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Catholic Heresy (for the record)
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mikeuk
Guest
So how are you getting on over there without us in our colony?
I don't know why we put up with the monarchy nonsense either, except it makes a might good earner for US dollars from US nationals, who seem to need the sense of history because they do not have any of their own, so pay a fortune to visit London and our relics of state! - I can understand americans wanting to visit scotland- but London and the tower? Hah! But so long as you guys are buying, we are happy to keep pushing up the prices, and keep Queen Bess bumping up our balance of payments!
Coming to which - why are you so "proud to be a'merkin". George W kept saying it , so it must be true, but as I understand it, a merkin is a pubic hair wig! I suppose it takes all sorts to make the world an interesting place. Even a'mericans. Even worse George W
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Most of them have the right truth. They know our Lord Jesus Christ and trust the Scriptures for truth. They merely differ on inessentials. And at least they are not bogged down in historical fantasies.
Tell me which part of the Roman Catholic church has the right truth? The Philippines who worship Mary? Or the parts who claim not to but make a very good impression of doing so?.
well God repeated it twice, so it seems to me like it was intended. How can one of God's 'words' (commandments) be out of context? Its context was general. It was a cover all situations. It was one of the ten stipulations of the original covenant each of which stands on its own.
That was the first stipulation. It stood by itself. The second stipulation also stands by itself, as does EACH commandment.
But they did not create false gods. They created images. In fact the golden calf in the wilderness was probably intended to represent the throne of YHWH (Hadad was often depicted as riding on the back of a bull) which was why Aaron connived in its making. It still incurred YHWH's wrath as a graven image.
Nonsense.
Do you really think that when the Canaanites (and the Israelites) erected Baal's they theoretically saw each as a god? Their myths reveal otherwise. They saw them as the point of contact with their gods, a means of reaching out to their gods, just like statues of Mary. But they soon turned into worshiping those images because of the propensities within men. As we saw in the Phillipine prayer above the Philipinos are blatant about it. (and I am quite sure it has the imprimatur). They are at least honest. They worship Mary. Here they pretend not to worship Mary, but do in fact do so. Just look at those pictures. There is your supposed intellectual Papa looking worshipfully into the face of Mary. Whatever he may claim intellectually he is worshiping her as a demi-goddess..That was why God banned ALL IMAGES invented by man. He knew what the reality would be.
And where did Solomon get his ideas from? Pagan TYRE. He introduced other pagan features too. IT WAS THE BEGINNING OF HIS DETERIORATION INTO BLATANT IDOLATRY. And even then they were never seen by men. No one knelt before them
The only cherubim God allowed for were the two cherubim on either side of His Ark Throne, which were never seen, and in a place where only the One on the throne would be worshiped. So you are wrong again,
Psalms states nothing of the kind, not in the way you mean. It is referring to the giving of the prophecy not the receiving of it As the prophet interpreted his prophecy he was to do it by the Spirit of YHWH, not give his private thoughts. The prophecy was not to come 'by the will of man' but as men spake from God. Read 2 Pet 1.20-21 without blinkers on.
LOL none compare with the RC church for tangents. Indeed they go off the scale. Do you want me to list some of their ridiculous wanderings?. Mariolatry, images, blasphemous elements in the Mass, worshiping a piece of bread (another graven image), baptismal regeneration, refusing the wine to laity, demanding auricular confession, indulgences, celibacy for priests which drives them to illicit sex and child molestation, and so we could go on. And all the inventions of Papas who were murderous, adulterous, greedy, politically motivated, persecutors.
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I realise you Americans would not understand this but bowing and curtseying is an act of courtesy with no remote connection with worship. By it we show our appreciation of each other. It is a social courtesy practised at all levels. So you are just being absurd like most of your doctrinal stances.
Well of course the Roman Catholic church has always encouraged free discussion. As long as you didn't mind being burned at the stake or suffering under the RC church sponsored torturers.
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mattp0625
Guest
Ooooh I see! Bowing in honor would only constitute worship when you post an online picture of Catholics to "prove" RCC worships Mary and makes her God, which we do not. Did you find that proof in the catechism yet? No, you didn't
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Mary was ONLY used as a vessel to bring into this World a body that the Son of God could use to walk on this World and nothing more!
Its interesting that Catholics do equate Mary as being equal to God in their Doctrine of Mary being a Co-redemptrix with Jesus Christ. The word "Co-" in the dictionary means being equal. Therefore you Catholics do teach that Mary is equal to God!
Mary is in the grave and cannot hear nor answer any of your prayers to her.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18
[SUP]13 [/SUP] But we do not want you to be uninformed, brothers, about those who are asleep, that you may not grieve as others do who have no hope.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so, through Jesus, God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] For this we declare to you by a word from the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Therefore encourage one another with these words.
Mary is asleep in the grave, she is not in Heaven like you Catholics teach! Where in the Scriptures does the Holy Spirit say Mary was taken up into Heaven? It's not in the Scriptures and the Holy Spirit never taught this Doctrine.
Therefore Mary cannot hear your prayers nor can she answer them because she is in the grave and is asleep.
Also for Mary to be able to hear your prayers and answer them she needs to have Omnipresence and Omniscience! Only God is Omnipresence and Omniscience! To give these attributes to Mary shows that you Catholics do teach that Mary is equal to God!
Your lying lips may say you do not Worship Mary as your God, but your teachings and actions do prove you do Worship Mary.
Mark 12:28-31
[SUP]28 [/SUP] And one of the scribes came up and heard them disputing with one another, and seeing that he answered them well, asked him, “Which commandment is the most important of all?”
[SUP]29 [/SUP] Jesus answered, “The most important is, ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is ONE!
[SUP]30 [/SUP] And you shall love the Lord your God with ALL your heart and with ALL your soul and with ALL your mind and with ALL your strength.’
[SUP]31 [/SUP] The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”
We are to love God with "ALL your heart and with ALL your soul and with ALL your mind and with ALL your strength."! How can you give your ALL to God if you are praying to Mary? You cannot! By including Mary into your life you are giving God only 50% of your Heart, 50% of your Soul, 50% of your Mind, and 50% of your Strength!
Therefore every Catholic who has included Mary into their life is breaking the Greatest Commandment ever given to us by God!
Do you Catholics not know that breaking this Commandment IS a Mortal sin that will not allow you to enter into Heaven? Every Catholic that includes Mary into their lives will never be allowed into Heaven! Is this really what you Catholics want?
Repent! Reject Mary and turn back to God only before its too late and you end up in Hell with Satan!
Its interesting that Catholics do equate Mary as being equal to God in their Doctrine of Mary being a Co-redemptrix with Jesus Christ. The word "Co-" in the dictionary means being equal. Therefore you Catholics do teach that Mary is equal to God!
Mary is in the grave and cannot hear nor answer any of your prayers to her.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18
[SUP]13 [/SUP] But we do not want you to be uninformed, brothers, about those who are asleep, that you may not grieve as others do who have no hope.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so, through Jesus, God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] For this we declare to you by a word from the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Therefore encourage one another with these words.
Mary is asleep in the grave, she is not in Heaven like you Catholics teach! Where in the Scriptures does the Holy Spirit say Mary was taken up into Heaven? It's not in the Scriptures and the Holy Spirit never taught this Doctrine.
Therefore Mary cannot hear your prayers nor can she answer them because she is in the grave and is asleep.
Also for Mary to be able to hear your prayers and answer them she needs to have Omnipresence and Omniscience! Only God is Omnipresence and Omniscience! To give these attributes to Mary shows that you Catholics do teach that Mary is equal to God!
Your lying lips may say you do not Worship Mary as your God, but your teachings and actions do prove you do Worship Mary.
Mark 12:28-31
[SUP]28 [/SUP] And one of the scribes came up and heard them disputing with one another, and seeing that he answered them well, asked him, “Which commandment is the most important of all?”
[SUP]29 [/SUP] Jesus answered, “The most important is, ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is ONE!
[SUP]30 [/SUP] And you shall love the Lord your God with ALL your heart and with ALL your soul and with ALL your mind and with ALL your strength.’
[SUP]31 [/SUP] The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”
We are to love God with "ALL your heart and with ALL your soul and with ALL your mind and with ALL your strength."! How can you give your ALL to God if you are praying to Mary? You cannot! By including Mary into your life you are giving God only 50% of your Heart, 50% of your Soul, 50% of your Mind, and 50% of your Strength!
Therefore every Catholic who has included Mary into their life is breaking the Greatest Commandment ever given to us by God!
Do you Catholics not know that breaking this Commandment IS a Mortal sin that will not allow you to enter into Heaven? Every Catholic that includes Mary into their lives will never be allowed into Heaven! Is this really what you Catholics want?
Repent! Reject Mary and turn back to God only before its too late and you end up in Hell with Satan!
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mattp0625
Guest
Ooooh I seee! All the Protestant sects have the "pure" bible-based truth! They just differ on a few man made differences. Is that not what you call heresy? How can they have such Man-made differences when there is only one true biblical Word??
Also, where is the age of accountability in the bible?
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mattp0625
Guest
Fordman challenges you to find this Mary as God doctrine in the RCC catechism. He said he would convert if you found it. Did you find it yet?? Or are you afraid to look because you'd rather accuse RCC without the facts ?
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mattp0625
Guest
Additionally, you cannot give yourself the authority to condemn. The servant is not greater than the Master.
Ooooh I see! Bowing in honor would only constitute worship when you post an online picture of Catholics to "prove" RCC worships Mary and makes her God, which we do not. Did you find that proof in the catechism yet? No, you didn't
It seems to me that you need to consult a dictionary. Then you might know what bowing was. Your Papa in those pictures was not bowing courteously TO A GRAVEN IMAGE, which in itself would be reprehensible, he was kneeling before A GRAVEN IMAGE and looking adoringly into its face. Now I realise that he might simply have been putting on an act to deceive the faithful. But it is clear evidence that that is what he did.
What does a catechism which is on show to the rest of the world tell us? What matters is what ROMAN CATHOLICS ACTUALLY DO WITH PRIESTLY GUDIANCE. The Philippines example makes that perfectly clear. you admitted it yourself. Your supposed veneration soon moves on to worship. And some of you may not realise it of yourselves. Baal worshippers were only supposed to venerate their images of Baal as they pointed them to the god Baal. But it soon became worship of the image. And what about the wafer that you put in a casket and worship?,.
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mattp0625
Guest
When did I say we worship Mary or call her God? I didn't, and you cannot prove it because you only have manufactured proof.
1. Don't you believe Pope is infallible?
What he did in front of Mary statue is infallible isn't it?
He bow before Mary, mean he believe Mary see what he did. If not why?
It's mean he believe Mary is omnipresence. Only God omnipresence.
2. You believe only Vatican has authority to interpreted the and make a doctrine, don't you?
Indonesian catholic pray to Mary and they put in they official web.
If Vatican not agree, why not reprimanded?
3. Do you believe that Only God have the right to issue the law regarding salvation? Mean who ever issue the law of salvation is god.
Mary issue the law of salvation. mean Mary is god.
Scapular
Whosoever dies wearing this Scapular Shall not suffer eternal fire!
Our Lady of Mount Carmel to Simon StockJuly 16, 1251No matter how extraordinary this promise may appear to be, the Blessed Mother made it and She will keep it. At the word of Her FIAT, She conceived by the Holy Ghost and the Incarnate Word became Man. If Almighty God, in obedience to the word of the priest every day at Holy Mass, comes down upon our Altars Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity, will He refuse His Mother this grace for Her children!
In other word Mary issue the law that if a person wear that scapular when she or he die, will not go to hell.
Is Mary God? Is vatican agree? if not why not stop this business ?
It may not state in the catechism, but it imply that catholic make his follower worship Mary.
Oh....I see, so then you think that the the ark of the covenant was JUST a box aswell? Unlike you and many others on this site, we Catholics can see that she is special. Like in Rev. 11-12 that names her as the Ark of the new Covenant!
You know KA, there will come a time when you are going to stand before Christ, and explain to Him why you disrespected His mother. How are you planning on doing that? If any of my friends come up to me and said my mother was nothing but a mere vessel, and she was nothing....there would be hell to pay. So, what makes you think Jesus will feel any differnt? There just may be literally "hell" to pay. Are you willing to take that chance?
First off KA, Mary as co-redemptrix is a doctrine not a dogma. Secindly, the Catholic Church does not (never has/never will)that Mary as Co-redemptrix is equal to Christ. “Co” is from the Latin “cum,“ meaning“with”. “Trix” is a feminine suffix, so the word means “the woman with the redeemer”---the woman with the one doing the act of redemption. Looks like I am remaining Catholic.
So...where do you think this grave of her's may be? The reason I ask, is because from the first, Christians gave homage to saints, including many about whom we now know little or nothing. Cities vied for the title of the last resting place of the most famous saints. Rome, for example, houses the tombs of Peter and Paul, Peter’s tomb being under the high altar of St. Peter’s Basilica in Rome. In the early Christian centuries relics of saints were zealously guarded and highly prized. The bones of those martyred in the Coliseum, for instance, were quickly gathered up and preserved—there are many accounts of this in the biographies of those who gave their lives for the faith.
It is agreed upon that Mary ended her life in Jerusalem, or perhaps in Ephesus. However, neither those cities nor any other claimed her remains, though there are claims about possessing her (temporary) tomb. And why did no city claim the bones of Mary? Apparently because there weren’t any bones to claim, and people knew it. Here was Mary, certainly the most privileged of all the saints, certainly the most saintly, but we have no record of her bodily remains being venerated anywhere? How do you explain that?
As far as you saying the saints can't hear our prayers...There are a number of Scripture passages which directly or indirectly disagree with you, like: Hebrews 11:1-12:1 finishes "Seeing we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses [in other words, the heroes and martyrs of the faith from ages past], let us run with perseverance the race that is set before us." Thus, the heroes and martyrs are a good example for us, and surround us like spectators at a running race — therefore, obviously, they know about us and can see our struggles from heaven.
James 5:16-18: 'The prayer of the good man has powerful effect." In other words, the most powerful intercessors in the Church are those most advanced in holiness. And who is more advanced in holiness than a soul who is already fully sanctified and in heaven?
Revelation 5:8; 8:3-4: "In heaven the elders and angels offer up the prayers of the saints [on earth] as incense before the throne of God." In this passage it is important to note that the New Testament uses the word "saint" of every baptized Christian, not because we are all perfectly holy, but because we have all at least received the gift of the Holy Spirit. So this passage implies that the angels and elders (holy Christian leaders now in heaven) hear the prayers of every Christian on earth, and join their prayer now with ours. In short KA, put these passages together, and they certainly imply that the saints in heaven know of our struggles on earth and of our prayers, and join their powerful intercessory prayers with ours.
If you believe this to be true, why don't you accept my challenge and bring me into your church?
I think your personal interpretation of these passages to be off base KA. What do you think is the purposeof God's law or commandments KA? The Pharisees prided themselves in the knowledge of the law and their ritual requirements. They made it a life-time practice to study the 616 precepts of the Old Testament along with the numerous rabbinic commentaries. They tested Jesus to see if he correctly understood the law as they did. Jesus startled them with his profound simplicity and mastery of the law of God and its purpose.
Which brings up another question What do you think God require of us? We catholics believe simply that we love as he loves! God is love and everything he does flows from his love for us. God loved us first and our love for him is a response to his exceeding grace and kindness towards us. The love of God comes first and the love of neighbor is firmly grounded in the love of God. The more we know of God's love and truth the more we love what he loves and reject what is hateful and contrary to his will.
Lastly KA, what do you think makes our love for God and his commands grow in us? O believe faith in God and hope in his promises strengthens us in the love of God. They are essential for a good relationship with God, for being united with him. The more we know of God the more we love him and the more we love him the greater we believe and hope in his promises. The Lord, through the gift of the Holy Spirit, gives us a new freedom to love as he loves. Do you allow anything to keep you from the love of God and the joy of serving others with a generous heart? Paul the Apostle says: hope does not disappoint us, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit which has been given to us (Romans 5:5).
Pax Christi
"From henceforth, all generation shall call me Blessed." ---Luke 1:48
Well.... we have our good days and our bad days, but thanks for askin!!! Lol!
p.s. I too could never get the wig thing our first prez had an obsession about! Lol
well at least one thing is sure . you cannot find the birth of the Roman Catholic church in the Bible. As a widespread denomination it did not come into existence until 7th century AD or later. There WAS a church in Rome, but it had no authority over other churches. And having received Paul's letter it was soundly based on justification by faith ALONE. It made no extraordinary claims, and according to Paul's letter to the Romans it had no single bishop and knew nothing of Peter being there. Furthermore the genuine letter of Clement of Rome also knew nothing of a single bishop. So how could there be a Pope? LOL
Thats right... nowhere does it state that we Catholics are to worship Mary, never has....never will!!! You may think it implies we do, because this fallacy has been pounded into your head for lord knows how long. I am happy to see you doing your homework and relizing the myth of Catholics worshiping Mary is a bald face lie! Guess I won't be denouncing Catholicism, and joining your church either.
Pax Christi
"From henceforth, all generations shall call me Blessed." ----Luke 1:48
When was the last time you have? You do consider yourself part of "all generations" do you not?
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mattp0625
Guest
List of Man-Made Terms and Concepts Utilized by Protestants:
Age of Accountability
Total Depravity of Man
Personal Lord and Saviour
Ask Jesus into your Heart
The Rapture
Invisible Church
Folding your Hands, Bowing your Head
“Personal Relationship with Christ”
Enthroning the Bible in your Heart
“Covered with the righteousness of Christ”
Limited Atonement
Imputed righteousness
Altar Call
Dedication; Rededication
“Giving your Life to the Lord”
Revival
Inerrancy
Eternal Security
“Once saved, always saved”
Denominations
Faith alone
Sola Scriptura
Devotions
Wedding rings
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mattp0625
Guest
Hey Jackson!
Red letters and false assumptions didn't work for you, neither will blue letters lol
Red letters and false assumptions didn't work for you, neither will blue letters lol
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