Catholic Heresy (for the record)

[valiant]

I'm just trying to understand ok b/c the majority of Christians in the world call her Theotokos, and most i've spoke with interpret that as mother of God ok? When you say "she was the mother of the earthly messiah" your talking about Jesus, God Incarnate, in other words she was the mother of God Incarnate/Jesus/One of the trinity/ The Godman/ Jesus Christ. Right?

theotokos means 'God-carrier'. The early church insisted on that rather than mother of God. So they certainly did not see it as meaning mother of God.

No God was not conceived by her in any shape or form. God has existed from eternity and that includes the Son. The Son existed BEFORE He entered through the working of the Holy Spirit into her womb. He is eternal. It was only His flesh which was conceived of Mary. She was NOT the mother of God. Think about it. GOD HAS NO MOTHER.

What she did was act as His mother while He was growing up. But she failed in her responsibility once or twice, and He repudiated her because of her attitude at least ONCE (Mark 3/21-35). He NEVER called her mother in the records we have. He called her 'woman'. Once He commenced His Messianic ministry He never called her mother. And He said quite clearly that those who heard the word of God and kept it were more blessed than she.

 

[notuptome]

It is not praying to Mary. We pray to Jesus and worship Him. We ask Mary to pray FOR us and to interceed as one "highly favored by God". This is a huge difference which is highly mischaracterized.

The practice of praying to the dead has its roots in paganism. Jesus never prayed to the dead. Jesus never taught His disciples to pray to the dead.

The souls of those departed are in the presence of Christ. They are perfected and can tolerate no sin in their presence. They have no interest in the events in this world of sin. Jesus shields them from all this sinful imperfection. The prayers of believers are heard by our Father in heaven. The prayers of the lost are not heard as sin separates them from God. The first prayer god hears is our prayer for forgiveness. The souls of lost folks are in torment and have much too much to be concerned about to listen to anything that is going on in this earth.

The fields are white unto harvest but the laborers are few.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[mattp0625]

theotokos means God-carrier'. The early church insisted on that rather than mother of God. So they certainly did not see it as meaning mother of God.

No God was not conceived by her in any shape or form. God has existed from eternity and that includes the Son. The Son existed BEFORE He entered through the working of the Holy Spirit into her womb. He is eternal. It was only His flesh which was conceived of Mary. She was NOT the mother of God. Think about it. GOD HAS NO MOTHER.

What she did was act as His mother while He was growing up. But she failed in her responsibility once or twice, and He repudiated here because of her attitude at least ONCE. He NEVER called her mother in the records we have. He called her 'woman'. Once He commenced His Messianic ministry He never called her mother. And He said quit clearly that those who heard the word of God and kept it were more blessed than she.

There must be alternate meanings of the words conceive, womb, and Jesus

 

[SAVAS]

No I am not bitter or angry or ex-RCC. I am annoyed that the Roman Catholic church tells such lies about her and tries to exalt her beyond measure when she was just an ordinary Christian who failed Him in the middle of His ministry.

Who didn't fail Christ in his ministry?

 

[valiant]

Did the angel Gabriel come to you and call you favored? Oh my.

God Himself told me I am highly favoured (Eph 1.6). If an angel came to me with a special task for me t odo he would certainly say I was highly favoured. But it would not mean I was special. Gideon was highly favoured

 

[mattp0625]

Are you saying the mother of Jesus is not in heaven? Are you also saying Jesus won't like us asking His mom for prayers?
Don't ask my mom for prayers! Lol

 

[mattp0625]

Let me know when Gabriel visits you. I will be waiting .

 

[valiant]

There must be alternate meanings of the words conceive, womb, and Jesus

The Son was 'born of the seed of David according to the flesh' (Rom 1.3). This scripture makes the same distinction as I made. It was His flesh that was born of the seed of David. He Himself entered into His flesh through the operation of the Holy Spirit. Thus Mary was the mother of His flesh, not of Him Himself.

 

[mattp0625]

The Son was 'born of the seed of David according to the flesh' (Rom 1.3). This scripture makes the same distinction as I made. It was His flesh that was born of the seed of David. He Himself entered into His flesh through the operation of the Holy Spirit. Thus Mary was the mother of His flesh, not of Him Himself.

When Gabriel visits you, I hope he is open to being corrected by you.

 

[valiant]

Are you saying the mother of Jesus is not in heaven? Are you also saying Jesus won't like us asking His mom for prayers?
Don't ask my mom for prayers! Lol

Why do you Roman Catholics like to write off your heresies as a joke? I did not say that Mary was not in Heaven. After His death she became born again Christian so she will be in Heaven with all other born again Christians. But she will not be in a special place. Nor will she be able to hear people praying on earth. Along with all God's people in Heaven she will be busy singing God's praises. She is not NOW Jesus' Mom. She is His worshiper. Remember He passed her over to John to be John's mother.

I will not be asking your mom for her prayers. And if she is in Heaven (or Hell) it would be a waste of time.

 

[valiant]

When Gabriel visits you, I hope he is open to being corrected by you.

Gabriel agreed with me. He said she was highly favoured by being chosen to be the mother of the Messiah. He did not say anything about her future life. He would not know that she would try to interfere in Jesus' ministry.

 

[mattp0625]

That was a reference to Mary, mother of Jesus. No joke.

 

[valiant]

Who didn't fail Christ in his ministry?

true but the RCs try to claim that she was perfect and never sinned. Had she been so she would not have failed Him.

 

[mattp0625]

Yes- Gabriel said she would conceive in her womb..., And so the child will be holy and be called Son of God. So we agree.

 

[valiant]

That was a reference to Mary, mother of Jesus. No joke.

Yes the mother of Jesus according to the flesh, or as NIV puts it according to His human nature. She was the mother of all that was human in Jesus. She was not the mother of His Godhood.

 

[mattp0625]

So you think Jesus doesn't want us to ask His mom for prayers.

 

[valiant]

Yes- Gabriel said she would conceive in her womb..., And so the child will be holy and be called Son of God. So we agree.

I wonder why you miss out the intervening words? Could it be because you know they destroy your case? She would 'conceive in her womb and bring forth a (human) son and call His Name Jesus.' That is the birth of His human side.

'The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you, FOR WHICH REASON also that which is to be born will be called the Son of God'. That is the birth of His divine side.

Don't you feel even a little bit ashamed of trying to deceive everyone? But anything is allowable in the Roman Catholic church. It is founded on lies, deception, murder, rape, adultery and every other sin. Just read the histories of the popes written by independent authors.


She bore His humanity. He was 'born of the seed of David according to the flesh' (Rom 1.3). But the Holy Spirit bore His Godhood. THAT was why He would be called the Son of the Most High.

You see you are simply playing with words. This is how the RC church defends all its teachings. it uses vague phrases and half Scriptures out of context and then makes them mean a hundred different things. She conceived in her womb the humanity of Jesus, the Holy Spirit put within that humanity His Godhood. That is the truth.

 

[valiant]

So you think Jesus doesn't want us to ask His mom for prayers.

I am absolutely certain He doesn''t. That would be prayers to the dead which is forbidden by Scripture.

 

[mattp0625]

Not really - I'm typing on a phone and it saved time. It's ok, I can accept false accusations.
i choose to put my faith in the mother - son relationship of Jesus and Mary versus finger pointers. Thanks anyway and have a nice day

 

[Jeff_56]

Not really - I'm typing on a phone and it saved time. It's ok, I can accept false accusations.
i choose to put my faith in the mother - son relationship of Jesus and Mary versus finger pointers. Thanks anyway and have a nice day

well, according to GOD'S WORD, that's an admission of sin for yourself. but not a confession nor repentance. without repentance, as it is written in GOD'S WORD, there is no forgiveness of sin.