Jew (first) and then the Gentiles.

I'd agree with that. When I said "Gentile", I meant "Church" which consisted of both Gentile and Jews. The Church has the new covenant, again which includes both. Salvation is of the Jews and came first to the Jews.

I think the fact that Israel was restored to her Land and the way it happened and the way they have been protected tell me God is not finished with them yet. I also believe we are nearing the end of our age.

 

[PlainWord]

@PlainWord & friends

The resurrection is the translation of mortal flesh to eternal flesh. When it happens we will be literally able to walk in the heavens with Jesus.

This event has not happened PW.

[SUP]50 [/SUP]Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Corruptible flesh DOES NOT become incorrupt. READ IT AGAIN. Our old body DOES NOT inherit a NEW BODY!!

[SUP]37 [/SUP]And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be...

See that? The body being sown (buried) is NOT the body that will rise. What rises is a new spiritual body.

[SUP]38 [/SUP]But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him...

What is the "it?" "It" is the soul!!!! It is the soul that sleeps, not the body. The body is an old rag that decays and returns to dust, from whence it came.

The old body, decays, rots, returns to dust. Its molecules are absorbed by plants, which are eaten by animals which are eaten by people which became part of the new person. Or, they turn to oil, are burned in cars and breathed in and absorbed by other flesh. Some bodies are cremated and go up in smoke with the few ashes perhaps scattered. In a nuclear blast like those in 1945 Japan, bodies are literally disintegrated, the matter turning to energy. These "bodies" aren't being raised.

[SUP]39 [/SUP]All flesh is not the same flesh:

I assure you, not one molecule of our old bodies will be present in our new bodies. Our new bodies are heavenly bodies, made for the spiritual realm, and from the spiritual realm. What is rising is the soul that was trapped in Hades. Do you really think you could see a soul come out of the ground and be clothed (as Paul puts it) in a spiritual invisible body? If you think this, you might want to reconsider.

[SUP]18 [/SUP]While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Will our new body be eternal or temporal?

 

[KJV1611]

[SUP]50 [/SUP]Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Corruptible flesh DOES NOT become incorrupt. READ IT AGAIN. Our old body DOES NOT inherit a NEW BODY!!

[SUP]37 [/SUP]And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be...

See that? The body being sown (buried) is NOT the body that will rise. What rises is a new spiritual body.

[SUP]38 [/SUP]But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him...

What is the "it?" "It" is the soul!!!! It is the soul that sleeps, not the body. The body is an old rag that decays and returns to dust, from whence it came.

The old body, decays, rots, returns to dust. Its molecules are absorbed by plants, which are eaten by animals which are eaten by people which became part of the new person. Or, they turn to oil, are burned in cars and breathed in and absorbed by other flesh. Some bodies are cremated and go up in smoke with the few ashes perhaps scattered. In a nuclear blast like those in 1945 Japan, bodies are literally disintegrated, the matter turning to energy. These "bodies" aren't being raised.

[SUP]39 [/SUP]All flesh is not the same flesh:

I assure you, not one molecule of our old bodies will be present in our new bodies. Our new bodies are heavenly bodies, made for the spiritual realm, and from the spiritual realm. What is rising is the soul that was trapped in Hades. Do you really think you could see a soul come out of the ground and be clothed (as Paul puts it) in a spiritual invisible body? If you think this, you might want to reconsider.

[SUP]18 [/SUP]While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Will our new body be eternal or temporal?

What about Jesus body PW was his old body raised?

Isaiah 26:19 KJV
[19] Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

This is the Old Testament mate to Matthews resurrection story. The