Mark of the beast is sunday laws.

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S

sparkman

Guest
This is spam to be spreeding your church doctrine views and web site,
Grace Communion International’s , to every thread that has Sabbath in it.
I attend an Evangelical Free church and not Grace Communion International. Grace Communion International is the former Sabbathkeeping organization that I belonged to, so they are very familiar with the doctrinal issues with the Sabbath/festival keeping teachings.
 

prove-all

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May 16, 2014
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The Sabbath, as part of the Old Covenant, is not in affect for ANYONE

Gal 4:10 You observe days and months and seasons and years!
youre church group is in error using this verse againest sabbath keeping.

AN OBSERVER OF TIMES
is not a person keeping Sabbath days

GAL.4
[8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them
which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God,
or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly
elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

[10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS.
[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Its speaking of those who observe times,
it says nothing about sabbaths or feast days.

DEUT.18
[9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee,
thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.
[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his
daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination,

OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,
[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits,
or a wizard, or a necromancer.

2 CHR.33
[3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father
had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves,
and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.
[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof
the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.
[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in
the two courts of the house of the LORD.

[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom:
ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used
witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards:
he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards.
Its speaking of the occult. Not about following sabbath days.

LEV.19
[26] Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood:
neither shall ye use enchantment, (NOR OBSERVE TIMES).
[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.
[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you:
I am the LORD.
[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a whore; lest the land fall to whoredom,
and the land become full of wickedness.


[30] (YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS), and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

-You shall not observe times the bible says here,

BUT you shall keep my sabbaths says the Lord.




Gal 4:3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:
Notice the last half of the verse? Elements of what? Judaism? No, the world.

Gal 4:8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.
Judaism knew God, they did not recognize Christ when He came.

Gal 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to
the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

What were they returning to? Weak and beggarly elements of what?
Gal 4:3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:

Who was Paul addressing here?

Galatia[edit]

"Paul's letter is addressed "to the churches of Galatia" (Galatians 1:2), but the location of these churches is a matter of debate. A minority of scholars have argued that the "Galatia" is an ethnic reference to a Celtic people living in northern Asia Minor, but most agree that it is a geographical reference to the Roman province in central Asia Minor, which had been settled by immigrant Celts in the 270s BC and retained Gaulish features of culture and language in Paul's day." - Wikipedia

Paul was not addressing Judah, he was addressing someone else.

Now read verse 10...

Gal 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
These are not Jews observing Judaism, these are those who are of the world in Asia Minor observing
the weak and beggarly elements of the world, not Judaism.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
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they are very familiar with the doctrinal issues with the Sabbath/festival keeping teachings.
no they have a lot to learn.

Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so,
he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:

but whosoever shall do and teach them,
the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.


how do you interpret this verse?
 
S

sparkman

Guest
Here's an article in this regard: https://www.gci.org/bible/matthew517

These verses are not referring to the Sabbath in particular, but are referring to the entire Old Testament. Do you keep the entire Old Covenant?

As the article says:

Let’s ask again what the context tells us, and where such a conclusion would lead us. As we saw, Jesus did not mention the Sabbath or the Ten Commandments in Matthew 5:17-19. In order to say that Jesus had the Sabbath in mind, we would be forced to say that he was commanding Christians to follow all the laws of the Law and Prophets, or the Old Testament. At the least, we would have to conclude he was making the entire Law of Moses binding on Christians.


"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

no they have a lot to learn.

Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so,
he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:

but whosoever shall do and teach them,
the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.


how do you interpret this verse?
 
S

sparkman

Guest
Galatians most certainly is addressing Judaizers. How do you account for the references to the Old Covenant in Galatians 3? Your assertions are not valid. Jews were teaching Gentiles that they had to observe the Law. This is the majority view about Galatians. I don't even know if there are any serious scholars who hold your view in this regard.


Gal 3:17 This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterwards, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void.
Gal 3:19 Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, until the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made, and it was put in place through angels by an intermediary.
Gal 3:24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith
Gal 3:25 But now that faith is come, we are no longer under a guardian



youre church group is in error using this verse againest sabbath keeping.

AN OBSERVER OF TIMES
is not a person keeping Sabbath days

GAL.4
[8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them
which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God,
or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly
elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

[10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS.
[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Its speaking of those who observe times,
it says nothing about sabbaths or feast days.

DEUT.18
[9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee,
thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.
[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his
daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination,

OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,
[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits,
or a wizard, or a necromancer.

2 CHR.33
[3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father
had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves,
and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.
[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof
the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.
[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in
the two courts of the house of the LORD.

[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom:
ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used
witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards:
he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards.
Its speaking of the occult. Not about following sabbath days.

LEV.19
[26] Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood:
neither shall ye use enchantment, (NOR OBSERVE TIMES).
[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.
[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you:
I am the LORD.
[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a whore; lest the land fall to whoredom,
and the land become full of wickedness.


[30] (YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS), and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

-You shall not observe times the bible says here,

BUT you shall keep my sabbaths says the Lord.




Gal 4:3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:
Notice the last half of the verse? Elements of what? Judaism? No, the world.

Gal 4:8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.
Judaism knew God, they did not recognize Christ when He came.

Gal 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to
the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

What were they returning to? Weak and beggarly elements of what?
Gal 4:3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:

Who was Paul addressing here?

Galatia[edit]

"Paul's letter is addressed "to the churches of Galatia" (Galatians 1:2), but the location of these churches is a matter of debate. A minority of scholars have argued that the "Galatia" is an ethnic reference to a Celtic people living in northern Asia Minor, but most agree that it is a geographical reference to the Roman province in central Asia Minor, which had been settled by immigrant Celts in the 270s BC and retained Gaulish features of culture and language in Paul's day." - Wikipedia

Paul was not addressing Judah, he was addressing someone else.

Now read verse 10...

Gal 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
These are not Jews observing Judaism, these are those who are of the world in Asia Minor observing
the weak and beggarly elements of the world, not Judaism.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
400
83
63
we can trace Neros name, and come up with 666 in several tonges

very strange way this title is handed down.

Caesar (plural Caesars; Latin: Caesar, plural: Caesares) is a title of imperial character.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caesar_(title)

The Julii Caesares were a specific branch of the gens Julia.

It derives from the cognomen of Julius Caesar, the Roman dictator. The change from being
a familial name to a title adopted by the Roman Emperors can be dated to about AD 68/69,
The first known bearer of the name was one Sextus Julius Caesar, praetor in 208 BC,

The first Emperor, Caesar Augustus, bore the name as a matter of course; born Gaius Octavius
adopted by Caesar in his will, and per Roman naming conventions was renamed "Gaius Julius Caesar Octavianus"

his relationship with Caesar by styling himself simply "Imperator Caesar"
(whereto the Roman Senate added the honorific Augustus, "Majestic" or "Venerable," in 27 BC),

His successor as emperor, his stepson Tiberius, also bore the name as a matter of course;
born Tiberius Claudius Nero, he was adopted by Caesar Augustus on June 26, 4 AD, as "Tiberius Julius Caesar."

The precedent was set: the Emperor designated his successor by adopting him and giving him
the name "Caesar."

41 to 54AD Roman emperor Claudius
Claudius - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He adopted the name "Caesar" as a cognomen
Cognomen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

During his reign the Empire began the conquest of Britain

The Julio-Claudian dynasty refers to the first five Roman Emperors:
Augustus, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius, and Nero,
[1] or the family to which they belonged; they ruled the Roman Empire from its formation,
in the second half of the 1st century (44/31/27) BC, until AD 68,

when the last of the line, Nero, committed suicide
Julio-Claudian dynasty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Roman emperor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Adoption in ancient Rome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

None of the Julio-Claudians were succeeded by their sons;
1 Augustus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Augustus (Latin: Imperator Caesar Divi F. Augustus; 23 September 63 BC – 19 August 14 AD) was
the founder of the Roman Empire and its first Emperor, ruling from 27 BC until his death in 14 AD

He was born Gaius Octavius into an old and wealthy equestrian branch
of the plebeian Octavii family.
Equites - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Plebs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Octavia (gens) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Following the assassination of his maternal great-uncle Julius Caesar in 44 BC,
Caesar's will named Octavius as his adopted son and heir
He was succeeded as Emperor by his adopted son (also stepson and former son-in-law), Tiberius.

2 Tiberius - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Tiberius (/ta?'b??ri?s/; Latin: Tiberius Caesar Divi Augusti filius Augustus;
16 November 42 BC – 16 March 37 AD)

was Roman Emperor from 14 AD to 37 AD. Born Tiberius Claudius Nero, a Claudian,
Tiberius was the son of Tiberius Claudius Nero and Livia Drusilla.

His mother divorced Nero and married Augustus in 39 BC, making him a step-son of Octavian.
Tiberius would later marry Augustus' daughter Julia the Elder (from his marriage to Scribonia)
and even later be adopted by Augustus, by which act he officially became a Julian,
bearing the name Tiberius Julius Caesar.

Caligula, Tiberius' grand-nephew and adopted grandson, succeeded Tiberius upon his death.

3 Caligula - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Caligula" (/k?'l?gj?l?/; Latin: Gaius Julius Caesar Augustus Germanicus;
was the popular nickname of Gaius (31 August AD 12 – 22 January AD 41), Roman emperor (AD 37–41).

Caligula's father Germanicus, the nephew and adopted son of Emperor Tiberius...

With the death of Tiberius in AD 37, Caligula succeeded his great uncle and adoptive
grandfather as Emperor.on the day of the assassination of the Emperor Caligula,
the Praetorian Guard declared Caligula's uncle, Claudius, the next Roman Emperor.

4 Claudius - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Claudius (/'kl??di?s/; Classical Latin: ['klawd??s], Latin: Tiberius Claudius Caesar Augustus Germanicus;
1 August 10 BC – 13 October 54 AD) was Roman emperor from 41 to 54.

the son of Drusus and Antonia Minor. He was born at Lugdunum in Gaul,
the first Roman Emperor to be born outside Italy.

declared Emperor by the Praetorian Guard after Caligula's assassination,
at which point he was the last man of his family.

During his reign the Empire began the conquest of Britain (if the earlier invasions of Britain
by Caesar and Caligula's aborted attempt are not counted).

After his death in 54 AD (at age of 63), his grand-nephew and adopted son Nero
succeeded him as Emperor

5 Nero - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Nero (/'n??ro?/; Latin: Nero Claudius Caesar Augustus Germanicus;
[1] 15 December 37 – 9 June 68)
[2] was Roman Emperor from 54 to 68, and the last in the Julio-Claudian dynasty.
Nero was adopted by his great-uncle Claudius to become his heir and successor,
and succeeded to the throne in 54 following Claudius' death.

Through Octavia, Nero was the great-nephew of Caesar Augustus
Nero annexed the Bosporan Kingdom to the Empire and began the First Roman–Jewish War.

In 64 AD, most of Rome was destroyed in the Great Fire of Rome,
which many Romans believed Nero himself had started , then blamed jews

He died on 9 June 68, the anniversary of the death of Octavia, and was buried
in the Mausoleum of the Domitii Ahenobarbi, in what is now
the Villa Borghese (Pincian Hill) area of Rome

666 identifys an marks this title and person [nero] as emperior of the roman kingdom.
 
Nov 14, 2012
2,113
4
0
Sixth seal, sixth trump, sixth vial marks the appearance of anti christ
 
Nov 14, 2012
2,113
4
0
See what happens when everyone thinks they can interpret scripture. No authority equals nonsense
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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The number 666 in Greek and Hebrew adds up to "Neron Caesar", Nero Caesar.
It's the name of Nero, the Roman Emperor.

John was writing Revelation sometime around 64 AD.
The 4th kingdom in Daniel 2 & 7 is Pagan Rome.

the beasts in Revelation 13 are in the opposite order to Daniel 7

Daniel has the order of:-
1) Lion
2) Bear
3) Leopard
4) Dragon

4The first was like a lion
5And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear
6After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard,

7After this I saw in [the night ]visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly;
and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it:
and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.

Revelation 13:1
1) Dragon
2) Leopard
3) Bear
4) Lion

2And [the beast] which I saw was[ like] unto a leopard,

and his feet were as the feet of a bear,
and his mouth as the mouth of a lion:
and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

john sees 7 beasts forward, same as the 7 last horns of daniel,
starting with 4 th little horn, from ten horns, of danials forth beast kingdom.

but john sees things different when looking backwards in time.
(1) And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea,
A gentile world rulling kingdoms and ther kings, rising among the people of the world.
having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns,
and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death;
and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

roman empire was dead, 4 beast kingdom, no more rome, what became from area afterwards.

Revelation 13:15
(15) And he [had power] to give life unto [the image ]of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak,
and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

this happen in the past history, the mighty church labeled the jews who keep Gods sabbath , and made it law,
and the power of rome, tortured or killed them, if they did not recant of there supposed bad ways.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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The mark of the Beast is not 666...

Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast:
for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

The number 666 is an identifier that reveals the Beast, it is not his mark.

Rev 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond,
to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark,
or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast:
for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Notice in vs. 16-17 that the mark is something you must have to buy and sell. Now read verse 18,
the number 666 is an identifier that labels a man (the Beast). The mark is one thing,
the number 666 is another, they are not the same thing.
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
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I don't agree with the OP; but putting people under LAW, whether OT Law or Sunday law, is contrary to the core precept of the gospel: Salvation by grace!