THE GREAT DEBATE...LAW AND GRACE

[dcontroversal]

rolls eyes.

the sins of the past spoken of there are sins of the OT believers, who sinned BEFORE Christ paid for it.

The forbearance of God proves God spoke of knowing the sin would be forgive in the first place. This proves he meant pre cross. Not post salvation.

It is in Gods forbearance that he saves us totally of our sin when he declares us saved, including past present and future sin.

Amen to this as well......they will post that set of verse to prove you can loose salvation if you sin, and yet they never seem to sin or sin enough to loose their salvation or have a way to earn it back by good deeds or works....

Originally Posted by newbirth

Romans 3:24-26King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]24 [/SUP]Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

[SUP]25 [/SUP]Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

[SUP]26 [/SUP]To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Hebrews 10:17-19King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]17 [/SUP]And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.

[SUP]19 [/SUP]Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

 

[kennethcadwell]

then how can God say you HAVE eternal life (which he did) when you do not have eternal life?

Can you explain this?

Yes I can because our Lord Jesus said you have to endure to the end to be saved.
He also says the one who does the Fathers will gets eternal life, so this means you don't have tell after you have lived by His will and not your own. The ones that talk as if you have it immediately, are about assurance of having it not actually possessing it yet.

 

[kennethcadwell]

Wrong...but the topic this thread is to get people free of sin by setting them free from the law...which is the strength of sin.

Ps start a thread on the topic and I will explain how the Blood of Jesus is always cleansing the believer who trust in His Blood...and that righteousness is eternal ..not temporal until you sin and confess...

Go read both Romans 3:25 and 2 Peter 1:9 it says you are cleansed of your past sins, then in 1 John he says that if you do sin that if you confess them, we have an advocate in our Lord Jesus that will forgive. The key is confession, until that is done they are not forgiven.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yes I can because our Lord Jesus said you have to endure to the end to be saved.
He also says the one who does the Fathers will gets eternal life, so this means you don't have tell after you have lived by His will and not your own. The ones that talk as if you have it immediately, are about assurance of having it not actually possessing it yet.

No, this is not the case.

Jesus said whoever believes in him HAS ETERNAL LIFE.

John said he gave us the book of john, so can KNOW WE HAVE eternal life.

Jesus said whoever believes HAS eternal life. Will never die, Live forever, and will be risen on the last day.

So did Jesus lie? Did John lie?

How can you HAVE eternal life, if you do not have it.

 

[dcontroversal]

No, this is not the case.

Jesus said whoever believes in him HAS ETERNAL LIFE.

John said he gave us the book of john, so can KNOW WE HAVE eternal life.

Jesus said whoever believes HAS eternal life. Will never die, Live forever, and will be risen on the last day.

So did Jesus lie? Did John lie?

How can you HAVE eternal life, if you do not have it.

Amen and not to mention that if you can loose it....it is not eternal.......but TEMPORARY!

 

[kennethcadwell]

No, this is not the case.

Jesus said whoever believes in him HAS ETERNAL LIFE.

John said he gave us the book of john, so can KNOW WE HAVE eternal life.

Jesus said whoever believes HAS eternal life. Will never die, Live forever, and will be risen on the last day.

So did Jesus lie? Did John lie?

How can you HAVE eternal life, if you do not have it.

James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.




Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




Matthew 10:22
And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”


Hebrews 10:36
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.




Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.




Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.




1 Timothy 4:16
Keep a close watch on yourself and on the teaching. Persist in this, for by so doing you will save both yourself and your hearers.




1 Corinthians 9:24-25
Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.




Romans 11:19-22
Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.




Mark 13:9-13
“But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.



[h=1]2 Peter 1:5-9
For this very reason, make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; 6 and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; 7 and to godliness, mutual affection; and to mutual affection, love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductivein your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 But whoever does not have them is nearsighted and blind, forgetting that they have been cleansed from their past sins.[/h]

 

[Mitspa]

Go read both Romans 3:25 and 2 Peter 1:9 it says you are cleansed of your past sins, then in 1 John he says that if you do sin that if you confess them, we have an advocate in our Lord Jesus that will forgive. The key is confession, until that is done they are not forgiven.

Sure past sins...because we are are now justified by Christ..you cannot be reckoned a sinner (under the law) and righteous by the Blood of Christ at the same time....Having been justified we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ... God is not judging believers he has justified by the law that is made to find sin and condemn (ministry of condemnation)


Its hard to explain this to some of you because your so full of religious pride you will not even try to understand the truth!
Ro 4:6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,
7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin

 

[Mitspa]

James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.




Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




Matthew 10:22
And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”


Hebrews 10:36
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.




Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.




Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.




1 Timothy 4:16
Keep a close watch on yourself and on the teaching. Persist in this, for by so doing you will save both yourself and your hearers.




1 Corinthians 9:24-25
Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.




Romans 11:19-22
Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.




Mark 13:9-13
“But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.



2 Peter 1:5-9
For this very reason, make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; 6 and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; 7 and to godliness, mutual affection; and to mutual affection, love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductivein your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 But whoever does not have them is nearsighted and blind, forgetting that they have been cleansed from their past sins.

To turn from the faith is to turn back to the law...the law is not of faith... Its you guys teaching the law that has left the faith...not those of us who stand in grace..."you have fallen from grace who seek to be justified by the law"

 

[Mitspa]

1Jo 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.


which one of you have sinned? or is John saying what Paul and David said? Blessed is the man in whom the Lord will not impute sin... God will not impute sin to those He has justified by faith...if your under the law...your NOT in faith and you are willfully sinning!

 

[Mitspa]

Ro 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

Ro 5:1 ¶ Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

God took us out of the law because He did not want to condemn us...and justified us in Christ...the only biblical way to to reject that is to turn back to the law! Because the law is not of faith and you have willfully gone back into sin... you have forsaken the way of righteousness ...like a dog to its vomit and a pig to is wallow.

 

[Hizikyah]

James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.




Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




Matthew 10:22
And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”


Hebrews 10:36
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.




Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.




Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.




1 Timothy 4:16
Keep a close watch on yourself and on the teaching. Persist in this, for by so doing you will save both yourself and your hearers.




1 Corinthians 9:24-25
Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.




Romans 11:19-22
Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.




Mark 13:9-13
“But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.



2 Peter 1:5-9
For this very reason, make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; 6 and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; 7 and to godliness, mutual affection; and to mutual affection, love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductivein your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 But whoever does not have them is nearsighted and blind, forgetting that they have been cleansed from their past sins.

To turn from the faith is to turn back to the law...the law is not of faith... Its you guys teaching the law that has left the faith...not those of us who stand in grace..."you have fallen from grace who seek to be justified by the law"

This man posts nothing but Scripture yet you attack his doctrine... How is that possible when he only posted Scripture? and alot of your posts are not Scripture, but "Scriptural principles" and hat becomes a grey area, easy to say whatever. Easy to mix 100% stone cold truth with a little not so much truth. When anyone gives opinions this is possible.

 

[kennethcadwell]

To turn from the faith is to turn back to the law...the law is not of faith... Its you guys teaching the law that has left the faith...not those of us who stand in grace..."you have fallen from grace who seek to be justified by the law"

Wrong, for I do not preach the law.
I preach doing things the Lord said out of love and obedience to Him, and make a point that He, Paul, Peter, James, and John all show that if your outer actions do not match your belief. You have a dead faith that does not lead to salvation.

And in post # 586 all those scriptures have the same them, and that is that sin can be accounted against you again if it is an unrepented, not confessed and asked forgiven of sin. That makes it a willful sin that is not covered by the Lord's blood.

If you think that a believer can not fall away and loose salvation then you deny what Paul said to the Galatians about how they have fallen from grace, and what Peter said about believers who get caught up in sin again and overcome by them.
Both then say unless they are brought back in repentance they will not get eternal life.

Then you give 1 John 3:9 where the context here is that those who have the Holy Spirit in them will not commit willful unrepented sin, for when they do sin they will feel the conviction from the Holy Spirit that will lead them to sorrow and repentance.
This can not contradict what John said in the first and second chapters about believers do sin, but if they confess it will be forgiven. The context is unrepented willful sin in 3:9.

 

[newbirth]

I offered to post on a thread and explain my point of view...but talking about sin and ignoring the truth that the believer is not under the law and that the law produces sinful lust and desires in the flesh...is kinda vain.... I like this topic on this thread ...that's why I started it to not interfere with other topics on other threads...seems fair to me?

still no scripture....but you keep saying.... that the law produces sinful lust and desires in the flesh....

James 1:13-15King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
[SUP]14 [/SUP]But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

[SUP]15 [/SUP]Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

 

[Mitspa]

Wrong, for I do not preach the law.
I preach doing things the Lord said out of love and obedience to Him, and make a point that He, Paul, Peter, James, and John all show that if your outer actions do not match your belief. You have a dead faith that does not lead to salvation.

And in post # 586 all those scriptures have the same them, and that is that sin can be accounted against you again if it is an unrepented, not confessed and asked forgiven of sin. That makes it a willful sin that is not covered by the Lord's blood.

If you think that a believer can not fall away and loose salvation then you deny what Paul said to the Galatians about how they have fallen from grace, and what Peter said about believers who get caught up in sin again and overcome by them.
Both then say unless they are brought back in repentance they will not get eternal life.

Then you give 1 John 3:9 where the context here is that those who have the Holy Spirit in them will not commit willful unrepented sin, for when they do sin they will feel the conviction from the Holy Spirit that will lead them to sorrow and repentance.
This can not contradict what John said in the first and second chapters about believers do sin, but if they confess it will be forgiven. The context is unrepented willful sin in 3:9.

NO! it says plan as day "commit sin" read it! and Yes the warnings are to those who turn back to the law...not those who trust in the grace of God and the blood of Jesus... Who know they are justified by faith and the law cannot take them from that justified position in Christ...which seems to be what you are teaching...that if you sin against the law you are no longer justified by faith...right?

 

[Kerry]

Law = Thou shalt not commit adultery, which many American Christians have broken numerous times not all, but alot and the reason for 60% divorce rate among Christians.

God's Morality = If you look at a women with lust in your heart you have already committed adultery.

Fruit = You can look at beautiful women with out lust and not even think about it.

 

[Mitspa]

still no scripture....but you keep saying.... that the law produces sinful lust and desires in the flesh....

James 1:13-15King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
[SUP]14[/SUP]But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

[SUP]15 [/SUP]Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Who said they was tempted by God...the law of moses is the strength of sin...and produces sinful lust in those under the law.

 

[Mitspa]

This man posts nothing but Scripture yet you attack his doctrine... How is that possible when he only posted Scripture? and alot of your posts are not Scripture, but "Scriptural principles" and hat becomes a grey area, easy to say whatever. Easy to mix 100% stone cold truth with a little not so much truth. When anyone gives opinions this is possible.

The context of those warnings are to those who turn from grace back to law...not those who believe the gospel and stand by the grace of God... So to pull random warnings that don't apply to grace is just error.

 

[newbirth]

Amen and not to mention that if you can loose it....it is not eternal.......but TEMPORARY!

eternal life is eternal....for those who obey the author of their eternal salvation....that means abiding in Christ...and Christ abiding in you....if one depart from Christ it does not make eternal life less eternal....it just means you don't have it abiding in you..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.




Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




Matthew 10:22
And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.




2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”


Hebrews 10:36
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.




Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.




Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.




1 Timothy 4:16
Keep a close watch on yourself and on the teaching. Persist in this, for by so doing you will save both yourself and your hearers.




1 Corinthians 9:24-25
Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.




Romans 11:19-22
Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.




Mark 13:9-13
“But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.



2 Peter 1:5-9
For this very reason, make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; 6 and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; 7 and to godliness, mutual affection; and to mutual affection, love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductivein your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 But whoever does not have them is nearsighted and blind, forgetting that they have been cleansed from their past sins.

so all these verses prove that eternal life is not eternal?

Since when?

I have eternal life. You admit you do not.

Thus you are still under the curse of the law.

You better get out from under the curse. Or you will not see heaven, just the great white thrown.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

To turn from the faith is to turn back to the law...the law is not of faith... Its you guys teaching the law that has left the faith...not those of us who stand in grace..."you have fallen from grace who seek to be justified by the law"

they do not admit they are being justified by the law. nor that they are still under the curse of the law.

This they will never see their plight against God.