When does the rapture occur?

[JesusIsAll]

I'm trying to help you the best I can and by the Grace of God, you will either get it, or not get it.

Must I point out that I don't recall ever asking for your help? National Geographic or Muslim green horsey apocalypse maps aside, have I expressed any unease or dissatisfaction with truths, expressed any lack of certainty or the need for some spiritual injection from you? I do get it, by the grace of God, in the same way I also get it you don't understand the Bible. Hasn't this always been the case? Is there a fiber in your being that could believe I need your kind of help? I don't even know where that comes from, and wouldn't ask, or care to know. As to insults, your stuff about everybody else, wallowing in demonic deception and poised to be Antichrist fodder is not an insult of other believers? You're a joke. You troll the rapture. You're arguments don't even have any nexus with common sense, very often, much less theology. What else can I say?

 

[JesusIsAll]

The subject has more to do with trying to make sense of the Gospel in your intellectual mind, which is impossible.

The mind of God is the highest of all intellects. Please don't project your experience on what another person may experience that you don't, for instance things you say are troubling don't exist in dealing with the God I know. Or, for instance, you are projecting your reality that you can't differentiate the way one person uses scripture from another. This is a personal matter to you, which you can't relegate to others.

 

[JesusIsAll]

The world matters to the Lord. He came to save the world. To dwell on the destruction of the world and escaping, rather than living in this world (not of it) and being witnesses of His life and light, seems a huge cop-out. THAT's what's troubling to me.

A large component of the word of God deals with prophecy. That these things are in the word of God, in the first place, necessarily says they are important, a person admonished to study Revelation to know its blessings. Please rip big chunks out of somebody else's Bible, and don't try to direct what I should study or discuss of the word of God.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Revelation 1:1-3 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

Therein ends that matter. Let God be true, and every man a liar. I know I shouldn't be doing it, but I'm going off to lookup a matter involving mountains in the Greek versus hills that has escaped my memory, in Revelation, despite all that destruction we should be hush hush about. (Just put a sock in it, God?) Anyway, I'm just an incorrigible that way.

 

[Reborn]

A large component of the word of God deals with prophecy. That these things are in the word of God, in the first place, necessarily says they are important, a person admonished to study Revelation to know its blessings. Please rip big chunks out of somebody else's Bible, and don't try to direct what I should study or discuss of the word of God.

Should we teach our opinions as fact?
Are we discussing, correcting, teaching?......... or just trying to get people to like the color blue, because we do?

You being a big Revelations fan.......probably knows what Revelation 22 states then?
What does it mean to you?
Just wondering?

 

[PlainWord]

Must I point out that I don't recall ever asking for your help? National Geographic or Muslim green horsey apocalypse maps aside, have I expressed any unease or dissatisfaction with truths, expressed any lack of certainty or the need for some spiritual injection from you? I do get it, by the grace of God, in the same way I also get it you don't understand the Bible. Hasn't this always been the case? Is there a fiber in your being that could believe I need your kind of help? I don't even know where that comes from, and wouldn't ask, or care to know. As to insults, your stuff about everybody else, wallowing in demonic deception and poised to be Antichrist fodder is not an insult of other believers? You're a joke. You troll the rapture. You're arguments don't even have any nexus with common sense, very often, much less theology. What else can I say?

Nothing else needs to be said, you said it all. Enjoy.

 

[PlainWord]

Should we teach our opinions as fact?
Are we discussing, correcting, teaching?......... or just trying to get people to like the color blue, because we do?

You being a big Revelations fan.......probably knows what Revelation 22 states then?
What does it mean to you?
Just wondering?

Some won't allow truth to get in the way of fantasy. He's gonna claim he isn't adding anything as he sees the Pre-Trib Rapture written between the lines of scripture. A little "rightly dividing" and you can invent just about anything. Sad but he has plenty of company.

Remember the story of Gideon? He started out with 32,000 troops but God said that was too many, lest Israel take credit for the victory. But with 300 troops, God received all the credit and glory. So it will be in the Great Tribulation.

 

[VCO]

I had to comment on this because enduring to the end has nothing to do with meaning to stay alive tell the end of the tribulation. Enduring to the end means you stay grounded in the faith in Jesus Christ until either you die, are killed, or raptured.
If we are in the GT tribulation and refuse the mark and refuse to worship the man of sin, and he kills us, then we have endured to the end.

Just like Jesus told the Apostles in Matthew 10 when He sent them out 2 by 2 to preach the gospel message. Jesus told them the same in verse 22 to endure to the end to be saved, so He was saying to keep their faith in Him through all the trials and personal tribulations they would go through to preach the word for to receive salvation.

So enduring to the end means staying/keeping your faith in the Lord Jesus Christ unto salvation !!!

I agree whole heartedly. Whenever taught the mark of the Beast to inmates, and invited them explain their thoughts on the subject, most of them got all macho, and bragged that there was NOTHING the Antichrist could do to them that would make them take the Mark. Then I would ask, "Can you watch them behead your two year old boy, and not take the Mark to save his life? Can you watch them behead your baby daughter, and not take the Mark to save her life?" All the macho attitudes disappeared, and everyone got quiet. THEN I would teach the pre-trib Calling Out of the Bride, to go to the Wedding of the Lamb.

1 Thessalonians 5:9 (ESV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] For God has not destined us for wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ,

Revelation 3:10 (ESV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Because you have kept my word about patient endurance, I will keep you from the hour of trial that is coming on the whole world, to try those who dwell on the earth.

Then we cannot be ON THE WORLD, can we?

Matthew 25:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] "But at midnight there was a shout, 'Behold, the bridegroom! Come out to meet him.'

 

[popeye]

I had to comment on this because enduring to the end has nothing to do with meaning to stay alive tell the end of the tribulation. Enduring to the end means you stay grounded in the faith in Jesus Christ until either you die, are killed, or raptured.
If we are in the GT tribulation and refuse the mark and refuse to worship the man of sin, and he kills us, then we have endured to the end.

Just like Jesus told the Apostles in Matthew 10 when He sent them out 2 by 2 to preach the gospel message. Jesus told them the same in verse 22 to endure to the end to be saved, so He was saying to keep their faith in Him through all the trials and personal tribulations they would go through to preach the word for to receive salvation.

So enduring to the end means staying/keeping your faith in the Lord Jesus Christ unto salvation !!!

So enduring to the end means staying/keeping your faith in the Lord Jesus Christ unto salvation !!!

Or,all the saved at the end of life,not the gt

 

[popeye]

We know without a doubt that many people do not receive the mark. Those who have the "mark" are killed by "Him who sat on the horse" (Rev 19:21).

None that stay alive. The ac kills them or has them killed.

 

[Elin]

Ok,lets see if we can find a verse pointing to a postrib rapture.

Looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,looking,.......


sorry
zero.

You didn't look here.

 

[popeye]

One of the problems you have is you see this as a global event. You fail to recognize that John was writing in Apocalyptic literary style. He was writing specifically to the persecuted churches of Asia Minor (modern day Turkey) in a way that they would understand but the Romans would not. The "SEA" is mostly Syria, Iraq and Iran and other pockets made up of Shia. The earth, is the rest of the Muslim world made up of Sunni. It isn't the whole planet!! Here's your earth and sea. The "Sea" is in dark green, the "earth" is in light green. GREEN (CLOROS) PALE HORSE, get it??

What I get is,using your template we can conclude that jesus had no way of knowing his prophetic thesis (not John's) would be available to the modern world.
And that since john had no understanding of gun powder,tanks,and jets,none of these items are allowed.
And since Global really means local,noah''s flood was little more than a local event.("entire planet" God was unable to understand)

 

[popeye]

We know without a doubt that many people do not receive the mark. Those who have the "mark" are killed by "Him who sat on the horse" (Rev 19:21).

None that stay alive. The ac kills them or has them killed.

i am sure the remnant jews do get a pass,as well s some natves in equador

 

[Elin]

As simple as Brother Blain's response is, I am in agreement with it because it is the simple truth. And I believe the source of his Authority is the Holy Spirit in his heart.

I don't have much use for the whole battleground of end-time philosophies and the multitude of interpretations about the rapture. And each of these post conflicts with the next throughout the entire thread. And strangely, each one is using scripture to support their opinion and giving Biblical answers to object to everyone else's opinion. Don't you find that troubling?

It's because their responses are based in uncertain private interpretation of unfulfilled prophetic riddles instead of certain and clear NT teaching, as does the OP.

 

[Elin]

Actually, what's troubling is that these posts are demanding to be technically correct about words on a page which they fail to see with spiritual eyes. The subject has more to do with trying to make sense of the Gospel in your intellectual mind, which is impossible. The flesh can't fathom spiritual things. I wonder why you are all so intrigued with questions regarding Christ's return that have nothing to do with Christ at all. Jesus said take no thought for tomorrow. Jesus said rest in Him and don't be anxious about anything. Jesus said He came to bring us life and that more abundantly. What has the rapture to do with the here and now?

We are to be ready for his coming with out lamps burning (obedient faith).

 

[PlainWord]

None that stay alive. The ac kills them or has them killed.

[SUP]21 [/SUP]And the rest were killed with the sword which proceeded from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse. And all the birds were filled with their flesh.

 

[Elin]

Must I point out that I don't recall ever asking for your help? National Geographic or Muslim green horsey apocalypse maps aside, have I expressed any unease or dissatisfaction with truths, expressed any lack of certainty or the need for some spiritual injection from you? I do get it, by the grace of God, in the same way I also get it you don't understand the Bible. Hasn't this always been the case? Is there a fiber in your being that could believe I need your kind of help? I don't even know where that comes from, and wouldn't ask, or care to know. As to insults, your stuff about everybody else, wallowing in demonic deception and poised to be Antichrist fodder is not an insult of other believers? You're a joke. You troll the rapture. You're arguments don't even have any nexus with common sense, very often, much less theology. What else can I say?

You could tell us what you really think about him. . .

 

[popeye]

Some won't allow truth to get in the way of fantasy. He's gonna claim he isn't adding anything as he sees the Pre-Trib Rapture written between the lines of scripture. A little "rightly dividing" and you can invent just about anything. Sad but he has plenty of company.

Remember the story of Gideon? He started out with 32,000 troops but God said that was too many, lest Israel take credit for the victory. But with 300 troops, God received all the credit and glory. So it will be in the Great Tribulation.

Except gideon and co were not martyrs,and had a different mandate. Was the devil empowered to overcome the saints in gideons battle?

 

[popeye]

[SUP]21 [/SUP]And the rest were killed with the sword which proceeded from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse. And all the birds were filled with their flesh.

21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Remnant of the army

 

[PlainWord]

It's because their responses are based in uncertain private interpretation of unfulfilled prophetic riddles instead of certain and clear NT teaching, as does the OP.

Revelation really doesn't reveal much of what isn't already taught in the OT. Sure we get some insights into heaven, the throne, the elders, etc but events as they unfold on earth are pretty much found in the OT. That's my take any way.

John wrote to the 7 churches in Asia Minor, whom he knew. These churches were enduring tremendous tribulation and persecution. John counts himself as brothers with them in that as obviously he was exiled away on Patmos. An old man, apparently John was still viewed as a threat by the Roman Empire. That's why he wrote much of Revelation in the style of Apocalyptic literature so that his audience (who were expert in the OT) would understand while the Romans would not.

The Book of Revelation is actually an inspiration. For all the "scary" events in there, the message is that in the end GOD WINS!!! The really bad stuff is limited to 1/4 of the world. If you happen to live in that part - Get out!! If you live in the other 3/4 of the world, just wait for Christ to return. That's all we have to do.

We know who that the Islamic nations will cause all of the trouble in the end times just as they have been doing off and on for centuries. We know they kill themselves in large numbers before uniting and then going after Israel. Then we know just as things are at their worst for Israel, God intervenes and wipes out the Arab world.