It Is satanic Heresy to Deny Eternal Security

[Atwood]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

You still have not shown Abram as ungodly...where did God say he was ungodly

The Lord says it in Romans 4.

:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, hath found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not toward God. 3 For what saith the scripture? 4And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him that worketh, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness.

All men are ungodly. There is none that does good, no not one. All men born into this world are born ungodly, including you & me.

for we before laid to the charge both of Jews and Greeks, that they are all under sin;
10 as it is written,
5There is none righteous, no, not one;
11 There is none that understandeth,
There is none that seeketh after God;
12 They have all turned aside, they are together become unprofitable;
There is none that doeth good, no, not so much as one:
13 6Their throat is an open sepulchre;
With their tongues they have used deceit:
7The poison of asps is under their lips:
14 8Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness:
15 9Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 Destruction and misery are in their ways;
17 And the way of peace have they not known:
18 10There is no fear of God before their eyes.

Abram was not under law so he could not be justified by works of the law just as believers now are not under works of the law and cannot be justified by works of the law.

No unsaved man is ever justified by any works whatsoever, whether the supposed good works were obeying the Noahic covenant, the law written in the conscience, the Law of Moses, the teachings of Jesus, or the church commandments in the epistles.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, not of works lest anyone should boast.

You will find no salvation by following the teachings of Jesus so that you could brag (or any other law). You must take the position of the publican, God be merciful to me a sinner.

That is why the scripture says in one place he was justified by works....Wasn’t Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar?

The why is because Abe was declared righteous by works many years after the was saved. Abe was never saved by works. But his good work of obeying the Lord with the sacrifice of Isaac did & does declare that he was righteous. The good work did not save him, however.

The ungodly sinner is not justified by works. When he trusts Christ as Savior, then apart from any works he is saved & declared righteous (justified).

The word of God is not irrelevant but there are passages that are irrelevant to proving certain theories.

To any reading this who think they can attain righteousness by good works or who think that good works save, you are encouraged to repent of your self-righteous delusion, and trust Christ as Savior.

To any who regard Christ as a mere chance-giver, and pretend to be a Christian, you are urged to repent of downgrading the SAvior to chance-giver, and to actually depend on the Lord Jesus for your eternal destiny.

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

 

[Atwood]

If your looking for a free ride then talk to Atwood, If you want to know the truth, then don't talk to atwood.

For the wages of sin is death,
but the free gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Now if you want to get a self-righteous validation of your works for salvation, see others (like satan -- like Kerry?) If you wish to actually receive salvation, talk to the Lord Jesus.

For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved. (shall be . . . no ifs, ands or buts).

 

[Atwood]

ETERNAL SECURITY IS PART OF SALVATION

In fact, if you could lose salvation; it would not be salvation. Eternal life must be eternal.

The doctrine is clear in the Word of God. So while one looks at this or that rabbit path, passages which are not even about salvation, remember what God's Word says precisely on the subject.

ps 34

Jehovah redeems the soul of his servants;
And none of them who take refuge in him shall be condemned.

Col 3
When Christ, who is our life, shall be manifested, then you also with him shall be manifested in glory.
2 Thes 2:16
Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace,

End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.

31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 3He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth; who is he that condemneth? It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.

Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.


THE OVERCOMER

Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and
I will never blot his name out of the book of life.
I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he shall dwell with them, and they shall be his peoples, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God: and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. And he that sitteth on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he saith, Write: for these words are faithful and true. And he said unto me, They are come to pass. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
He who overcomes shall inherit these things;
and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

< 1 Pet 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto
an inheritance
incorruptible, and
undefiled, and
that does not fade away,
reserved in heaven for you, who
by the power of God are guarded
through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

< 2 Tim 4:18
The Lord will deliver me from every evil work, and will save me unto his heavenly kingdom;

Rm 6:23b
the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 6:37
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

2 Corinthians 1:22
And who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.

Romans 11:29
For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

Philippians 1:6
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

On the cross He cried out, "IT IS FINISHED"!

Ps 52
But as for me, I am like a green olive-tree in the house of God:
I trust in the lovingkindness of God for ever and ever.
I will give thee thanks for ever, because you have done it;

1 Thes 5 end:
"And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is He Who calls you, Who will also do it.

 

[newbirth]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

The Lord says it in Romans 4.

:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, hath found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not toward God. 3 For what saith the scripture? 4And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him that worketh, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness.

All men are ungodly. There is none that does good, no not one. All men born into this world are born ungodly, including you & me.

for we before laid to the charge both of Jews and Greeks, that they are all under sin;
10 as it is written,
5There is none righteous, no, not one;
11 There is none that understandeth,
There is none that seeketh after God;
12 They have all turned aside, they are together become unprofitable;
There is none that doeth good, no, not so much as one:
13 6Their throat is an open sepulchre;
With their tongues they have used deceit:
7The poison of asps is under their lips:
14 8Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness:
15 9Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 Destruction and misery are in their ways;
17 And the way of peace have they not known:
18 10There is no fear of God before their eyes.




No unsaved man is ever justified by any works whatsoever, whether the supposed good works were obeying the Noahic covenant, the law written in the conscience, the Law of Moses, the teachings of Jesus, or the church commandments in the epistles.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, not of works lest anyone should boast.

You will find no salvation by following the teachings of Jesus so that you could brag (or any other law). You must take the position of the publican, God be merciful to me a sinner.



The why is because Abe was declared righteous by works many years after the was saved. Abe was never saved by works. But his good work of obeying the Lord with the sacrifice of Isaac did & does declare that he was righteous. The good work did not save him, however.

The ungodly sinner is not justified by works. When he trusts Christ as Savior, then apart from any works he is saved & declared righteous (justified).

The word of God is not irrelevant but there are passages that are irrelevant to proving certain theories.

To any reading this who think they can attain righteousness by good works or who think that good works save, you are encouraged to repent of your self-righteous delusion, and trust Christ as Savior.

To any who regard Christ as a mere chance-giver, and pretend to be a Christian, you are urged to repent of downgrading the SAvior to chance-giver, and to actually depend on the Lord Jesus for your eternal destiny.

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

what did Abraham believe....He believed God and it was counted as righteousness...what exactly did he believe? You don't know what Abram believed that is why you believe nothing and you do nothing...
[h=3]The Lord’s First Promise to Abram[/h]12 Yahweh said to Abram,
“Leave your land,
your relatives,
and your father’s home.
Go to the land that I will show you.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]I will make you a great nation,
I will bless you.
I will make your name great,
and you will be a blessing.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]I will bless those who bless you,
and whoever curses you, I will curse.
Through you every family on earth will be blessed.”

Abram believed God would do it even though his wife was barren




[h=3]The Lord’s Second Promise to Abram[/h]
[SUP]6 [/SUP]They arrived in Canaan,[SUP][a][/SUP] and Abram traveled through the land to the oak tree belonging to Moreh at Shechem. At that time the Canaanites were in the land. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Then Yahweh appeared to Abram and said, “I’m going to give this land to your descendants.” So he built an altar there to Yahweh, who had appeared to him.


[h=3]The Lord’s Third Promise to Abram[/h][SUP]14 [/SUP]After Lot left, Yahweh said to Abram, “Look north, south, east, and west of where you are. [SUP]15 [/SUP]I will give all the land you see to you and to your descendants for an indefinite period of time. [SUP]16 [/SUP]I will also give you as many descendants as the dust of the earth. If anyone could count the dust of the earth, then he could also count your descendants. [SUP]17 [/SUP]Go! Walk back and forth across the entire land because I will give it to you.” [SUP]18 [/SUP]So Abram moved his tents and went to live by the oak trees belonging to Mamre at Hebron. There he built an altar for Yahweh.


[h=3]The Lord’s Fourth Promise to Abram[/h]15 Later Yahweh spoke his word to Abram in a vision. He said,
“Abram, don’t be afraid.
I am your shield.
Your reward will be very great.”[SUP][a][/SUP]

[SUP]2 [/SUP]Abram asked, “Adonay Yahweh, what will you give me? Since I’m going to die without children, Eliezer of Damascus will inherit[SUP][b][/SUP] my household. [SUP]3 [/SUP]You have given me no children, so this member of my household will be my heir.”
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Suddenly, Yahweh spoke his word to Abram again. He said, “This man will not be your heir. Your own son will be your heir.” [SUP]5 [/SUP]He took Abram outside and said, “Now look up at the sky and count the stars, if you are able to count them.” He also said to him, “That’s how many descendants you will have!” [SUP]6 [/SUP]Then Abram believed Yahweh, and that faith was regarded as the basis of Abram’s approval by Yahweh. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Then Yahweh said to him, “I am Yahweh, who brought you out of Ur of the Chaldeans to give you this land so that you will take possession of it.”

 

[Atwood]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

what did Abraham believe....He believed God and it was counted as righteousness...what exactly did he believe? You don't know what Abram believed that is why you believe nothing and you do nothing...

It is only the unsaved man, who never trusted Christ as Savior (as in dismissing Him as a chance-giver) who has never done even one good work. And He cannot because he has no new child-of-God nature. He may come on this site going on & on about works, wanting his self-righteousness endorsed, but all that is in vain.

What did Abe believe?
It is not what, but Whom.

Abe believed YHWH, trusted in Him as His Savior.

Now once a man does that, he will do good works, and not before.

And actually the topic of this thread is not "do good works," it is Eternal security, salvation for the one who trusts Christ as Savior and thus gets eternal life.

The topic is not the rabbit path of "good works."

For by grace you have been saved through faith, not of works.

Anyone reading this, who has been trying to establish his own self-righteousness, being ignorant of God's righteousness, is invited to trust the Savior today, and to believe

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

 

[Atwood]

Setting Aside the Confusing Canards; Focus on Eternal SEcurity

I am sure that satan would rather you focused on off-topics, but here it is, the theme of the thread:


Ps 34
YHWH redeems the soul of his servants;
And none of them who take refuge in him shall be condemned.

Ps 52
But as for me, I am like a green olive-tree in the house of God:
I trust in the lovingkindness of God for ever and ever.
I will give thee thanks for ever, because thou hast done it;
1 Thes 5 end:
"And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is He Who calls you, Who will also do it.

Col 3
If then ye were raised together with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated on the right hand of God. Set your mind on the things that are above, not on the things that are upon the earth. For ye died, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall be manifested, then shall ye also with him be manifested in glory.

2 Thes 2:16
Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.

31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 3He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth; who is he that condemneth? It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.

Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

< 1 Pet 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

THE OVERCOMER
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he shall dwell with them, and they shall be his peoples, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God: and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. And he that sitteth on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he saith, Write: for these words are faithful and true. And he said unto me, They are come to pass. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit these things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But for the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part shall be in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.

In II Thess. 3:3 “But the Lord is faithful, who shall establish you, and guard you from the evil one.”

In II Tim. 1:12 he sounds a note of rejoicing: “For I know Him whom I have believed, and I am persuaded that He is able to guard that which I have committed unto Him against that day.”
< 2 Tim 4:18
The Lord will deliver me from every evil work, and will save me unto his heavenly kingdom;


2 Tim 1:8-9
… God; who saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before times eternal,

2 thes 2:16-17 Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
Rm 6:23b
the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
John 10:27-29
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
John 6:37
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
2 Corinthians 1:22
And who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.
Romans 11:29
For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.
1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
Philippians 1:6
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.
Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
1 John 5:10-13
Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning his Son. And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
Romans 11:6
But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

Romans 8:34
Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.
Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Philippians 3:20-21
But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.

Ps 138
"thy right hand will save me.
YHWH will perfect that which concerns me:"
Ephesians 1:13
In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
1 John 2:19
They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us.
John 6:40
For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in
For this is the will of my Father, that every one that beholdeth the Son, and believeth on him, should have eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Hebrews 10:14
For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

Ephesians 2:8-10 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
John 4:14
But whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again. The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.
John 6:47
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.
John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
John 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
Psalm 34:22
The Lord redeems the life of his servants; none of those who take refuge in him will be condemned.
Jude 1:24
Now to him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you blameless before the presence of his glory with great joy,
1 Peter 1:3-5
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Colossians 1:13
He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son,
Romans 8:32
He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things?
Romans 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus
John 1:12
But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.
Hebrews 9:15
Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.
Ephesians 1:1-23
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, To the saints who are in Ephesus, and are faithful in Christ Jesus: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus
Ephesians 1:11
In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,

< ps 138
thy right hand will save me.
Jehovah will perfect that which concerns me:
Thy lovingkindness, O Jehovah, endureth forever;

Heb 11:19ff

And these all, having had witness borne to them through their faith, received not the promise, God having provided some better thing concerning us, that apart from us they should not be made perfect. Therefore let us also, seeing we are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, looking unto Jesus the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,


looking unto Jesus the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,


Isaiah 26:12
Jehovah, thou wilt ordain peace for us; for thou hast also wrought all our works for us.

Eph 2
but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), and raised us up with him, and made us to sit with him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus: that in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus: for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not of works, that no man should glory. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

Philip 1:6
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.

 

[newbirth]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

It is only the unsaved man, who never trusted Christ as Savior (as in dismissing Him as a chance-giver) who has never done even one good work. And He cannot because he has no new child-of-God nature. He may come on this site going on & on about works, wanting his self-righteousness endorsed, but all that is in vain.

What did Abe believe?
It is not what, but Whom.

Abe believed YHWH, trusted in Him as His Savior.

Now once a man does that, he will do good works, and not before.

And actually the topic of this thread is not "do good works," it is Eternal security, salvation for the one who trusts Christ as Savior and thus gets eternal life.

The topic is not the rabbit path of "good works."

For by grace you have been saved through faith, not of works.

Anyone reading this, who has been trying to establish his own self-righteousness, being ignorant of God's righteousness, is invited to trust the Savior today, and to believe

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

well you are finally coming around...the thing is you still would not admit it is not just do good works but obey.....go and see what God told him to do and he obeyed.....and years after Isaac was born he maintained his faith and obeyed even to sacrifice his only son.
In your opinion had he disobeyed God would he still be counted as righteous or the faith he had before would it have covered his disobedience?

 

[Atwood]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

well you are finally coming around...the thing is you still would not admit it is not just do good works but obey.....go and see what God told him to do and he obeyed.....and years after Isaac was born he maintained his faith and obeyed even to sacrifice his only son.
In your opinion had he disobeyed God would he still be counted as righteous or the faith he had before would it have covered his disobedience?

NewB, "coming around"?
I haven't changed my theology on salvation one whit. You may have been imagining things.

Admit what? The word of God is clear as a bell. Good works is obeying God. There is nothing about "maintaining faith." But it does maintain. Abe was capable of sinning as all believers are. When they sin, the sin they do is not declared righteous. But they maintain the declaration of righteous from the time the first believe, because it is the connection to the perfectly righteous Christ which is responsible for that righteousness.

Rom 5

15 But not as the trespass, so also is the free gift. For if by the trespass of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God, and the gift by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, abound unto the many. 16 And not as through one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment came of one unto condemnation, but the free gift came of many trespasses unto justification. 17 For if, by the trespass of the one, death reigned through the one; much more shall
they that receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one, even Jesus Christ. 18 So then as through one trespass the judgment came unto all men to condemnation; even so
through one act of righteousness the free gift came unto all men to justification of life. 19 For as through the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the one shall the many be made righteous. 20 And the law came in besides, that the trespass might abound; but where sin abounded, grace did abound more exceedingly: 21 that, as sin reigned in death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

The believer is made righteous through Christ's obedience, not the believer's obedience. Once he is made righteous, that righteousness is manifested whenever the believer by faith does a good work. Thus the good work also declares him righteous, but it does not make him righteous.

 

[Atwood]

The Overcomer Proof of Eternal Security

It may be overlooked the strong promise of eternal security in
the Overcomer teaching of the NT.

Overcomer is explained in 1 John as the believer.

"For whatsoever is begotten of God overcomes the world:
and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And
who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes
that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith."

Every born again believer overcomes. The one who trusts Christ as Savior gets a new nature by a new birth. The believer is an overcomer.
And the overcomer has the promise of eternal security.

Rev 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and
I will never blot his name out of the book of life.
I will confess his name before my Father…

Present status as a believer, which is same as overcomer, guarantees that in the future, the name will never be blotted out!

And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he shall dwell with them, and they shall be his peoples, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God: and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. And he that sitteth on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he saith, Write: for these words are faithful and true. And he said unto me, They are come to pass. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

He who overcomes shall inherit these things;
and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But for the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part shall be in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.

Now let us be reminded that the inheritance is incorruptible, undefiled, fades not away, reserved in Heaven. The believer is guarded by God's power.

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

 

[newbirth]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

Admit what? The word of God is clear as a bell. Good works is obeying God. There is nothing about "maintaining faith." But it does maintain. Abe was capable of sinning as all believers are. When they sin, the sin they do is not declared righteous. But they maintain the declaration of righteous from the time the first believe, because it is the connection to the perfectly righteous Christ which is responsible for that righteousness. The believer is made righteous through Christ's obedience, not the believer's obedience. Once he is made righteous, that righteousness is manifested whenever the believer by faith does a good work. Thus the good work also declares him righteous, but it does not make him righteous.

Romans 6 Living Bible (TLB)
6 Well then, shall we keep on sinning so that God can keep on showing us more and more kindness and forgiveness?
[SUP]2-3 [/SUP]Of course not! Should we keep on sinning when we don’t have to? For sin’s power over us was broken when we became Christians and were baptized to become a part of Jesus Christ; through his death the power of your sinful nature was shattered. [SUP]4 [/SUP]Your old sin-loving nature was buried with him by baptism when he died; and when God the Father, with glorious power, brought him back to life again, you were given his wonderful new life to enjoy.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For you have become a part of him, and so you died with him, so to speak, when he died;[SUP][a][/SUP] and now you share his new life and shall rise as he did. [SUP]6 [/SUP]Your old evil desires were nailed to the cross with him; that part of you that loves to sin was crushed and fatally wounded, so that your sin-loving body is no longer under sin’s control, no longer needs to be a slave to sin; [SUP]7 [/SUP]for when you are deadened to sin you are freed from all its allure and its power over you. [SUP]8 [/SUP]And since your old sin-loving nature “died” with Christ, we know that you will share his new life. [SUP]9 [/SUP]Christ rose from the dead and will never die again. Death no longer has any power over him. [SUP]10 [/SUP]He died once for all to end sin’s power, but now he lives forever in unbroken fellowship with God. [SUP]11 [/SUP]So look upon your old sin nature as dead and unresponsive to sin, and instead be alive to God, alert to him, through Jesus Christ our Lord.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Do not let sin control your puny body any longer; do not give in to its sinful desires. [SUP]13 [/SUP]Do not let any part of your bodies become tools of wickedness, to be used for sinning; but give yourselves completely to God—every part of you—for you are back from death and you want to be tools in the hands of God, to be used for his good purposes. [SUP]14 [/SUP]Sin need never again be your master,[SUP][b][/SUP] for now you are no longer tied to the law where sin enslaves you, but you are free under God’s favor and mercy.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Does this mean that now we can go ahead and sin and not worry about it? (For our salvation does not depend on keeping the law but on receiving God’s grace!) Of course not!
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Don’t you realize that you can choose your own master? You can choose sin (with death) or else obedience (with acquittal). The one to whom you offer yourself—he will take you and be your master, and you will be his slave. [SUP]17 [/SUP]Thank God that though you once chose to be slaves of sin, now you have obeyed with all your heart the teaching to which God has committed you. [SUP]18 [/SUP]And now you are free from your old master, sin; and you have become slaves to your new master, righteousness.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]I speak this way, using the illustration of slaves and masters, because it is easy to understand: just as you used to be slaves to all kinds of sin, so now you must let yourselves be slaves to all that is right and holy.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]In those days when you were slaves of sin you didn’t bother much with goodness. [SUP]21 [/SUP]And what was the result? Evidently not good, since you are ashamed now even to think about those things you used to do, for all of them end in eternal doom. [SUP]22 [/SUP]But now you are free from the power of sin and are slaves of God, and his benefits to you include holiness and everlasting life. [SUP]23 [/SUP]For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[Atwood]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

Excellent scripture, but a paraphrase which needs to be checked vs a literal translation. I substituted 6:11 from the ASV below in your quote

Romans 6 Living Bible (TLB)
6 Well then, shall we keep on sinning so that God can keep on showing us more and more kindness and forgiveness?
[SUP]2-3 [/SUP]Of course not! Should we keep on sinning when we don’t have to? For sin’s power over us was broken when we became Christians and were baptized to become a part of Jesus Christ; through his death the power of your sinful nature was shattered. [SUP]4 [/SUP]Your old sin-loving nature was buried with him by baptism when he died; and when God the Father, with glorious power, brought him back to life again, you were given his wonderful new life to enjoy.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For you have become a part of him, and so you died with him, so to speak, when he died; and now you share his new life and shall rise as he did. [SUP]6 [/SUP]Your old evil desires were nailed to the cross with him; that part of you that loves to sin was crushed and fatally wounded, so that your sin-loving body is no longer under sin’s control, no longer needs to be a slave to sin; [SUP]7 [/SUP]for when you are deadened to sin you are freed from all its allure and its power over you. [SUP]8 [/SUP]And since your old sin-loving nature “died” with Christ, we know that you will share his new life. [SUP]9 [/SUP]Christ rose from the dead and
will never die again. Death no longer has any power over him. [SUP]10 [/SUP]He died once for all to end sin’s power, but now he lives forever in unbroken fellowship with God. [SUP]11 [/SUP]Even so reckon ye also yourselves to be dead unto sin, but alive unto God in Christ Jesus.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Do not let sin control your puny body any longer; do not give in to its sinful desires. [SUP]13 [/SUP]Do not let any part of your bodies become tools of wickedness, to be used for sinning; but give yourselves completely to God—every part of you—for you are back from death and you want to be tools in the hands of God, to be used for his good purposes. [SUP]14 [/SUP]Sin need never again be your master,[SUP][b][/SUP] for now you are no longer tied to the law where sin enslaves you, but you are free under God’s favor and mercy.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Does this mean that now we can go ahead and sin and not worry about it? (For our salvation does not depend on keeping the law but on receiving God’s grace!) Of course not!
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Don’t you realize that you can choose your own master? You can choose sin (with death) or else obedience (with acquittal). The one to whom you offer yourself—he will take you and be your master, and you will be his slave. [SUP]17 [/SUP]Thank God that though you once chose to be slaves of sin, now you have obeyed with all your heart the teaching to which God has committed you. [SUP]18 [/SUP]And now you are free from your old master, sin; and you have become slaves to your new master, righteousness.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]I speak this way, using the illustration of slaves and masters, because it is easy to understand: just as you used to be slaves to all kinds of sin, so now you must let yourselves be slaves to all that is right and holy.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]In those days when you were slaves of sin you didn’t bother much with goodness. [SUP]21 [/SUP]And what was the result? Evidently not good, since you are ashamed now even to think about those things you used to do, for all of them end in eternal doom. [SUP]22 [/SUP]But now you are free from the power of sin and are slaves of God, and
his benefits to you include holiness and everlasting life. [SUP]23 [/SUP]For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

A great passage on eternal security, NewB.

 

[Atwood]

OSS = ONCE SAVED, SAVED! Eternal Security: Golden Chain

8 And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. 29 For whom

he foreknew,
he also foreordained
to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: 30 and whom he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them
he also justified: and whom he justified, them
he also glorified.


31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? 33 Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth; 34 who is he that condemneth? It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36 Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.


37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. 38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities,
nor things present, nor things to come,
nor powers, 39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[RickyZ]

So much wasted energy here that could be doing good somewhere else...

 

[newbirth]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

Excellent scripture, but a paraphrase which needs to be checked vs a literal translation. I substituted 6:11 from the ASV below in your quote

A great passage on eternal security, NewB.

Did you not read vs 16
[SUP]
16 [/SUP]Know ye not, that to whom ye present yourselves as servants unto obedience, his servants ye are whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

You think that way because you did not read vs 19.....[SUP]19 [/SUP]I speak this way, using the illustration of slaves and masters, because it is easy to understand: just as you used to be slaves to all kinds of sin, so now you must let yourselves be slaves to all that is right and holy.


here it is in ASV.....[SUP]19 [/SUP]I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye presented your members as servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity, even so now present your members as servants to righteousness unto sanctification.




Maybe you would now see vs 23 in a different light

 

[Atwood]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

It is interesting how relentless can be the energy of the enemy who does not want persons to trust the Lord Jesus with their eternal destiny.

37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. 38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities,
nor things present, nor things to come,
nor powers,
39 nor height, nor depth,
nor any other creature,
shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[Atwood]

Such a Blessing to Have a Permanent Guanteed Inheritance

If anyone is bothered by objections posted, let me know if you want an explanation or answer. The objectors have been abundantly answered already,.

Inheritance comes from being someone's child. The believer in Christ becomes Someone's Child, namely God's child, which is permanent. One cannot cease being a child of a father. So we get an inheritance:

1 Pet 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

< 1 Pet 1
begat us again: The basis is new birth into God's family

unto an inheritance

incorruptible, and
undefiled, and that
fades not away,
reserved in heaven for you, who
by the power of God are guarded

through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

He gives us eternal life, and we shall never perish.

 

[Atwood]

Savior, Not Chance Giver: I Give them eternal life!

He has promised that we who trust Him as Savior shall never perish.

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

If you have depreciated Him, reducing Him from Savior to mere "chance-giver,"
Repent & trust the Savior to save you from your sins & with your eternal destiny.

For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Call on the 2nd person of the Trinity, the God-man, the Lord Jesus, who died for your sins & rose victorious. Call on Him in faith, believing in Him.

Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, & you shall be saved.
(not just given a chance).

 

[jandian]

The bible saids29 If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

 

[Atwood]

Perfect love casts out fear per 1 John.

Be not afraid!

He has redeemed & He will keep -- trust in the Lord, O troubled soul.

I give them eternal life, & they shall never perish.

The overcomer is promised to never be blotted out of the book; & the overcomer is the one who believes.

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, & you shall be saved (not maybe).

Rest in the Lord. Trust Him . His wounds shall plead for you.

That golden chain interlinks with no gaps & is unbreakable:

he foreknew,
he also foreordained
to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: 30 and whom he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them
he also justified: and whom he justified, them
he also glorified.

 

[Atwood]

Re: ROMANS 3:23 ETC.

VCO made a great post on the crowns (stephanoi, victor's wreaths) which are mentioned in the NT as rewards (not salvation). Those who confuse losing a wreath/crown with loss of salvation (never found in the Bible) are encouraged to read his post in the music forum, of all places.

http://christianchat.com/christian-...ind-christian-music-blesses-your-heart-2.html