The Rapture

[posthuman]

Looking back at your old life, and what you left behind, and will miss. That is why lot's wife turned into a pillar of salt.

was God's mercy removed from her?
can it be taken away?
is it mercy at all, if it disappears in an instant whenever fickle, frail humanity turns its head?
she didn't make it back into Sodom. she was taken out, and prevented.
she didn't burn with the city - salt doesn't burn.
is that significant?

do you think she didn't know she would die?
do you think she tried to go back for her furniture?
did she miss her rotary club or her gym membership?

how many children did she have?
how big was Lot's family?
why did Abraham, pleading with the Lord, arrive at the number "10" ?

would a mother wish to perish herself, rather than leave her own children to die alone?

who will witness to Israel during tribulation?

((1)) when will this happen,
((2)) and what will be the sign of your coming
((3)) and of the end of the age?
(Matthew 24:3)
​

the disciples ask 3 questions - which one is "remember Lot's wife" answering?
is the full depth of the meaning of this really so simple as 'don't covet your toys' ?

 

[Bookends]

24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden. 25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come. 26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron;

It seems that those who are faithful to the end and who 'overcome' are those qualified to rule with a rod of iron.

The Rod of Iron does not mean to rule with force or strength, but to rule with longevity. Christ's Church will never be conquered, and we will endure to the end. To believe that Jesus will come back and reign in the manner of a forceful dictator defies His very teaching at His 1st coming. Psalms 2 and 110 describe the millennial kingdom of Christ in which portray Christ ruling in the midst of His enemies. While it seems that the nations of the world want to throw off the CORDS (Bonds) of God's claim on them does not mean that the Jesus isn't in complete control.

 

[Bookends]

"No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. These are those who did not defile themselves with women (male child), for they remained virgins. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among mankind and offered as first fruits to God and the Lamb. No lie was found in their mouths; they are blameless.

The 144,000 are the first fruits to God out of Israel

Then were do you place the 12 disciples and 1st century converted Jewish believers? Maybe the first will be last the last shall be first? That would be a terrible way to distort scripture, surely I hope you don't believe that.

 

[Bookends]

True,Israel is the Church.

The Bible says God has not cast away His people He once foreknew,and if the ordinances in heaven are still in effect,the sun,moon,and stars,His covenant is still with Israel,and Jesus said,salvation is of the Jews,and the gifts and calling of God are without repentance,and all Israel shall be saved for God will turn physical Israel to the truth,and when a Gentile is saved they are a Jew inward,and become part of the commonwealth of Israel.

It is Israel all the way,and all the blessings to Israel,which a Gentile can become part of that.

Jews can be saved like everybody else,but the Jews lost the physical kingdom on earth temporarily because of their disdobedience,but will get it back,and then be spiritual when God turns them to the truth.

Nation of Israel given to the Jews,the Old Testament given to them,the New Testament given to them,the millennial reign of Christ given to them,and the New Jerusalem is patterned after Israel,for the 12 tribes of Israel,and the 12 apostles of the Lamb,are written in the New Jerusalem.

It is Israel all the way,from Abraham all the way to the final destination of the saints,the New Jerusalem.

Partly true, physical Israel of today is but a diversion. Jesus said my Kingdom is not of this world (John 18:36) and the Kingdom of God is with your midst (Luke 17:20-21). Of coarse my dispensationialist friends will say the kingdom of Christ and kingdom of God are different. Earthly Israel was the type to the anti-type. Unfortunately many Christians pay no attention to types and anti-types anymore, where the earthly physical things represent spiritual truths / realities.

 

[garee]

Partly true, physical Israel of today is but a diversion. Jesus said my Kingdom is not of this world (John 18:36) and the Kingdom of God is with your midst (Luke 17:20-21). Of coarse my dispensationialist friends will say the kingdom of Christ and kingdom of God are different. Earthly Israel was the type to the anti-type. Unfortunately many Christians pay no attention to types and anti-types anymore, where the earthly physical things represent spiritual truths / realities.

Spiritual truths are lost because some men do no mix faith (the unseen spiritual understanding) in what they do hear coming from our one source of faith (Christ’s) the scriptures.

Its like they make the parables which without Christ did not speak, making the spiritual understanding to no effect… it makes a person wonder when he does come on the last day will he find faith or men walking by sights using the imagination of their own desperately wicked hearts as a alternative source of faith (their own selves)


Gen 6:5 Yahweh saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

The Amil (no literal thousand years) works the best when trying to reconcile all the parables found in Revelation. You could say the book of Revelation is a parable which comes by looking at the things seen the temporal to give us the spiritual understanding not seen, the eternal . Failure to look to the spiritual meaning of parables has led many down the wrong avenue

 

[heartofdavid]

The bible says they ran out of oil. If they ran out of oil, they were in the dark because their lamp went out right?.

Matthew 25:8 KJV
And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

The foolish requested the wise to impart unto them the " substance/dynamic that fueled/empowered the light from their vessels.

The substance was transferrable.

 

[heartofdavid]

Partly true, physical Israel of today is but a diversion. Jesus said my Kingdom is not of this world (John 18:36) and the Kingdom of God is with your midst (Luke 17:20-21). Of coarse my dispensationialist friends will say the kingdom of Christ and kingdom of God are different. Earthly Israel was the type to the anti-type. Unfortunately many Christians pay no attention to types and anti-types anymore, where the earthly physical things represent spiritual truths / realities.

Again,the book of Ruth.

Both gentile and Jew possessed the redeemed land.

Note that all Naomi's family died. Making her return to her homeland bitter. She renamed herself " bitter" or some such name because she lost everything. She was a walking destroyed sad woman.

See that? The vivid picture of a remnant,Naomi,RETURNS to later see herself scooped up by Boaz and restored to her property via kinsman redeemer legal deed.

ALONGSIDE THE GENTILE BRIDE

 

[VCO]

Why would a Christian Jew use the symbol of the Jews god Remphan?

a


ARE YOU BLIND? That is a very COMMON Jewish Christian symbol. It combines the Jewish Menorah, Star of David, and Christian Fish Symbol, plus frequenly they put the Christian Cross symbol in the center of the fish, or the center of the Star of David. This is probably the most common used

 

[Bookends]

Again,the book of Ruth.

Both gentile and Jew possessed the redeemed land.

Note that all Naomi's family died. Making her return to her homeland bitter. She renamed herself " bitter" or some such name because she lost everything. She was a walking destroyed sad woman.

See that? The vivid picture of a remnant,Naomi,RETURNS to later see herself scooped up by Boaz and restored to her property via kinsman redeemer legal deed.

ALONGSIDE THE GENTILE BRIDE

The Remnant (Naomi) was restored at the same time Boaz married the gentile. No gaps. It depicts God's plan to redeem the world, not a particular nation or tribe. Boaz is a type to the anti-type (Christ).

 

[VCO]

Then were do you place the 12 disciples and 1st century converted Jewish believers? Maybe the first will be last the last shall be first? That would be a terrible way to distort scripture, surely I hope you don't believe that.

HERE is the Order they will be raised in according to GOD.

1 Corinthians 15:21-23 (NRSV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] For since death came through a human being, the resurrection of the dead has also come through a human being;
[SUP]22 [/SUP] for as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ.
[SUP]23 [/SUP] But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ.


To me, that is saying, the next person out of the Grave, will be either Adam or Eve, whichever one died first.

My understanding of the Last will be First, is about the Covenants and when they finish. The Last Covenant finishes FIRST, and the First Covant finishes LAST; hence the 70th Week of Daniel is after the Church Age.

 

[tanakh]

Yes, but the gathering for the marriage supper out on the highways and byways is still going on, i.e. the church is still in the process of being built. Once the church has been completed, then the Lord will appear and gather His church, with the wedding of the Lamb taking place in heaven during the time when God's wrath is being poured out upon the earth:

Hallelujah!For our Lord God, the Almighty, reigns. Let us rejoice and celebrate and give Him the glory. For the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His bride has made herself ready. She was given clothing of fine linen, linen bright and pure.” - Rev.19:6-8

After the bride receives here fine linen at the wedding of the Lamb, she is then seen in Rev.19:14 wearing that same fine linen, white and clean and riding white horses and following the Lord out of heaven to the earth to end the age.

While these are having a slap up meal in heaven as the wrath is being poured out what happens to those down below who have come to Christ after everyone else has used the get out of wrath free card?. If God wont let those already saved go through the period
of wrath how come he lets them go through it? Are not the so called ''Tribulation Saints'' saved and part of the body of Christ
because one is either saved or not. You cant be semi saved or work your way into it by having a bit of wrath first. Christ prayed to the Father NOT to take his followers out of the world. God didnt take the Israelites out of Egypt when he unleashed his wrath on the Egyptians. They were protected through all the plagues. In fact according to this version of events the Jews somehow stay through the wrath Sorry folks no rapture or Banquet for you just hang on in there for seven years.

 

[KJV1611]

a


ARE YOU BLIND? That is a very COMMON Jewish Christian symbol. It combines the Jewish Menorah, Star of David, and Christian Fish Symbol, plus frequenly they put the Christian Cross symbol in the center of the fish, or the center of the Star of David. This is probably the most common used

I don't think you know as much about the Jews as you might think, David didn't have a star.

 

[Bogadile]

Star of David a.k.a Star of Rempham, that is an occult symbol.

 

[KJV1611]

a


ARE YOU BLIND? That is a very COMMON Jewish Christian symbol. It combines the Jewish Menorah, Star of David, and Christian Fish Symbol, plus frequenly they put the Christian Cross symbol in the center of the fish, or the center of the Star of David. This is probably the most common used

It's sort of like a bible that has 666 stamped on the cover.... the DEVIL is telling you it's not the word of God.

 

[KJV1611]

Matthew 10:5-7 KJV
These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: [6] But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. [7] And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Matthew 10:23 KJV
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

In verses 5-7 Jesus tells the 12 disciples (not future Christians) to go preach the gospel to the Jews ONLY. Then in verse 23 it says that the Son of Man will come BEFORE the 12 disciples preach the gospel to all the cities of Israel.

How is this future?

 

[J7]

over literal KJ

Neo-Literalism is the only way to understand that these verses are nothing to do with 1st Century Israel

 

[KJV1611]

over literal KJ

Neo-Literalism is the only way to understand that these verses are nothing to do with 1st Century Israel

Or maybe it means exactly what it says and OUR understanding of the coming of the Son of Man is flawed.

 

[J7]

"Behold I stand at the door and knock"

See, now this is clearly literal, because if it was for us today, it would be

"behold I stand at the door and ring the electric buzzer..."

 

[J7]

Or maybe it means exactly what it says and OUR understanding of the coming of the Son of Man is flawed.

What is your understanding of it?

 

[KJV1611]

What is your understanding of it?

I'm working on it lol. I've been studying to see how the terms "Son of Man" and "Son of God" are used throughout the bible. I ran across those verses and decided to see what the group thinks of it. Right now I believe it's the Son of Man coming for judgement on Israel in AD 70.... BUT that could change as I study the 2 titles.