To all of you non flat earthers.

[Timtofly]

FE cannot settle that point i made
"Its own tiny orbit"... Thats different to what FE says and makes no sense...
FE says there is only one orbit around the north star.

Im watching the crux to the south in front of me...
Brazilians are watching the crux to the south behind me...
View attachment 228369
And many others are watching it from all different angles... That 25 degrees doesn't not account for people seeing it behind me
The way it points, its orientation, its elevation are all irrelevant to this fact

Optical illusion is actually the only way one can explain it... An optical illusion that cannot be demonstrated
Its similar to what Moses said...

How about this then... On the FE model we should be able to see the dipper, but we can't...
Why not???

Because the firmament is also flat. Flat and does not move. The stars move around like clockwork. Which brings up the more impossible point than even you made. How can the area of influence of the crux be only seen on the outer "edge" at the same time?

And you never addressed the point that on a BE the earth spins twice as fast under the crux. That point is given in all the articles I have read, not my imagination. That means that it travels around the edge of a FE twice as fast as the sun does. Thus giving the illusion it is always there.

 

[Timtofly]

Stars which are in the South celestial hemisphere are never in the North celestial hemisphere, and vice-versa. The tilt of the Earth is stable, and the North Star is always effectively "up" from the North hemisphere of the Earth. Similarly, the Southern Cross is always "up" from the South hemisphere.

From PC123's diagrams and explanations, I suspect that the Southern Cross is useful to navigators in a different way than the North Star is. The latter's angle above horizontal always tells the observer their own latitude; at the North pole, the North star is at nadir (vertical); at 45 degrees North latitude, the North star is at 45 degrees to the horizontal, etc. That is only possible if the North star is sufficiently far away from Earth; a flat earth model where the stars are part of the "firmament" and only about 3,000 miles above the surface is unworkable, because the angle to horizontal at the equator would be about 26 degrees, not 0 degrees.

According to history, the crux can be seen in Jerusalem every 20,000 years. It was last seen as a daily visitor 2000 years ago, and is not due back in 18,000 years. But what do the experts know? How do you know how far away the firmament is?

The whole creation size should be able to be known if one knew how to calculate 8000 years as the 4th dimension of time as a factor to the length, depth, and height. It would be a cube, and time along with the length of the equator gives us some clues. But we still do not know how high each level is, or if they are perfect 3rds. Heaven, earth, and under the earth being the 3 levels. The firmament is not heaven, but part of earth.

 

[Dino246]

According to history, the crux can be seen in Jerusalem every 20,000 years. It was last seen as a daily visitor 2000 years ago, and is not due back in 18,000 years. But what do the experts know? How do you know how far away the firmament is?

The whole creation size should be able to be known if one knew how to calculate 8000 years as the 4th dimension of time as a factor to the length, depth, and height. It would be a cube, and time along with the length of the equator gives us some clues. But we still do not know how high each level is, or if they are perfect 3rds. Heaven, earth, and under the earth being the 3 levels. The firmament is not heaven, but part of earth.

How about we focus on observable measurements, not theoretical hypotheses that cannot be measured.

 

[Dino246]

And you never addressed the point that on a BE the earth spins twice as fast under the crux. That point is given in all the articles I have read, not my imagination. That means that it travels around the edge of a FE twice as fast as the sun does. Thus giving the illusion it is always there.

Huh? How could part of the Earth spin twice as fast as another part? That’s physically impossible.

 

[Gideon300]

The best I can do at the moment...

Utterly unconvincing. The primary problem remains. If the earth is flat and a disk, it has an edge. If it has no edge, it is infinite, which is contrary to God's word. If it has an edge, someone has seen it at sometime. I'm still waiting for that individual to speak up. Aircraft fly high above the earth. They could see the end of a flat earth. Are you going to tell me that every pilot is involved in a cover up? Ships don't sail off the end of the earth, aircraft don't disappear into whatever is past the edge of the earth and explorers do not come back claiming that the earth has an edge. One way or another, I've traveled much of the earth's surface. It is a globe. I don't know why people persist in such an obvious fallacy.

At least one person has lost his life attempting to prove that the earth is flat. It's up there with skydiving without a parachute as a dumb way to die.

 

[surfer14]

my parents are Portuguese... Good surf there in Portugal.

YES! Portugal is fantastic. I've surfed there. Awesome surf. Awesome food. I loved the people! Clean. I'd go back in a heartbeat.

 

[Timtofly]

Huh? How could part of the Earth spin twice as fast as another part? That’s physically impossible.

Then the crux orbits around the north pole twice as fast as the sun does.

Someone claimed the earth rotated once a day under the crux. But that would be impossible to rotate twice as fast for the crux as for the sun. So the only explanation is that the crux orbits the north pole. It cannot orbit the south pole. No star system can rotate that fast through space even by current theory.

 

[Dino246]

Then the crux orbits around the north pole twice as fast as the sun does.

Someone claimed the earth rotated once a day under the crux. But that would be impossible to rotate twice as fast for the crux as for the sun. So the only explanation is that the crux orbits the north pole. It cannot orbit the south pole. No star system can rotate that fast through space even by current theory.

Um, no. Methinks you misread something somewhere. The Earth rotates once per day; its rotation defines a day.

Because the Earth rotates once per day, everything visible in space appears to move across the sky once each 24-hour period (other than artificial satellites). That goes for objects in either celestial hemisphere.

 

[GaryA]

How silly are we sometimes? And how much stick do we give each other? All in good fun

You give each other sticks?

Do you see who can give the biggest stick or the most sticks?

Do you find ways to give a stick that will make it stick in the memory of another? And, make them want to stick around to see if they might receive another stick?



Oh - I'm pretty sure you meant 'shtick' - right?

(In a way, sorta-kinda like the buffoonery that this post is full of...?)

 

[Timtofly]

Um, no. Methinks you misread something somewhere. The Earth rotates once per day; its rotation defines a day.

Because the Earth rotates once per day, everything visible in space appears to move across the sky once each 24-hour period (other than artificial satellites). That goes for objects in either celestial hemisphere.

The crux can tell the time at any hour of the day, unless that is a lie.

There are 24 hours in a day. A clock only has 12 of those hours.

That means the crux is at each point on the clock twice. Which means that it has to do a circle twice a day. How does it do that circle twice as fast as the sun does?

 

[PC123]

And you never addressed the point that on a BE the earth spins twice as fast under the crux.

Im sorry brother but thats another erroneous claim...
It takes the crux 24 hours to do a full rotation
It takes the dipper 24 hours to do a full rotation

 

[Blade]

Lets see when you leave out verses that do not talk about a fait earth and say things from the start like this " Have you ever sat down alone and tried to even read scripture?" Really? Makes me not even want to talk to you.

 

[Dino246]

The crux can tell the time at any hour of the day, unless that is a lie.

There are 24 hours in a day. A clock only has 12 of those hours.

That means the crux is at each point on the clock twice. Which means that it has to do a circle twice a day. How does it do that circle twice as fast as the sun does?

You're jumping to conclusions instead of thinking things through.

Just because some source claims that the crux can tell the time of day, it does not mean that it is like a clock. IF one can use the position of the crux as a time indicator (I don't know whether this is true or not), then it would indicate the time its own way, not necessarily like a clock does.

A standard clock has twelve hours, but you cannot tell whether it is day or night merely by looking at the clock.

The crux is like every other constellation under which the Earth spins once each 24-hour period. Because the crux is near to the celestial pole, its transit will be circular, once each 24-hour period. So, the crux is not at each point on the clock twice, and it doesn't do the circle twice in 24 hours.

Maybe, before you go off on yet another tangent, do some critical thinking with the information you have. Or, get some better information.

 

[Timtofly]

You're jumping to conclusions instead of thinking things through.

Just because some source claims that the crux can tell the time of day, it does not mean that it is like a clock. IF one can use the position of the crux as a time indicator (I don't know whether this is true or not), then it would indicate the time its own way, not necessarily like a clock does.

A standard clock has twelve hours, but you cannot tell whether it is day or night merely by looking at the clock.

The crux is like every other constellation under which the Earth spins once each 24-hour period. Because the crux is near to the celestial pole, its transit will be circular, once each 24-hour period. So, the crux is not at each point on the clock twice, and it doesn't do the circle twice in 24 hours.

Maybe, before you go off on yet another tangent, do some critical thinking with the information you have. Or, get some better information.

Well I guess no one looks for the crux during the day time, who knows?

 

[Dino246]

Well I guess no one looks for the crux during the day time, who knows?

How many constellations can you see when it is daytime in your part of the world?

 

[PC123]

@Timtofly @Dino246 @Moses_Young @GaryA @surfer14

OK guys... How about this one...

Why can't we see the dipper from down here?
And why can't you guys up north see the crux?

Shouldn't we be able to see all the stars if this FE model were correct?

 

[Mark47Oz]

Thankyou for the best laugh I have had in a while!

You're so medieval right now! Next thing you'll be telling us that the sun revolves around the earth.

 

[Gideon300]

The crux can tell the time at any hour of the day, unless that is a lie.

There are 24 hours in a day. A clock only has 12 of those hours.

That means the crux is at each point on the clock twice. Which means that it has to do a circle twice a day. How does it do that circle twice as fast as the sun does?

I have a 24 hour clock. it works just fine. It even says "am" and "pm".

 

[Dino246]

@Timtofly @Dino246 @Moses_Young @GaryA @surfer14

OK guys... How about this one...

Why can't we see the dipper from down here?
And why can't you guys up north see the crux?

Shouldn't we be able to see all the stars if this FE model were correct?

Simple: the Earth not flat.

 

[Timtofly]

@Timtofly @Dino246 @Moses_Young @GaryA @surfer14

OK guys... How about this one...

Why can't we see the dipper from down here?
And why can't you guys up north see the crux?

Shouldn't we be able to see all the stars if this FE model were correct?

The stars work just like the two great lights. No.

Still waiting to prove the crux can or can not be seen at the same time day and night. Because if not then the crux moves in an orbit around the North Pole just like the sun and moon. All have their area of influence.