A brother from Nairobi, Kenya shares his conviction about the Bible Version Issue

[danschance]

I'm concerned that in John 1:18 and 2 Peter 1:1 the NIV says Jesus Christ is God and the KJV doesn't.

John 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known. (NIV)

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared [him]. (KJV)

2 Pet 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, / To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours: (NIV)

2 Pet 1:1 ¶ Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

OH NO! This proves the KJV has been corrupted!

 

[danschance]

Serious question for all KJV only-ites.

How can the AV 1611 KJV be inspired if it was originally published along with the apocrypha?

 

[danschance]

If I never read the AV KJV but read other versions, can I be saved?

 

[Agricola]

Well the truth bears repeating so that way, you, and others are without excuse. And yep you are without excuse Agricola. Just like the others who defend these modern satanic bibles and attack the King James Bible.

And I will continue to share the truth. Whether you like it or not.

Why do you persist in these claims and lies when you have been told countless times you are wrong and why, but no you continue with the stance it is an attack on the King James Bible. WRONG WRONG WRONG.

This is zealotism which has blinded you to what anyone else says against you or your cult.

NO where have I attacked the King James Bible. I have told you many times I have a King James Bible and use it regularly. I also use the NIV.

This has nothing to do with the King James Bible, just your pathetic cult. I will say it again, this time in larger font as you might then see it through your blinkered eyes.

I LOVE THE KING JAMES BIBLE.

I ONLY HATE THE KING JAMES ONLY CULT AND ITS CLAIMS.

Clear enough?

THe Truth? Its what you think is truth, but its obviously not true, as only a few people follow what you believe, you are a member of a ridiculous evil cult that spreads fear paranioa and threatens people who do not follow, with the wrath of GOd and Christ at judgement day.

EVil and wicked .

 

[DragonSlayer]

OH NO! This proves the KJV has been corrupted!

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared [him]. (KJV)

Wrong ! Why did Praus replace the comma by a semicolon ? It changes everything ! It means the Only begotten Son is God!


In 2 Peter 1:1, it clearly says Jesus is Christ, and Christ is God, so Praus argument is also irrelevant here !

Besides, I'm concerned that Rupert Murdoch, a notorious pornographer, owns the NIV Version :

Did you buy your Bible from Rupert Murdoch?

Murdoch pastor gets heat for mogul’s porn channels

 

[DragonSlayer]

Serious question for all KJV only-ites.

How can the AV 1611 KJV be inspired if it was originally published along with the apocrypha?

The KJV is one of the most ancient and accurate Versions. The " modern " versions like the NIV and the likes are satanic, and we can't rely on satanic versions ! That's it !

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

Santuzza, the new versions contain heresies in them. How do you get the truth when you are going to a bible that has been corrupted? The new versions are based on a totally different Greek text.

It is not good to use the modern versions. The new versions contain an error in the very first verse of Genesis.

In Genesis 1:1, the King James Bible says that:

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. - Genesis 1:1 (King James Bible)

The heaven that was created in Genesis 1:1, was the universe and galaxies. The first heaven which is the atmosphere of the earth was created in Genesis 1:6-8.


Now look at what the new versions do in Genesis 1:1:


New International Version
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

New Living Translation
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

English Standard Version
In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

New American Standard Bible
In the beginning God created theheavens and the earth.


And nearly all the new versions make this subtil change.


Therefore, the new versions contain an error in the very first of Genesis, hence, the new versions turn Genesis 1:1 into a lie.


In Isaiah 14:12, is where we learn the name of Satan before he fell. And his name was Lucifer before his fall. And the King James Bible identifies the devil's identity prior to the fall.

On the contrary, the corrupt modern bible perversions take out Lucifer and replace it with either morning star or day star. Both those titles (morning star and day star) are titles for the Lord Jesus Christ. So according to the new vatican versions, it was not Lucifer who fell, but it was Jesus Christ who fell from heaven.

That one example alone should cause any Christian to be greatly disturbed. Because that corruption which I just showed you Santuzza is a satanic corruption. It is utter blasphemy against the Lord Jesus Christ.


So again, it is not good to use the modern translations. They are perversions. They are satanic counterfeits. If you want the truth, then get yourself a King James Bible. Get that blessed Book with the thee's and the thou's. Amen.

everything you said here is completely wrong...

first of all...the hebrew word in genesis 1:1 is 'shamayim'...the -im ending means it is plural...so the proper translation is 'heavens'...which is why all of the modern bible translations say 'heavens'...

also God did not create the galaxies in genesis 1:1...galaxies are made up of stars and the bible clearly states that the stars were created on day four...in genesis 1:14-19...

also satan's name was never lucifer...the hebrew text calls him 'heylel' which refers to the morning star...'lucifer' is a -latin translation- of 'heylel'...which was carelessly left in the king james version as a proper name instead of being translated into english...

to reemphasize...nobody called satan 'lucifer' until the old testament was translated into latin...it was never his name...just a latin translation of his hebrew title...

 

[Praus]

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared [him]. (KJV)

Wrong ! Why did Praus replace the comma by a semicolon ? It changes everything ! It means the Only begotten Son is God!

You are quoting from an impure and stagnant Oxford KJV. No pure KJV has a comma in that place.

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared [him]. (KJV Pure Cambridge Edition)

John 1:18 No man hath seene God at any time: the onely begotten Sonne, which is in the bosome of the Father, he hath declared him. (KJV 1611)

In 2 Peter 1:1, it clearly says Jesus is Christ, and Christ is God, so Praus argument is also irrelevant here !

That might be true, but it's anathema in the the world of KJV-only. This thread is about KJV-only.

Besides, I'm concerned that Rupert Murdoch, a notorious pornographer, owns the NIV Version :

Did you buy your Bible from Rupert Murdoch?

Murdoch pastor gets heat for mogul’s porn channels

Rupert Murdoch, the owner of Zondervan, publishes the KJV also.

Zondervan - Side by Side Bibles

Are you concerned because you believe that the KJV is a pornographic Bible?

That's easily fixed, brother DragonSlayer, study the Luther Bibel!

Johannes 1:18 Niemand hat Gott je gesehen; der eingeborene Sohn, der in des Vaters Schoß ist, der hat es uns verkündigt. (LUTH1545)

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

Wrong Rachel.

In the 27th edition of the Nestle Aland, right in their introduction, the men and editors behind this critical Greek text tell us in their very own words the purpose for this edition. On page 45, they write:


"The text shared by these two editions was adopted internationally by Bible Societies, and following an agreement between the Vatican and the United Bible Societies it has served as the basis for new translations and for revisions made under their supervision. This marks a significant step with regard to interconfessional relationships. It should naturally be understood that this text is a working text: it is not to be considered as definitive, but as a stimulus to further efforts toward defining and verifying the text of the New Testament."



Hence, the editors openly admit that this critical Greek text is a result of an agreement between the Vatican and the United Bible Societies.

How clear does the evidence have to be? I mean facts are facts.

It is right there for you to see. Also note that they say that the text is not definitive. Which means that they can change it and amend it whenever they wish to. And of course their text has been changing, and will only continue to.

And that is why the text of the modern versions like the NASB and ESV are constantly being changed and revised.


Check out some of the extensive work and documentation brother Will Kinney has done on this issue. It is incredible.


The so called "Science" of modern textual criticism is not even a science at all. It is just wicked men who are changing and perverting the words of God.

well that was very dishonest of you...

if you read the rest of the introduction to the nestle-aland 27th edition...it is clear that the agreement between the vatican and the united bible societies was concluded -after- the nestle-aland 26th edition was finished...basically the roman catholic church finally decided to abandon their strict adherence to the latin vulgate and agreed to use NA26 as their source text for future bible translations...

but nothing in this agreement gave the vatican any say in what the text of NA26 contained...because NA26 was already completed...

the vatican did not have any say in what the text of the nestle-aland 27th edition contained either...because as the rest of the introduction to NA27 makes clear...NA27 has the same text as NA26...the only difference is a revised critical apparatus...

so to summarize...the roman catholic church had no influence on the text that the modern bibles are translated from...while the idolized version on the other hand is based mostly on a text compiled by a roman catholic from texts held in roman catholic monasteries...so it is not only false but hypocritical for you to call the modern bible translations 'vatican bibles'

 

[Praus]

The KJV is one of the most ancient and accurate Versions. The " modern " versions like the NIV and the likes are satanic, and we can't rely on satanic versions ! That's it !

We know it's ancient and accurate, that's why the Vatican loves it so much, because the KJV supports their doctrine of indulgences.

Tobit 12:8 Praier is good with fasting, and almes and righteousnesse: a little with righteousnes is better then much with vnrighteousnesse: it is better to giue almes then to lay vp gold. 9 For almes doth deliuer from death, and shall purge away all sinne. Those that exercise almes, and righteousnesse, shall be filled with life. (KJV 1611)

The NIV would actually be a much better Bible for Switzerland than the KJV. What do you think brother DragonSlayer?

James 2:3 And yee haue respect to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say vnto him, Sit thou here in a good place: and say to the poore, Stand thou there, or sit here vnder my footstoole: (KJV 1611)

Ancient and accurate:

The Swiss Guard - The Uniform of the Swiss Guards

 

[Trax]

Yep. Satan wants the hardest translation to read to be the one we consider inspired. ...and at the same time lets say all the modern English bibles are corrupted by pagan lesbians and New Agers.

LOL

What a joke.

Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood
hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Flesh and blood = your brain. How easy to read, a Bible is made, has absolutely no
bearing on the individual's ability to understand spiritual things. But, people go for
the "easy to read", thinking they can by pass the Spirit of God, and do it themselves.
They make the claim, "I can't understand the KJV." You wont understand NASB, NIV,
or any of them. People deceive themselves into thinking they'll gain more wisdom
from an easier to read Bible.

1Co 2:12-14 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we
might know the things that are freely given to us of God. (13) Which things also we speak, not in the
words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with
spiritual. (14) But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness
unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[Agricola]

. But, people go for the "easy to read", thinking they can by pass the Spirit of God, and do it themselves.
They make the claim, "I can't understand the KJV." You wont understand NASB, NIV,
or any of them. People deceive themselves into thinking they'll gain more wisdom
from an easier to read Bible.

You base this on what facts? People do struggle with the archiac nature of the King James, that is a fact. People read NIV etc because its modern English. Even using the Corrupted Cambridge edition the words are still archiac. People reading a a genuine 1611 will struggle immensely, especially dyslexics. Where do you get this ridiculous notion that people who read other versions think they are gaining more wisdom.

Anyway According to the cult member Chosenbyhim, NIV and all other satanic bibles coming after the King James 1611 are actually HARDER to read then the King James, as the NIV etc dose not score very well on the Flesch Kincaid scale,, but the King James does.

SO what is it, the NIV is an easy read or a hard read? you both cannot be right.

ANyway, as you point out, its a spiritual thing, all Bible versions are just books to a non-belever, but with Holy Spirit, things are shown and pointed out. As I said previously, I have known Holy Spirit for over 30 years and Holy Spirit has never red flagged other Bible versions and has not told me to burn the NIV and stop using it and just go back to reading King James.

So taking this further, if its Spirit based and not "brain" flesh and blood stuff, dosnt that apply also to the King James of 1611? After all this version is just a book as well? JEsus does not point out that we dont have to bother as in 1600 years after his resurection we will have a "perfect Bible" that will negate the need for spirit?

 

[12tribes1King]

[video=youtube_share;gGWQx5z6-Xs]http://youtu.be/gGWQx5z6-Xs[/video]
This video gives a decent description of how the King James version of the bible came into existence, and a lot of other bibles. I learned a lot from it but if I were to take this information and say that through the reading of the KJV bible is the only way to receive the "Good News" and be saved I would be making a great error.13 years ago, before I was saved by Grace, I read the NIV. When I read the NIV then at 20 years old I had made the choice to read that particular bible because the KJV was almost incomprehensible to my understanding and the NIV seemed to be written in a language that I could understand so I read it and for 3 years after being saved by Grace, I continued to read it. However, for the last 4 years I have been reading the KJV and I will continue to read it and quote from it. I don't think that the KJV is the only way to receive the "Good News" about Christ either as the "Good News" was verbally preached by the apostles and disciples of Christ for several years prior to the book of Matthew being written and people who received that same "Good News" verbally were saved hearing and believing it with no New testament Gospel book yet written, as witnessed here in Acts 2:41"Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls" . It appears that the "Good News" of Christ has not been lost in the translation by some of the different versions of the bible in context when we look at the four Gospels (Mark,Matthew,Luke,John) regardless of the received text or majority text origins. There have been many words added,changed and many taken out completely in some versions of the bible but the "Good News" message of Christ remains the same in context in the majority of them.

John 3:16

New International Version
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

New Living Translation
"For God loved the world so much that he gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life.

English Standard Version
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

New American Standard Bible
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

King James Bible
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
"For God loved the world in this way: He gave His One and Only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish but have eternal life.

International Standard Version
"For this is how God loved the world: He gave his unique Son so that everyone who believes in him might not be lost but have eternal life.

NET Bible
For this is the way God loved the world: He gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
For God loved the world in this way: so much that he would give up his Son, The Only One, so that everyone who trusts in him shall not be lost, but he shall have eternal life.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
God loved the world this way: He gave his only Son so that everyone who believes in him will not die but will have eternal life.

Jubilee Bible 2000
For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

King James 2000 Bible
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

American King James Version
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

American Standard Version
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life.

Douay-Rheims Bible
For God so loved the world, as to give his only begotten Son; that whosoever believeth in him, may not perish, but may have life everlasting.

Darby Bible Translation
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only-begotten Son, that whosoever believes on him may not perish, but have life eternal.

English Revised Version
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life.

Webster's Bible Translation
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only-begotten Son, that whoever believeth in him, should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Weymouth New Testament
For so greatly did God love the world that He gave His only Son, that every one who trusts in Him may not perish but may have the Life of Ages.

World English Bible
For God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

Young's Literal Translation
for God did so love the world, that His Son -- the only begotten -- He gave, that every one who is believing in him may not perish, but may have life age-during.

 

[santuzza]

Chosenbyhim, did you not read my post in its entirety? I said I use several translations. I did not say I use several NEW translations. I use the KJV, I use the NIV, I use the ESV, I use the NASB, I use the NKJV. But guess what? I also use the Coverdale Bible (which pre-dates KJV). So your argument holds no water whatsoever. One would be FOOLISH to rely on one translation only.

I'm sorry, but as much as I like the KJV and find it very accurate and well-written, I'm not going to use that as my one and only translation. That does not make me a heathen or otherwise unsaved.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

This part of your post indicates to me that you have a serious spiritual problem and possibly a religious demon.

The Holy Spirit has never onced ever told me to read the KJV only. I think it might be possible that you are turning the AV KJV into an idol. I sure hope that is not the case. Please do me a favor and never claim I am going to hell because I reject the idea that God has divinely inspired the KJV over any and all others.

What are non-English speaking Christians going to read?

Well the reason for becoming KJV Only is simply because the King James Bible is the perfect and preserved pure word of God. Another reason to become KJV Only is because of the corruptions which are in the modern versions. Some of the corruptions are attacks on the simple doctrine of salvation. Another one of the corruptions of the modern versions is their attack on the Godhead (trinity), and one of their most blatant attacks is their attack on the deity of the Lord Jesus Christ.

So those two reasons I just gave you for becoming KJV only, for becoming a King James Bible believer are valid. And if you want to know one of the internal witenesses showing God's handywork on the King James Bible, it is the numerical codes and patterns which are found within its text. Look up the King James Code and Bible Numerics, it is a very fascinating study.

Also Danschance, I have never said that a Christian would not go to heaven if he did not read from the King James Version only.

The Bible Version Issue is not a salvation issue. I have said this before several times. What determines whether a person will go to heaven or not is whether that person accepts the Lord Jesus Christ as their Lord and Saviour. And what you also need to understand Danschance is that once you get saved, you cannot lose your salvation. You are sealed unto the day of redemption (Eph. 4:30). Salvation is not yours to lose. Salvation is of the Lord, and you were bought with a price. The Lord purchased you with His own blood (Acts 20:28).

Now in the Bible Version Debate and Issue, a question very similiar to yours has been asked a lot I am sure, and that is a good question. What foreign translations can a non English speaking Christian read?

Well here are some reliable foreign language bibles that a non-English speaking christian can read:

The Spanish Reina Valera 1909, the French Louis Segond Bible, the Russian Synodal translation, Martin Luther's German Bible, and any other foreign Bible translation that is translated from the same Hebrew and Greek texts that the King James Bible is based on.


People in foreign countries from all over the world are beginning to learn the Bible Version Issue. As you could see from the video in the original post, Nairobi, Kenya is one of those countries. The United Kingdom is another country where the Bible Version Issue is gaining attention. There is a couple over there who started a good Bible believing ministry and outreach. Its called Time For Truth. You can visit their website by clicking on this link:

Time for Truth

Its a great ministry that stands for the Authorized Version.

And in India, there is a Bible believing preacher by the name of Lordson Roch. I post a lot of his videos over in the Indian Forum. He has a lot of good sermons. He stands for the Authorized King James Bible. And he also began a Bible believing ministry. He is the pastor at Grace and Truth Baptist church of Goa. You can check it out by clicking on the following link:

Grace & Truth Baptist Church - Home

 

[GingerFollowerofChrist]

I wanted to comment on this page to say that the KJV is NOT perfect and that if you don't believe me why do you think they switched the book of Jacob, commonly known as James, to James? If you don't believe me look it up for yourself. From what i know they changed it to honor their "king". The " King James Version". Why do you think it's called that? It's His VERSION. NOT the original word of God. No matter how bad a certain denomination wants it to be it aint.

 

[danschance]

The KJV is one of the most ancient and accurate Versions. The " modern " versions like the NIV and the likes are satanic, and we can't rely on satanic versions ! That's it !

That is a classic case of a straw man argument!

The KJV is a good version and I if you want to read it, that is fine with me. However, you have not proved your case that modern versions are satanic. Please provide facts which support your claim that modern versions are satanic.

 

[danschance]

I wanted to comment on this page to say that the KJV is NOT perfect and that if you don't believe me why do you think they switched the book of Jacob, commonly known as James, to James? If you don't believe me look it up for yourself. From what i know they changed it to honor their "king". The " King James Version". Why do you think it's called that? It's His VERSION. NOT the original word of God. No matter how bad a certain denomination wants it to be it aint.

Great post. I learned something new. James = Jacob in the New Testament. This means the KJV switched the name to honor a king but not the King of Kings. Then from that point on we all call Jacob James. That means the influence of the King James has caused error in modern bible translations! Wow....that is a switch.

 

[Graybeard]

Well the truth bears repeating so that way, you, and others are without excuse.

so...I can conclude that because the KJV is the only God inspired Word, then we English speaking people are The chosen ones, The Elect....all other Nations that do not speak or read English are doomed for Hell...unless of course they repent of their Devil languages and learn English then they will be saved........

 

[Praus]

Another one of the corruptions of the modern versions is their attack on the Godhead (trinity),

Let's look at 1 John 5:7

1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. (KJV Pure Cambridge Edition)

1 John 5:7 For there are three that testify: 8 the a Spirit, ... (NIV)

Here's the footnote from the NIV:

a 8 Late manuscripts of the Vulgate testify in heaven: the Father, the Word and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one. 8 And there are three that testify on earth: the (not found in any Greek manuscript before the fourteenth century)

The KJV follows the Clementine Vulgate (Biblia Sacra Vulgatæ Editionis Sixti Quinti Pontificis Maximi iussu recognita atque edita) and the Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition, the Vatican-approved Bible and the NIV does not.

1 John 5:7 And there are three who give testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost. And these three are one. (DRA)

Epistula I Ioannis 5:7 Quoniam tres sunt, qui testimonium dant in caelo: Pater, Verbum, et Spiritus Sanctus: et hi tres unum sunt.

ChosenByDaPope, this is not the first time you are surreptitiously promoting Catholicism here on CC.

http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...-about-bible-version-issue-2.html#post1169937

Both the NIV and the KJV affirm the Trinity, once we get away from all that Catholic baggage that you want to impose on the rest of us.

2 Cor 13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, [be] with you all. Amen. (KJV PCE)

2 Cor 13:14 May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. (NIV)

Matt 28:19 ¶ Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: (KJV PCE)

Matt 28:19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, (NIV)

And in India, there is a Bible believing preacher by the name of Lordson Roch. I post a lot of his videos over in the Indian Forum. He has a lot of good sermons. He stands for the Authorized King James Bible. And he also began a Bible believing ministry. He is the pastor at Grace and Truth Baptist church of Goa. You can check it out by clicking on the following link:

Goa has been Catholic since the early 16th century and there's Catholic shrine like every 0.5 km on the main roads.

Goan Catholics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia