Not By Works
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Hi SOF,
I appreciated your thoughts but the bible is very clear and of course I do not say this without studying the Word of God. You should know me by now
The facts are these;
1. Judas was one of the 12 disciples. You cannot be one of the 12 disciples without being a believer
2. He for a time was following Jesus and put in a responsibility of trust.
3. He was given the Holy Spirit and went out preaching the Gospel
3. He believed Jesus then he betrayed and fell away from Jesus and went back into the world. He was a believer that left God.
Scripture proof line upon line:
Matt 10:1-5; Matt 26:14; Luke 22:48; 23:3; Heb 6:4-8; Heb 10:26-27; John 15:1-10; John 14:15
God bless
I appreciated your thoughts but the bible is very clear and of course I do not say this without studying the Word of God. You should know me by now
The facts are these;
1. Judas was one of the 12 disciples. You cannot be one of the 12 disciples without being a believer
2. He for a time was following Jesus and put in a responsibility of trust.
3. He was given the Holy Spirit and went out preaching the Gospel
3. He believed Jesus then he betrayed and fell away from Jesus and went back into the world. He was a believer that left God.
Scripture proof line upon line:
Matt 10:1-5; Matt 26:14; Luke 22:48; 23:3; Heb 6:4-8; Heb 10:26-27; John 15:1-10; John 14:15
God bless
Sheep make it, but dogs and pigs don't make it.
Compare 2 Peter 1:4 - "partakers of the divine nature," having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356 that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - they escaped the pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word) of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."
Corruption (Strongs #5356) (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. Internal corruption.
Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393) ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the outside (2 Peter 2:20). But true believers have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).
Corruption is deeper than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is decay on the inside. True believers have received a new nature, a divine nature, and they have new and different appetites and desires. They have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20.
Having the knowledge of Jesus Christ, even the more intimate knowledge of "epignosis," does not save a person if there is no heart submission to that knowledge. For epignosis to be of any spiritual value, there must be a heart submission to that knowledge. A person who rejects this knowledge will be more accountable at the judgment. Peter did not mention that those who escaped the "pollutions of the world" through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, were "partakers of the divine nature," "born again" or "saved."
Compare 2 Peter 1:4 - "partakers of the divine nature," having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356 that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - they escaped the pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word) of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."
Corruption (Strongs #5356) (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. Internal corruption.
Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393) ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the outside (2 Peter 2:20). But true believers have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).
Corruption is deeper than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is decay on the inside. True believers have received a new nature, a divine nature, and they have new and different appetites and desires. They have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20.
Having the knowledge of Jesus Christ, even the more intimate knowledge of "epignosis," does not save a person if there is no heart submission to that knowledge. For epignosis to be of any spiritual value, there must be a heart submission to that knowledge. A person who rejects this knowledge will be more accountable at the judgment. Peter did not mention that those who escaped the "pollutions of the world" through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, were "partakers of the divine nature," "born again" or "saved."
What are you, a theologian?
I know a theologian who doesn't use the Greek as much as YOU do!!
Too sleepy now.
Tomorrow.
I'm sure you can't wait....
Mat 10:24-25,
The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord. It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub (from the devil), how much more shall they call them of his household?
We must believe the Word of God if we do not it makes us an unbeliever. Unbelievers have no part in the Kingdom of God.
God bless
The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord. It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub (from the devil), how much more shall they call them of his household?
We must believe the Word of God if we do not it makes us an unbeliever. Unbelievers have no part in the Kingdom of God.
God bless
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N
where is the divide here?
why is there even an arguement?
i dont understand....
if we go wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy back to the OP
to the HEART of the question
Where do you place your faith?
(in regards to salvation)
_____________________
Jesus Christ
_____________________
Your own actions
_____________________
Other
_____________________
all of us would put a check mark next to Jesus right?
thats what being "Christian" is....
how does God define faith?
Hebrews 11:1 - Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
if we have faith in Jesus Christ
it means our hope in him produces substance in us....
(through the Holy spirit of course)
dont let semantics cause division here
i feel like the enemy LOOOOVES this bickering
we of ourselfs EARN nothing
its God
who paid the price
its God whos working in us
and its God who gives us mercy and cleans us
why is there even an arguement?
i dont understand....
if we go wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy back to the OP
to the HEART of the question
Where do you place your faith?
(in regards to salvation)
_____________________
Jesus Christ
_____________________
Your own actions
_____________________
Other
_____________________
all of us would put a check mark next to Jesus right?
thats what being "Christian" is....
how does God define faith?
Hebrews 11:1 - Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
if we have faith in Jesus Christ
it means our hope in him produces substance in us....
(through the Holy spirit of course)
dont let semantics cause division here
i feel like the enemy LOOOOVES this bickering
we of ourselfs EARN nothing
its God
who paid the price
its God whos working in us
and its God who gives us mercy and cleans us
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Joh 8:31-32;34;36,
Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever commits sin is the servant of sin. If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.
God bless
Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever commits sin is the servant of sin. If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.
God bless
Dear SOF,
Just wondering who has ever said it's Jesus and the 10 commandments or Jesus and self? I think you may be misunderstanding what people are saying. I think they are saying if we have Jesus, and walk by faith, God will work in us to produce the fruits of obedience. We walk in him the same way that we received him by faith. But this time Gods commands become His promises as we believe His Word and He works in us to will and to do of His own good pleasure. This is salvation from sin and we receive it by faith in God's Word alone. This is the new Covenant of God's Laws being written in the believers heart (Heb 8:10-12) and now we follow Jesus because we love him.
God bless
Just wondering who has ever said it's Jesus and the 10 commandments or Jesus and self? I think you may be misunderstanding what people are saying. I think they are saying if we have Jesus, and walk by faith, God will work in us to produce the fruits of obedience. We walk in him the same way that we received him by faith. But this time Gods commands become His promises as we believe His Word and He works in us to will and to do of His own good pleasure. This is salvation from sin and we receive it by faith in God's Word alone. This is the new Covenant of God's Laws being written in the believers heart (Heb 8:10-12) and now we follow Jesus because we love him.
God bless
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Yes, Jesus is speaking to the disciples, and they were followers of Him up until His resurrection, then His ascension, but then Pentecost came, Paul is apprehended by Jesus, and he receives revelation truth about what? Is it not the gospel of grace? The new creation man? The body of Christ? And the new and Living way, which is more than a disciple....the very Sons of God, that we now are becoming by the power of Holy Spirit working in our life. Is this true?
Do you want to be a disciple and just follow? Or a child of God, bone of His bone, flesh of His flesh by the action of communion?
Do you want to be a disciple and just follow? Or a child of God, bone of His bone, flesh of His flesh by the action of communion?
Just a thought or a simple question which a lot here would surely avoid to answer:
WHAT IF ONE WHO CLAIMS TO BE SAVED ETERNALLY IS RICH, HAVING A LOT OF POSSESSIONS AND POWERFUL I WOULD SAY, AFTER BEING CHALLENGED TO PROVE HIS FAITH BY ADHERING TO THE WORD OF JESUS/GOD WRITTEN IN MATTHEW 19:16-26, IGNORES IT AND DIED THE NEXT DAY, IS HE STILL SAVE AS HE CLAIM IT AND THEREFORE NULLIFY THE VERY WORD OF JESUS/GOD?
WHAT IF ONE WHO CLAIMS TO BE SAVED ETERNALLY IS RICH, HAVING A LOT OF POSSESSIONS AND POWERFUL I WOULD SAY, AFTER BEING CHALLENGED TO PROVE HIS FAITH BY ADHERING TO THE WORD OF JESUS/GOD WRITTEN IN MATTHEW 19:16-26, IGNORES IT AND DIED THE NEXT DAY, IS HE STILL SAVE AS HE CLAIM IT AND THEREFORE NULLIFY THE VERY WORD OF JESUS/GOD?
