But you could produce it by natural processes - from land and trees. And that is what is said in Bible
Id really like to know how you believe it all came to be. If you could explain that to me I'd appreciate it.
getting dates about a young earth
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Id really like to know how you believe it all came to be. If you could explain that to me I'd appreciate it.
Id really like to know how you believe it all came to be. If you could explain that to me I'd appreciate it.
Well, Genesis said - Land, produce plants, waters, produce animals, land, produce animals, , produce animals... and God made it.
So, according to Genesis - first live originated in waters, then land animals. And God was behind all this.
I see no reason why theistic evolution is not suitable for this. And actually I see no other explanation than theistic evolution, that would take in account both sides of Genesis - nature did it + God did it.
I still believe that theistic evolution is an attempt to bring scripture in line with accepted science. It appears disingenuous and commingles humanism with Christianity. I hear where you're coming from tho.
If I may offer this,
Once it was commonly taught that the earth was the center of the universe and that the earth was flat, people were tortured and killed for saying otherwise by the religious teachers at that time.
When it was confirmed that the earth was round by sailing around it, it didn't show that there was no God, it showed that the "teachers" were wrong about understanding God's word. People didn't lose faith in God, but it became clear to all that their concepts were wrong. These "men of God", how could they be wrong? The people weren't supposed the question the authority of the church (papacy) and it's teachings.
Today, we have a concept of creation that is coming out of the darkness into the light of understanding.
The teaching of the literal, 24 hour-6 day, concept has been around since Genesis was written. The people didn't see the planet and universe as we do now. Moses was one of the most educated persons of his time (prince of Egypt), he told the story (through inspiration by God) of the creation of the elements, air, water, earth, and fire. They didn't have 100 or so "elements" like modern science today. They didn't understand about the human body or sickness as we do.
God was creating a place for the human souls to live. Adam and Eve are real people, what happened to them was showing about evil (no love), and how it entered into their souls and how evil (no love) works in our souls.
As we discover more about our earth and universe, does this "prove" the Bible is wrong? No, it only shows that perhaps we should "rethink" the perception of His description of the creation story. I think I have heard of a group called "the flat earth society" who still argue that the earth is flat, it's all a big plot to make think the world is round, HA, HA!!
The literal 24 hour-6 day theory has been questioned recently since the discoveries of new information about our planet and universe. The old concept that was taught by some is now questionable.
The Bible is always 100% correct, so maybe it is OUR understanding of the creation story that needs to be looked at from a different understanding.
Many may say, "I have taught the 6 day-24 hour concept for years, if I change what I have taught I will be labeled as a false teacher," only if you continue to teach the world is flat after you have confirmation that the world is round.
The creation story is the creation of the light and the four elements (firm, substance) of Moses' understanding of the world. God tells the story so all people can understand it. From the simplest, uneducated slave to the most intelligent person of our times.
God speaks through the symbols that people for all time will understand. Imagine trying to explain how the sun works, or atomic power to a slave of Moses' time.
If you were one of Jesus' followers wouldn't you ask Him about the sun etc.? They probably did, but all the knowledge of these physical things wasn't required for the salvation of our souls. That is what Jesus was here for and what is really important.
We are understanding more about our planet now, but that doesn't prove the Bible wrong, only that we need to continue to explore the depth and scope of God's Holy Word.
The Bible (study of God and the spiritual world) and science (study of the physical world) will NEVER contradict each other, only OUR incorrect ideas will conflict with the Bible and science.
The creation story takes us from the spiritual to the physical world.
It doesn't fill in all the details for the scientists, atomic reactions in the microscopic world, or exactly how He created the stars. It leaves some big gaps in the explanation of the creation if you look at it as literal.
Once it was commonly taught that the earth was the center of the universe and that the earth was flat, people were tortured and killed for saying otherwise by the religious teachers at that time.
When it was confirmed that the earth was round by sailing around it, it didn't show that there was no God, it showed that the "teachers" were wrong about understanding God's word. People didn't lose faith in God, but it became clear to all that their concepts were wrong. These "men of God", how could they be wrong? The people weren't supposed the question the authority of the church (papacy) and it's teachings.
Today, we have a concept of creation that is coming out of the darkness into the light of understanding.
The teaching of the literal, 24 hour-6 day, concept has been around since Genesis was written. The people didn't see the planet and universe as we do now. Moses was one of the most educated persons of his time (prince of Egypt), he told the story (through inspiration by God) of the creation of the elements, air, water, earth, and fire. They didn't have 100 or so "elements" like modern science today. They didn't understand about the human body or sickness as we do.
God was creating a place for the human souls to live. Adam and Eve are real people, what happened to them was showing about evil (no love), and how it entered into their souls and how evil (no love) works in our souls.
As we discover more about our earth and universe, does this "prove" the Bible is wrong? No, it only shows that perhaps we should "rethink" the perception of His description of the creation story. I think I have heard of a group called "the flat earth society" who still argue that the earth is flat, it's all a big plot to make think the world is round, HA, HA!!
The literal 24 hour-6 day theory has been questioned recently since the discoveries of new information about our planet and universe. The old concept that was taught by some is now questionable.
The Bible is always 100% correct, so maybe it is OUR understanding of the creation story that needs to be looked at from a different understanding.
Many may say, "I have taught the 6 day-24 hour concept for years, if I change what I have taught I will be labeled as a false teacher," only if you continue to teach the world is flat after you have confirmation that the world is round.
The creation story is the creation of the light and the four elements (firm, substance) of Moses' understanding of the world. God tells the story so all people can understand it. From the simplest, uneducated slave to the most intelligent person of our times.
God speaks through the symbols that people for all time will understand. Imagine trying to explain how the sun works, or atomic power to a slave of Moses' time.
If you were one of Jesus' followers wouldn't you ask Him about the sun etc.? They probably did, but all the knowledge of these physical things wasn't required for the salvation of our souls. That is what Jesus was here for and what is really important.
We are understanding more about our planet now, but that doesn't prove the Bible wrong, only that we need to continue to explore the depth and scope of God's Holy Word.
The Bible (study of God and the spiritual world) and science (study of the physical world) will NEVER contradict each other, only OUR incorrect ideas will conflict with the Bible and science.
The creation story takes us from the spiritual to the physical world.
It doesn't fill in all the details for the scientists, atomic reactions in the microscopic world, or exactly how He created the stars. It leaves some big gaps in the explanation of the creation if you look at it as literal.
You can believe about humanism and my coming whatever you want, but what other explanation than theistic evolution do you have for Genesis 1?
I've already gave you my explanation and I don't intend to attempt to change your mind or argue with you. I'm working out my own salvation and I give you the freedom to work out your own.
Your explanation was "God did it". That is one part of the verse. But there is also another part, that says "land brought forth..." and my question is about this part. Or how to join both parts together.
You seem to ignore the second part I am talking about.
B
BeyondET
Guest
Thats easy God made the earth but is still in the business of forming land, from underwater volcanos that bring forth up out of the water to form islands and also tectonic plate movements.
Your view of theistic evolution implies that death existed before Adam sinned. This is contradictory to what the bible says about death.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
If not for a flood. there would never be a fossil. DO you know how fossils are made?
Never happened? Can you explain?
Never would have existed? Says who?
So God, Who created all things, Can not make the universe aged?
You dont understand. We are talking about land bringing forth life, not about land emerging from waters.
This is the verse:
The earth brought forth seed propagating pasture vegetation after its kind and likeness, and trees bearing fruit, with its seed in it, after their kind; and God saw that it was good
B
BeyondET
Guest
Well on that note then yes indeed God created the seeds they just didn't evolve or just come to be.
B
BeyondET
Guest
You, mister, are master in changing topics
Easy now you can't say this of him when the title of the thread is getting dates of a young earth.. Not seeds or land bringing forth life it's about the age of earth.
Fossils are one thing. They can be created without any flood, of course. But there were many flood in the history of Earth, so it certainly played a role.
But the layers of fossils from the most simple organism to the todays organism (you will never find a cow between trilobits) cannot be explained by any one-time massive flood few thousand years ago, it would produce some mess mixture of all life, not such nice layers.
Ice layers - there are annual ice layers that go back to hundred thousand years. If God made Earth young but having the signs of old age, he would have to fake all this layers.
Similar with meteorit impacts - there are so many meteorit craters, that it would kill life every hundred years if they all would crush Earth during 6 000 years only. So they are sign of old earth. God would have to fake them too. Similar to craters on moon etc.
Paintings in caves, remnants of old civilizations etc are much older than 6 thousand years. Again - God would have to fake them and draw them himself to lead us into false conclusion about our history.
The same with stars and universe history.
Yes, God can make young univers looking old, but I personally dont believe in such a scenario, when he would fake so many thing just to convince us universe is old, if it is young.
You, mister, are master in changing topics
Not really. I'm just good at getting to the heart of the matter. You have theistic evolution all over your posts. Darwinian and theistic and atheistic evolution are essentially the same things. You are taking one or two words and using them to force the point of view that God set things in motion, the building blocks of life, and then let nature take its course. This makes God out to be a liar. And God cannot lie. He created. Adam brought death into the world. Now you answer my question. Was there death in the world before adam sinned?